2013 will be tougher (Reuters)

[jms62]

Originally Posted by joeydb

Never said that improvements couldn't be made. But that 2200+ page bill and all the bureaucrats it will put in between you and your doctor is not the answer.

And the proponents of the bill really wanted (and still want) "single payer" - socialized medicine.

The closer you make insurance to a true market based entity the better. Things like savings accounts help with that as the patient does care what the service costs and that supresses price.

Don't we have that now with healthcare providers Caremark, United Health etc?

[joeydb]

Originally Posted by jms62

Don't we have that now with healthcare providers Caremark, United Health etc?

Not familiar with their internal business practices, but I'd say no, since the main reason that the costs climb so much is the absorbtion of the costs from those who do not pay. There is a reason that an aspirin costs $20 in the hospital: you're paying for all the deadbeats that didn't pay their bill, whether through an insurance company or individually. Every business needs to make a profit or it will fold, including the health care business.

When was the last time you heard of someone financing, after the fact, the costs that their insurance (if they had it) didn't pick up? If it gets lumped into the loss column for the hospital as uncollected revenue, you, me and every other future patient gets soaked for that bill.

So in that way, no, it is not a market like others. Certainly, no one should be turned away, regardless of ability to pay (immediately) but most of us can pay something over the long term. At least those financing a Cadillac Escalade over 5 years can. If you can buy a luxury car or go get more tattoos or buy Armani suits, you can pay for health care too. Note that those few anecdotal examples are not likely to all be done by the same person - not stereotyping here- but we all have wants and needs, and the wants seem to command more of our spending than the needs.

[Dahoss]

Originally Posted by joeydb

Not familiar with their internal business practices, but I'd say no, since the main reason that the costs climb so much is the absorbtion of the costs from those who do not pay. There is a reason that an aspirin costs $20 in the hospital: you're paying for all the deadbeats that didn't pay their bill, whether through an insurance company or individually. Every business needs to make a profit or it will fold, including the health care business.

When was the last time you heard of someone financing, after the fact, the costs that their insurance (if they had it) didn't pick up? If it gets lumped into the loss column for the hospital as uncollected revenue, you, me and every other future patient gets soaked for that bill.

So in that way, no, it is not a market like others. Certainly, no one should be turned away, regardless of ability to pay (immediately) but most of us can pay something over the long term. At least those financing a Cadillac Escalade over 5 years can. If you can buy a luxury car or go get more tattoos or buy Armani suits, you can pay for health care too. Note that those few anecdotal examples are not likely to all be done by the same person - not stereotyping here- but we all have wants and needs, and the wants seem to command more of our spending than the needs.

This was a nice touch.

[jms62]

Originally Posted by joeydb

Not familiar with their internal business practices, but I'd say no, since the main reason that the costs climb so much is the absorbtion of the costs from those who do not pay. There is a reason that an aspirin costs $20 in the hospital: you're paying for all the deadbeats that didn't pay their bill, whether through an insurance company or individually. Every business needs to make a profit or it will fold, including the health care business.

When was the last time you heard of someone financing, after the fact, the costs that their insurance (if they had it) didn't pick up? If it gets lumped into the loss column for the hospital as uncollected revenue, you, me and every other future patient gets soaked for that bill.

So in that way, no, it is not a market like others. Certainly, no one should be turned away, regardless of ability to pay (immediately) but most of us can pay something over the long term. At least those financing a Cadillac Escalade over 5 years can. If you can buy a luxury car or go get more tattoos or buy Armani suits, you can pay for health care too. Note that those few anecdotal examples are not likely to all be done by the same person - not stereotyping here- but we all have wants and needs, and the wants seem to command more of our spending than the needs.

So what part of FORCING people to buy healthcare insurance do you not like? Oh the government involvment in you having the choice not to have insurance and fuk everyone else over... And fyi don't say "not stereotyping here" when you are doing exactly that. Saying I'm not doing something doesn't get you a pass when you do it. Deny all you like but the sterotyping was Crystal clear to me.

[joeydb]

Originally Posted by jms62

So what part of FORCING people to buy healthcare insurance do you not like? Oh the government involvment in you having the choice not to have insurance and fuk everyone else over... And fyi don't say "not stereotyping here" when you are doing exactly that. Saying I'm not doing something doesn't get you a pass when you do it. Deny all you like but the sterotyping was Crystal clear to me.

Bullsh*t. Don't tell me I am stereotyping when I was not - simply looking for expenses that can be considered luxuries.

Government mandates do not lower costs - they never did.

[jms62]

Originally Posted by joeydb

Bullsh*t. Don't tell me I am stereotyping when I was not - simply looking for expenses that can be considered luxuries.

Government mandates do not lower costs - they never did.

Ok St. Joesph of Derby Trail. If you say you are not sterotyping than you must not be.. Then there should be no need to say "I'm not trying to sterotype here" as it is clear to all.

[Clip-Clop]

Originally Posted by jms62

Ok St. Joesph of Derby Trail. If you say you are not sterotyping than you must not be.. Then there should be no need to say "I'm not trying to sterotype here" as it is clear to all.

Escalade, no doubt...tattoos, perhaps...Armani? Who is he stereotyping? Me?

[joeydb]

Originally Posted by Clip-Clop

Escalade, no doubt...tattoos, perhaps...Armani? Who is he stereotyping? Me?

I actually was trying to round it out - figuring that their might not be much overlap between the markets for tattoos and Armani suits, but who knows? Should I have said pocket watches and Rolexes? What would have been better? The point, as I already said, was that some people view their luxuries as worthy of paying for over time but not their medical care.

That's it.

[Antitrust32]

Originally Posted by jms62

Don't we have that now with healthcare providers Caremark, United Health etc?

united health is my provider. they suck.

well i take that back

prior to obamacare they did not suck, and gave me real good insurance options.