Top Thoroughbreds (2000 to present)

[Indian Charlie]

Originally Posted by Calzone Lord

2yo Male: Uncle Mo, War Pass, Macho Uno, Stevie Wonderboy
2yo Female: Tempera, Storm Flag Flying, Halfbrideld, My Miss Aurelia
2yo Turf Male: Barbaro, Peace Rules, Interactif, Cowboy Cal
2yo Turf Female: Dreaming of Anna, J'Ray, Fantastic Filly, Winter Memories
2yo Male Sprinter: Officer, Came Home, Afleet Alex, Roman Ruler
2yo Female Sprinter: Cashier's Dream, Beholder, You, Hot Dixie Chick,

3yo Male: Smarty Jones, Tiznow, Point Given, Bernardini
3yo Female: Rachel Alexandra, Rags To Riches, Blind Luck, Royal Delta
3yo Turf Male: Kitten's Joy, Conduit, High Chaparral, Rock Of Gibraltor,
3yo Turf Female: Banks Hill, Ouija Board, Goldikova, Six Perfections
3yo Male Sprinter: Caller One, Squirtle Squirt, Lost In The Fog, Cajun Beat
3yo Female Sprinter: Xtra Heat, Indian Blessing, Madcap Escapade, Lady Tak
Older Male: Ghostzapper, Mineshaft, Medaglia D' Oro, Congaree
Older Female: Zenyatta, Azeri, Havre De Grace, Riboletta,
Older Turf Male: Fantastic Light, Leroidesanemeaux, Wise Dan, English Channel,
Older Turf Female: Godikova, Ouija Board, Golden Apples, Voodoo Dancer
Older Male Sprinter: Kona Gold, Midnight Lute, Swept Overboard, Fabulous Strike
Older Female Sprinter: Groupie Doll, Xtra Heat, Honest Lady, Informed Decision,

Originally Posted by Calzone Lord

Indian Charlie's list would be made up of mostly all cripples. Which is fine, if you don't consider durability an important trait.

Kind of like the horses above in bold?

[Calzone Lord]

Originally Posted by Indian Charlie

Kind of like the horses above in bold?

No.

For starters ... Uncle Mo, War Pass, and Stevie Wonderboy were healthy for their entire 2yo season.

Only an idiot considers the after career when they rate 2-year-olds.

You rate 2yo's on 2yo form.

[Danzig]

if you're going to list gz, i guess you could also include candy ride. he had 11 lifetime starts, not a picture of good health and soundness.

[Calzone Lord]

Originally Posted by Danzig

if you're going to list gz, i guess you could also include candy ride. he had 11 lifetime starts, not a picture of good health and soundness.

Ghostzapper is going to be rated a clear-cut #1 on the list of anyone with any credibility.

He has five sensational races from five starts as an older horse...ranging from 7f to 10f ... shipped from New York, to New Jersey, to Texas.

Candy Ride's alw win on dirt was nothing special. His turf win was very good, but hardly great. His Pacific Classic was his breakout race. He never returned after it.

[Calzone Lord]

Here is the contrast between Ghostzapper and Candy Ride:

Ghostzapper:



He got herded out to the hotdog stand by Saint Liam in the Woodward and probably would have been the winner via DQ had he not won the race. It was a LONG way back to 3rd.


Candy Ride:



An alw race, a turf race, a huge Pacific Classic win in a small field and he never came back from it.

[Indian Charlie]

Originally Posted by Calzone Lord

Here is the contrast between Ghostzapper and Candy Ride:

Ghostzapper:



He got herded out to the hotdog stand by Saint Liam in the Woodward and probably would have been the winner via DQ had he not won the race. It was a LONG way back to 3rd.


Candy Ride:



An alw race, a turf race, a huge Pacific Classic win in a small field and he never came back from it.

Please show these PPs again but include the first three finishers.

[Calzone Lord]

Originally Posted by Indian Charlie

Please show these PPs again but include the first three finishers.

Ghostzapper's wins:

Met Mile over Silver Wagon and Sir Shackleton

BC Classic over Roses in May and Pleasantly Perfect

Woodword over Saint Liam and Bowman's Band (Groupie Doll's sire)

Iselin over Presidentialaffair and Zoffinger

Tom Fool over Aggadan and Unforgettable Max


Candy Ride's wins:

Pacific Classic win over Medaglia D' Oro and Fleetstreet Dancer.

American Handicap win over Special Ring and Irish Warrior

Alw race over Primerica and Bonus Pay Day

[golfer]

Originally Posted by Calzone Lord

Here is the contrast between Ghostzapper and Candy Ride:

Ghostzapper:



He got herded out to the hotdog stand by Saint Liam in the Woodward and probably would have been the winner via DQ had he not won the race. It was a LONG way back to 3rd.


Candy Ride:



An alw race, a turf race, a huge Pacific Classic win in a small field and he never came back from it.

Ghostzapper's races are OBVIOUSLY better, as charts are in LARGE, EASY TO READ print. Candy Ride, I have to squint and use a magnifying glass

[Calzone Lord]

Originally Posted by golfer

Ghostzapper's races are OBVIOUSLY better, as charts are in LARGE, EASY TO READ print. Candy Ride, I have to squint and use a magnifying glass

I sent Indian Charlie a ton of PP's for good foreign horses. My computer crashed a few months later. He has them and I don't.

This is all I have left for Candy Ride:

[Indian Charlie]

Originally Posted by Calzone Lord

No.

For starters ... Uncle Mo, War Pass, and Stevie Wonderboy were healthy for their entire 2yo season.

Only an idiot considers the after career when they rate 2-year-olds.

You rate 2yo's on 2yo form.

I forgot about this gem.

How can you be confident in that? Uncle Mo had three starts as a 2yo, one of which was a msw.

Stevie Wonderboy was not a sound horse at all.

War Pass? Do you think he suddenly became unsound when January 1 rolled around?

Speaking of War Pass, has he sired anything useful besides maybe Javas War? He was an intriguing stallion prospect I thought. Might have been a terrible sire, or possibly a really great one.

[Calzone Lord]

Originally Posted by Indian Charlie

I forgot about this gem.

How can you be confident in that?

You're being a complete idiot.

Just pathetically and painfully stupid.

Horses are rated by body of work. How hard is that to understand for anyone with an IQ over 60?

When you rate 2yo's you compare 2yo form VS 2yo form.

When you rate older horses -- you compare 4yo and up form VS 4yo and up form.

Candy Ride had one great race and two good races. Not enough body of work to rate with the best older horses .... why? Because he was didn't stay sound.

The fact that 2yo's like Uncle Mo, War Pass, Macho Uno, and Stevie Wonderboy were all a bunch of cripples doesn't disqualify them ... because their 2yo form is superior to the 2yo form of other champions of the decade.

In other words, soundness issues prevented Candy Ride from running more than one great race. Ghostzapper had 5 great races.

Horses like Uncle Mo, War Par, Macho Uno and Stevie Wonderboy all had more than one great 2yo performance.

[alysheba4]

G.Z. was the best since alysheba 4 year old campaign

[Calzone Lord]

Originally Posted by alysheba4

G.Z. was the best since alysheba 4 year old campaign

Skip Away and Cigar in the 90's didn't quite get to his level of peak performance, but based on their body of work as older males, they would have to be rated above Ghostzapper.

[Linny]

Originally Posted by Indian Charlie

Speaking of War Pass, has he sired anything useful besides maybe Javas War? He was an intriguing stallion prospect I thought. Might have been a terrible sire, or possibly a really great one.

He has a MSW winner in MD named Ore Pass that might be a nice one.