Greatest Living Racehorse?

[Dunbar]

Originally Posted by RolloTomasi

I only suggested he was vulnerable at classic distances.

As he started just 3 times at 9f or more (and even then only twice around 2 turns), the evidence is certainly scant.

But in the 2004 Woodward, where he was under pressure through fast fractions, Ghostzapper was life and death to edge an, up to that point, unheralded St. Liam.

In 3 of Ghostzapper's last 4 starts, he earned a Beyer speed figure of 122 or more. The only exception was the Woodward, where he recorded at 114.

GZ's 114 in the Woodward shouldn't be taken as any kind of negative move. How many extra lengths did GZ run around the final turn compared to his other route races? I'd have to re-watch the Woodward, but I think 6-8 extra lengths is a conservative estimate. How many Beyer points do 6-8 lengths translate to? 10-13? If so, then the 114 is the equivalent of a sweet-trip 124-127, which is on a par with GZ's other routes.

--Dunbar

[ateamstupid]

Originally Posted by Dunbar

GZ's 114 in the Woodward shouldn't be taken as any kind of negative move. How many extra lengths did GZ run around the final turn compared to his other route races? I'd have to re-watch the Woodward, but I think 6-8 extra lengths is a conservative estimate. How many Beyer points do 6-8 lengths translate to? 10-13? If so, then the 114 is the equivalent of a sweet-trip 124-127, which is on a par with GZ's other routes.

--Dunbar

spoken like someone who actually watched the race.

For the last time, Ghostzapper's running style was not headstrong or stubborn. His only quirk was that he didn't like dirt in his face. He was forwardly placed in his three route races (only one of which he led at first call) because it made sense in all three. In a race with a ton of quality speed, he could be taken off the pace so long as he was kept in the clear. This is apparent to anybody who has watched him run.

[RolloTomasi]

Originally Posted by ateamstupid

For the last time, Ghostzapper's running style was not headstrong or stubborn. His only quirk was that he didn't like dirt in his face. He was forwardly placed in his three route races (only one of which he led at first call) because it made sense in all three. In a race with a ton of quality speed, he could be taken off the pace so long as he was kept in the clear. This is apparent to anybody who has watched him run.

Of course, no one ever said he was "headstrong" or "stubborn".

Nevertheless, please explain why it made sense for Ghostzapper to be up on the engine between St. Liam (12-1) and Presidentialaffair (37-1)--never mind Midway Road's brief 1/4 mile effort--through fractions of :45+ and 1:08+ in the Woodward if he could be positioned anywhere in a race (so long as he was in the clear, of course).

[Indian Charlie]

Originally Posted by RolloTomasi

Of course, no one ever said he was "headstrong" or "stubborn".

Nevertheless, please explain why it made sense for Ghostzapper to be up on the engine between St. Liam (12-1) and Presidentialaffair (37-1)--never mind Midway Road's brief 1/4 mile effort--through fractions of :45+ and 1:08+ in the Woodward if he could be positioned anywhere in a race (so long as he was in the clear, of course).

Give it up Rollo.

GZ had some Zenyatta fan like fans in his day that you could not discuss anything logically with.

I say that in the sense that I still believe GZ was an awesome horse, nor do I think the GZ fans were nearly as bad as the Zenyatta fans.

[The Indomitable DrugS]

Originally Posted by Indian Charlie

Give it up Rollo.

GZ had some Zenyatta fan like fans in his day that you could not discuss anything logically with.

I say that in the sense that I still believe GZ was an awesome horse, nor do I think the GZ fans were nearly as bad as the Zenyatta fans.

Well - Thoro-Graph did have him about 28 lengths faster than Alysheba.

[RockHardTen1985]

I think the greatest living racehorse is Indian Charlie, hands down.