Obama's support for Ground Zero Mosque

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by Riot

Baloney. They were Al-Qaeda. A violent extremist fringe group. No matter how hard you try to spin it otherwise.

Which has perhaps hundreds of thousands of members worldwide, including in the US, virtually all of which are Muslims. They also have the support of a wide swath of the Muslim world. Can you tell me by sight who is a violent muslim member of Al Queda and who is a peaceful muslim? Is there a Christian fringe group the size or scope of Al Queda?

[Riot]

Which has perhaps hundreds of thousands of members worldwide, including in the US, virtually all of which are Muslims.

Um ... you'd better google Al Quaeda.

[Antitrust32]

Originally Posted by Riot

Um ... you'd better google Al Quaeda.

you'd be better off google-ing STFU

[Riot]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

Can you tell me by sight who is a violent muslim member of Al Queda and who is a peaceful muslim?

Can you tell me by sight who is a violent abortion doctor-killing Christian and who is a peaceful Christian?

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by Riot

Can you tell me by sight who is a violent abortion doctor-killing Christian and who is a peaceful Christian?

Sure. a few are in jail and the rest are peaceful. Comparing a handful of violent right wing extremists and a world wide terror network is a stretch.

It is the sign of desperation to try to compare self-avowed enemies of the country and a handful of domestic looneys.

[Riot]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

Sure. a few are in jail and the rest are peaceful. Comparing a handful of violent right wing extremists and a world wide terror network is a stretch.

It is the sign of desperation to try to compare self-avowed enemies of the country and a handful of domestic looneys.

Naw. It's a sign of desperation to try and make the ridiculous argument that millions of people around the world, in multiple countries - including millions of your fellow Americans - are no different from Al-Quaeda terrorists just because they they share the grossest broad generality of being of, "the same religion"

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by Riot

Naw. It's a sign of desperation to try and make the ridiculous argument that millions of people around the world, in multiple countries - including millions of your fellow Americans - are no different from Al-Quaeda terrorists just because they they share the grossest broad generality of being of, "the same religion"

But we arent talking about millions around the world. We are talking about one specific site which was created by muslim terrorists hence the push against the mosques location. Trying to say that everyone who is against the site is racist or believes all muslims to be terrorists is typical drivel.

[Riot]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

But we arent talking about millions around the world. We are talking about one specific site which was created by muslim terrorists hence the push against the mosques location. Trying to say that everyone who is against the site is racist or believes all muslims to be terrorists is typical drivel.

Then it's a good thing I didn't say that, Mr. Disingenuous.

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by Riot

Then it's a good thing I didn't say that, Mr. Disingenuous.

You can call me all the names that you want. Especially when they hardly fit.



dis·in·gen·u·ous–adjective
lacking in frankness, candor, or sincerity; falsely or hypocritically ingenuous; insincere


Think of me as you may but there are few situations in which I do not speak frankly, without candor or with no sincerity. Actually I would probably be considered too "genuous" if anything.

[dellinger63]

Originally Posted by Riot

Can you tell me by sight who is a violent abortion doctor-killing Christian and who is a peaceful Christian?

That's Obama/Carter kinda of reasoning/understanding

More girls jumping rope have been killed in Chicago this year than abortion Dr.'s nationwide.

[Cannon Shell]

Since when does freedom of religion extend the right to practice said religion any location they want? So if i run out on the field at a Phillies game but carry a prayer rug they will stop the game so I can pray to mecca and won't tase me? This has little to do with freedom of religion. It has a lot to do with the location of a building. That and an attempt (quite successful I might add) to garner as much publicity as possible.

[Riot]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

Since when does freedom of religion extend the right to practice said religion on private property?

Fixed that for you.

You guys should have quit when you were ahead.

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by Riot

Fixed that for you.

You guys should have quit when you were ahead.

We were far enough ahead to look back a few times to let you catch up

[dellinger63]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

We were far enough ahead to look back a few times to let you catch up

she was lapped and is now going backwards trying to catch up, on the Oklahoma track with the great Eusebio Razo on her back.

[timmgirvan]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

We were far enough ahead to look back a few times to let you catch up

well, you have to admit she's a "trier'!

[Danzig]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

Since when does freedom of religion extend the right to practice said religion any location they want? So if i run out on the field at a Phillies game but carry a prayer rug they will stop the game so I can pray to mecca and won't tase me? This has little to do with freedom of religion. It has a lot to do with the location of a building. That and an attempt (quite successful I might add) to garner as much publicity as possible.

it might start with the fact they own the property.

people look at this county and want to live here. we're supposed to stand for something here. people think they can come here for a better life, we're supposed to be almost a utopia. but because a fringe group of radical nutjobs did a horrific thing, no one who has a tie to the religion that group was supposedly practicing can live in peace? worship the way they wish? are you saying that a religion who has a criminal element should all be tarred with the same brush? should we tail all catholic priests, assuming they all have nefarious plans? if you say they have a right, i'm not quite sure why you're still arguing this point at all? because the majority is having a kneejerk, bigoted reaction, that makes it right? it's why you're supposed to use logic, not feelings. now, if osama bin laden wanted to build a place for his followers a couple blocks from ground zero, i can see having an issue. people not breaking the law and wanting to practice their religion peacably should be left alone. my god, we sound like hateful religions zealots on this issue-you know like the enemy...some righteous line being taken on this matter, it's embarrassing. are we not smart enough to know where a line is crossed? building a mosque is crossing a line?

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by Danzig

it might start with the fact they own the property.

people look at this county and want to live here. we're supposed to stand for something here. people think they can come here for a better life, we're supposed to be almost a utopia. but because a fringe group of radical nutjobs did a horrific thing, no one who has a tie to the religion that group was supposedly practicing can live in peace? worship the way they wish? are you saying that a religion who has a criminal element should all be tarred with the same brush? should we tail all catholic priests, assuming they all have nefarious plans? if you say they have a right, i'm not quite sure why you're still arguing this point at all? because the majority is having a kneejerk, bigoted reaction, that makes it right? it's why you're supposed to use logic, not feelings. now, if osama bin laden wanted to build a place for his followers a couple blocks from ground zero, i can see having an issue. people not breaking the law and wanting to practice their religion peacably should be left alone. my god, we sound like hateful religions zealots on this issue-you know like the enemy...some righteous line being taken on this matter, it's embarrassing. are we not smart enough to know where a line is crossed? building a mosque is crossing a line?

I am using logic. Don't you think this mosque is going to be a hotspot for all kinds of protests and possible attacks? Is it right for the people in this neighborhood to be forced to have their own lives put more at risk? Especially when there are already hundreds of other places available? At some point aren't the rights of others that are negatively effected by the stubborness and insensitivty of these people protected as well? And please explain to me how you, me or anyone else can tell the difference between a mosque built by supporters of Al Queda or one built by non supporters? You have heard that the guys who originally bombed the WTC were locals (NJ) right?

As I have stated many times in this thread we aren't denying the right to build, nor are we saying that the intentions of the people of this mosque will be anything but peaceful, but that the location is a bad idea and people who don't understand why are simply not seeing the reality of the situation. Muslims terrorists have twice attacked this area, killing thousands of people. A Muslim terrorist attempted to bomb a car recently about 40 blocks away. Why anyone would be surprised that people are wary of a mosque being built there is amazing.

[brianwspencer]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

I am using logic. Don't you think this mosque is going to be a hotspot for all kinds of protests and possible attacks? Is it right for the people in this neighborhood to be forced to have their own lives put more at risk? Especially when there are already hundreds of other places available?

I don't think your points are bad at all, I just disagree entirely, but the point above IS bad, IS terrible logic, and shouldn't hold any weight at all.

You're saying that if they build a mosque, some people will protest it or possibly attack it, so they shouldn't build it? It's been approved....by the people in the neighborhood, so you probably don't need to worry about them too much.

If people attack it, they're criminals and should be treated as such -- and therefore, you've got a criminal problem that is not the fault of the people building the mosque. And mosques have been attacked and vandalized in other states as well, so that holds no water whatsoever.

"Some people might break the law in retaliation" is not an argument for not building the mosque there. It's like saying we shouldn't build highways because some people might speed on it and endanger those are not breaking the law.

[SCUDSBROTHER]

Originally Posted by Danzig

it might start with the fact they own the property.

people look at this county and want to live here. we're supposed to stand for something here. people think they can come here for a better life, we're supposed to be almost a utopia. but because a fringe group of radical nutjobs did a horrific thing, no one who has a tie to the religion that group was supposedly practicing can live in peace? worship the way they wish? are you saying that a religion who has a criminal element should all be tarred with the same brush?

Well, they do all go by what the same butcher had to say. I'd like to hear them make an effort to separate themselves from the terrorists, rather than you doing it. This Imam has said that America was partially to blame for 9/11. Right there, you should have a problem with this, but you don't. See, he won't come out and say the scum in his religion were wrong, and they are to blame.

[Danzig]

Originally Posted by SCUDSBROTHER

Well, they do all go by what the same butcher had to say. I'd like to hear them make an effort to separate themselves from the terrorists, rather than you doing it. This Imam has said that America was partially to blame for 9/11. Right there, you should have a problem with this, but you don't. See, he won't come out and say the scum in his religion were wrong, and they are to blame.

i don't? when did i say that? that would be like saying a robbed bank was partially at fault because they had all that money and were asking for it.
and i have seen where members of that religion have spoken out against the terrorist acts, but you keep ignoring that. not once have you conceded that point, accepted that it has happened.


but you're right about zoning. if there is no other similar building in that area, the city can re-zone. whether they can do so and get away with it, i don't know. if other religious buildings are in that area, they haven't got a leg to stand on in that regard.