Vote on Debt Limit increase?

[Riot]

Please see the information I posted, above. And take the wars out of your spending figures, only "regular spending" here, please, as I stated in my post (hint - it has gone down markedly starting the first year Obama was in office)

If you want to get rid of waste, seems like Obama's the one you want (btw, he also found a few billion in duplicate Medicare payment waste that will now go to paying for the PPACA, which is entirely self-funding (zero net budget increase)

For example:

2009 & 2010: Wall Street Journal http://blogs.wsj.com/washwire/2009/0...g-cuts-pledge/
Obama Administration Makes Good on Spending Cuts Pledge
It may be a drop in the $2 trillion deficit bucket, but the federal government has made good on President Barack Obama’s promise to find $100 million in spending cuts this year.

Under presidential marching orders, cabinet secretaries actually produced $102 million in cuts for the current fiscal year and another $140 million for fiscal year 2010, which begins in October. The White House budget office released the details Monday night.

Some of the cuts appear to be a significant sacrifice. The Department of Labor has proposed disbanding the nearly 40-year-old Employment Standards Administration, the department’s largest agency, eliminating an assistant secretary of labor and two deputy assistant secretaries at a savings of $1.75 million through 2010. Cabinet secretaries are usually loathe to make such cuts on their own.

Other cuts fall into the category of “They did what?” The U.S. Forest Service will save $1.8 million this year by ceasing to re-paint vehicles as soon as they are purchased – probably a good idea. The Animal and Plant Health Inspection Services canceled a meeting in Australia, saving $36,000. The Bureau of Reclamation’s Pacific Northwest office will get rid of its airplane for a quick $845,000.

Etc.

I spent my whole life wanting fiscal conservatism and reasoned social responsibility from my government. I spent decades voting Republican under the grossly mistaken impression that's what they stand for, and what they would do for the country. History shows I was wrong. The GOP is a fiscal disaster for us. No more. They brought us to the brink of collapse, yet they still want to keep repeating their Reaganomics mistakes.

[dellinger63]

Originally Posted by Riot

Please see the information I posted, above. And take the wars out of your spending figures, only "regular spending" here, please, as I stated in my post (hint - it has gone down markedly starting the first year Obama was in office)

Do bailouts count? Why not just compare discretionary spending numbers?

[joeydb]

Originally Posted by Riot

Please see the information I posted, above. And take the wars out of your spending figures, only "regular spending" here, please, as I stated in my post (hint - it has gone down markedly starting the first year Obama was in office)

For example:

Define "regular spending". If it is a subset of total spending, it is meaningless. The total must be the focus, as the deficits and accumulated debt are a function of the total.

[Riot]

Originally Posted by joeydb

Define "regular spending". If it is a subset of total spending, it is meaningless. The total must be the focus, as the deficits and accumulated debt are a function of the total.

As I said, leave the wars out of the budget. Everything else. Non-military spending. What do you think of our national debt increases?

[dellinger63]

Originally Posted by Riot

I spent my whole life wanting fiscal conservatism and reasoned social responsibility from my government. I spent decades voting Republican under the grossly mistaken impression that's what they stand for, and what they would do for the country. History shows I was wrong. The GOP is a fiscal disaster for us. No more. They brought us to the brink of collapse, yet they still want to keep repeating their Reaganomics mistakes.

and this is what you were waiting for?

Edmunds.com, the premier resource for online automotive information, has determined that Cash for Clunkers cost taxpayers $24,000 per vehicle sold.

Nearly 690,000 vehicles were sold during the Cash for Clunkers program, officially known as CARS, but Edmunds.com analysts calculated that only 125,000 of the sales were incremental. The rest of the sales would have happened anyway, regardless of the existence of the program.

Ironically, the average transaction price for a new vehicle in August 2009 was only $26,915 minus an average cash rebate of $1,667.



http://www.edmunds.com/about/press/c...dmundscom.html

[Riot]

Originally Posted by dellinger63

and this is what you were waiting for?

Yes. Turns out I'm absolutely thrilled with President Obama. During the campaign I didn't want Hilary, nor Obama. But when McCain went with Palin, the light bulb went on. McCain's blatant disrespect for the well being of this country with that pick was too overwhelming. Made me sick to my stomach, what Palin did on the campaign trail, the words coming out of that empty head. I looked back on what the Republicans have done to this country in my lifetime. Their words and actions are in direct opposition. History showed me what they have done in the past, and the future promised to be all that financial disaster starting with Reagan, plus the social takeover. The social takeover is a big deal. Big lightbulb moment.

I've been wrong. No more of that. It's too dangerous to our country and our freedoms. At the very least, the Dems always stand up for individual freedoms and rights far better than the GOP. They have proven themselves more fiscally responsible. The proof is in the past 60 years of action.

Do I agree with everything Obama has done? Not at all. But he's turned out quite a strong, capable, intelligent President who has made good and tough decisions, and you bet I'll vote for him again. I wish I could give him three terms.

And Happy Birthday <g>

[dellinger63]

I just had a chance to look up the national debt in regards to W. Bush and Obama. Interesting.

1/18/01 Bush begins National Debt $5.725 trillion

1/20/09 Bush leaves and Obama begins $10.626 trillion

1/20/10 End of Obama's first year $12.327 trillion

1/20/11 End of Obama's second year $14.056 trillion

Incidently today 4 months later it's $14.345 trillion


So under Bush in 8 years the National Debt rose a total of $4.901 trillion or an average of $0.612 trillion/year

Not so surprisingly considering Obama's giveaway budget (not some fraction of such) he has managed a $1.611 trillion increase in his first year and a $1.729 trillion increase in year two. A 2 year total of $3.34 trillion. Should he manage to continue at the same pace for the next 6 years with no increase, he's on target to smash Bush down with a $13.6 trillion increase to Bush's $4.901 almost three times as much. The theory that a dollar given away comes back at a $1.60 is David Blaine stuff. It's actually a dollar we finance and pay interest on.

Incidently the amount the budget has been raised from year to year is close to a direct correlation to the amount the debt has risen. Whatever bailout and stimulus packages that have been tried have failed miserably by both Bush and Obama.

[Riot]

Originally Posted by dellinger63

Incidently the amount the budget has been raised from year to year is close to a direct correlation to the amount the debt has risen. Whatever bailout and stimulus packages that have been tried have failed miserably by both Bush and Obama.

That's an opinion that isn't shared by any of the well-known economists I've seen write about it over the past 3 years. No matter their political affiliation, all have said it kept us out of depression.

That our economic mess just "spontaneously reversed" all on it's own is a pretty rare opinion, without much to support it.

Your budget figures are a very simplistic way to look at it. I don't suppose you'd care to pull the military budget out of there (which ballooned after W's watch on a prepredicted pattern, no matter who would be elected President) There are obviously different components you are failing to specify: the military that Bush initiated, the stimulus bailouts that will not be repeated, then our regular discretionary budget. Ignoring that much of those budgets were one-time expenditures seems simplistic if presented under the guise of "analysis".

Not so surprisingly considering Obama's giveaway budget

Really? Why don't you post the breakdown of what that budget included - including the cuts to discretionary.

What did you think of the national debt chart I posted, that put the debt to the President who created it?

And here's another national debt chart - it doesn't agree with your figures at all, either. I trust it because it's CBO figures. It also shows that, since Roosevelt-Truman, the most massive increases in our national debt - for everything - occurred under Republican watch, the worse being George W and his two unfunded wars, unfunded Medicare drug benefit, and unfunded tax cuts.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nationa...idential_terms

The facts simply show that the Republican party has had terrible economic policy for this country, and has increased our national debt every single time they are in office starting with Reagan.

[jms62]

Originally Posted by dellinger63

I just had a chance to look up the national debt in regards to W. Bush and Obama. Interesting.

1/18/01 Bush begins National Debt $5.725 trillion

1/20/09 Bush leaves and Obama begins $10.626 trillion

1/20/10 End of Obama's first year $12.327 trillion

1/20/11 End of Obama's second year $14.056 trillion

Incidently today 4 months later it's $14.345 trillion


So under Bush in 8 years the National Debt rose a total of $4.901 trillion or an average of $0.612 trillion/year

Not so surprisingly considering Obama's giveaway budget (not some fraction of such) he has managed a $1.611 trillion increase in his first year and a $1.729 trillion increase in year two. A 2 year total of $3.34 trillion. Should he manage to continue at the same pace for the next 6 years with no increase, he's on target to smash Bush down with a $13.6 trillion increase to Bush's $4.901 almost three times as much. The theory that a dollar given away comes back at a $1.60 is David Blaine stuff. It's actually a dollar we finance and pay interest on.

Incidently the amount the budget has been raised from year to year is close to a direct correlation to the amount the debt has risen. Whatever bailout and stimulus packages that have been tried have failed miserably by both Bush and Obama.

Happy Birthday Dell. Do you even consider for 1 second that the 2 unfunded wars that Bush started had any impact on the Debt going up under Obama?? It's quite basic. If you start an unfunded war and continue with that war the debt will continue to go up. We as a country learned so much from the fall of the Soviet Union due to the war in Afghanastan.
What has Obama done wrong.
1. Didnt put an end to the 2 unfunded wars.
2. Has done nothing for the continued Rape of the Middle class by Wallstreet and CEO's
What Obama has done right
1. Got Osama the way it should have been done all along. Crack Team and good Intel.. If Bush goes that route it would have saved a few Trill.

Full Disclosure...
Voted for Obama. Looking for a viable candidate other than him next election. The Repubs have trotted out the Zippy Chippy's of candidates thus far.

[Riot]

Originally Posted by jms62

1. Got Osama the way it should have been done all along. Crack Team and good Intel.. If Bush goes that route it would have saved a few Trill.

And hundreds of lives. I'll never forgive Bush for the Americans he got killed in Iraq.

[jms62]

Originally Posted by Riot

And thousands of lives. I'll never forgive Bush for the Americans he got killed in Iraq.

FTFY... Now don't go all Nascar on me for it.

[jms62]

Originally Posted by Riot

And hundreds of lives. I'll never forgive Bush for the Americans he got killed in Iraq.

Big Oil and Defense Contractors made a killing... Hmmmm just a coincidence ??

[Nascar1966]

Originally Posted by Riot

And hundreds of lives. I'll never forgive Bush for the Americans he got killed in Iraq.

How can you leave Obama out of this one? Aren't there still troops in Iraq coming home in body bags? Or are you still saying this is Bush's fault. Obama has the chance to bring the troops home, but he has no back bone to bring them home. Why would he care about the troops, he has never served a day in the military.

[Nascar1966]

Originally Posted by dellinger63

I just had a chance to look up the national debt in regards to W. Bush and Obama. Interesting.

1/18/01 Bush begins National Debt $5.725 trillion

1/20/09 Bush leaves and Obama begins $10.626 trillion

1/20/10 End of Obama's first year $12.327 trillion

1/20/11 End of Obama's second year $14.056 trillion

Incidently today 4 months later it's $14.345 trillion


So under Bush in 8 years the National Debt rose a total of $4.901 trillion or an average of $0.612 trillion/year

Not so surprisingly considering Obama's giveaway budget (not some fraction of such) he has managed a $1.611 trillion increase in his first year and a $1.729 trillion increase in year two. A 2 year total of $3.34 trillion. Should he manage to continue at the same pace for the next 6 years with no increase, he's on target to smash Bush down with a $13.6 trillion increase to Bush's $4.901 almost three times as much. The theory that a dollar given away comes back at a $1.60 is David Blaine stuff. It's actually a dollar we finance and pay interest on.

Incidently the amount the budget has been raised from year to year is close to a direct correlation to the amount the debt has risen. Whatever bailout and stimulus packages that have been tried have failed miserably by both Bush and Obama.

Riot will want to see a graph of this. If you show her a graph she still wont believe it. Maybe the smell of the dog poo at her vet place has ruined her brain cells that she has left. The limited ones she has left.

[Duvalier]

Nascar STFU

[joeydb]

Originally Posted by Duvalier

Nascar STFU

Is that all you have? Any refutation of the spending numbers?

[Nascar1966]

Originally Posted by Duvalier

Nascar STFU

GFY