Shocking news from NY

[Kasept]

Originally Posted by the_fat_man

Yeah: this was hilarious.

I mean, it's not like Rudy, who worked for Dutrow, and trains for some of the same connections, would ever get caught cheating. It makes sense that Rick would not get the 'best' (least detectable) stuff.

You talk like you know what to do to catch those that are taking an edge..

I'm curious what exactly you suggest for crafting that better dragnet?

Originally Posted by Kasept

You talk like you know what to do to catch those that are taking an edge..

I'm curious what exactly you suggest for crafting that better dragnet?

Declare martial law. Kill all of the barn cats to let them know you mean business.

[freddymo]

Originally Posted by Kasept

You talk like you know what to do to catch those that are taking an edge..

I'm curious what exactly you suggest for crafting that better dragnet?

Juan Carlos Guerrero was 72% W/P/S in 2010. Clearly, no trainer is able to deliver more for his owners then Mr. Guerrero! If you have a hard knocking claimer on the east coast Mr. G is cash money. 70 plus % of the time Mr. G is delivering slot fueled monsta purses for him peeps. And people say the little guy is dead in racing. Here is a perfect example how a little guy can claim a horse for between 5 and 10k and run him back 40 days later and get a terriffic slot bloated check. It goes to show you no matter how bad things are someone is always working harder to get the job done, a true professional. Kudos Mr G. you rock!

[stonegossard]

Originally Posted by freddymo

Juan Carlos Guerrero was 72% W/P/S in 2010. Clearly, no trainer is able to deliver more for his owners then Mr. Guerrero! If you have a hard knocking claimer on the east coast Mr. G is cash money. 70 plus % of the time Mr. G is delivering slot fueled monsta purses for him peeps. And people say the little guy is dead in racing. Here is a perfect example how a little guy can claim a horse for between 5 and 10k and run him back 40 days later and get a terriffic slot bloated check. It goes to show you no matter how bad things are someone is always working harder to get the job done, a true professional. Kudos Mr G. you rock!

What Guerrero is doing is making what guys like Dutrow and Wolfson do seem like child's play. I know Philly park is a bit of a dump and the racing there isn't much, but come on....to let a guy like this continue to do what he is doing? Pretty sad on Philly Park's part.

[freddymo]

Originally Posted by stonegossard

What Guerrero is doing is making what guys like Dutrow and Wolfson do seem like child's play. I know Philly park is a bit of a dump and the racing there isn't much, but come on....to let a guy like this continue to do what he is doing? Pretty sad on Philly Park's part.

The guy is stealing. Pletcher's horses are in the money 52% of the time. the very best of the cheaters are in the high 50's maybe low 60's.. Juan Carlos is 72% that is insane.. Parx's purses are terriffic so even if it a hole in the ground for racing it still offers a place to race a horse that isnt very fast and make a buck.. Juan carlos is just stealing and nobody cares

[cmorioles]

Originally Posted by freddymo

The guy is stealing. Pletcher's horses are in the money 52% of the time. the very best of the cheaters are in the high 50's maybe low 60's.. Juan Carlos is 72% that is insane.. Parx's purses are terriffic so even if it a hole in the ground for racing it still offers a place to race a horse that isnt very fast and make a buck.. Juan carlos is just stealing and nobody cares

I can't figure out who should get the "Best Cheater" Eclipse for 2010. Either Guerrero, or Mike Chambers at Turf Paradise. It is way too close to call. Chambers is 30 for 50 at the meet last I checked...winners, not in the money.

[freddymo]

Originally Posted by cmorioles

I can't figure out who should get the "Best Cheater" Eclipse for 2010. Either Guerrero, or Mike Chambers at Turf Paradise. It is way too close to call. Chambers is 30 for 50 at the meet last I checked...winners, not in the money.

Not sure why anyone would want to race or bet Turf paradise. I see john Sherriffs had 84 starts for the year? Is training his hobby or career?

[cmorioles]

Originally Posted by freddymo

Not sure why anyone would want to race or bet Turf paradise. I see john Sherriffs had 84 starts for the year? Is training his hobby or career?

Now we know why he didn't travel with Zenyatta. There is no way to oversee such a huge operation from the road.

[blackthroatedwind]

Originally Posted by freddymo

Not sure why anyone would want to race or bet Turf paradise. I see john Sherriffs had 84 starts for the year? Is training his hobby or career?

Yet there are people voting for him as Trainer of the Year.

Too funny.

[randallscott35]

Originally Posted by cmorioles

I can't figure out who should get the "Best Cheater" Eclipse for 2010. Either Guerrero, or Mike Chambers at Turf Paradise. It is way too close to call. Chambers is 30 for 50 at the meet last I checked...winners, not in the money.

He's just lucky is all. How dare you

[freddymo]

Originally Posted by Rare Bog

I don't think catching them is an issue.... that will happen in due course. The issue is one of deterrence.

1. Well a nice start would be to impose REAL bans such as not allowing one to run his stock under a pseudo-trainer change with the same meds at their disposal.

2. Listing vets in the racing forms with vet win percentages (just like the jockeys and trainers) would also be a nice... could weed out some trends (do Dutrow and RudyRod use the same vet?)

3. The industry could choose to start treating these cheats like the sport-deteriorating pariah that they are. Instead, proven cheats like Todd Pletcher (who has toned it down in recent years) and Marty Wolfson (selectively still one of the juciest) end up on ESPN and are exalted on various horse racing radio shows. Some good ole fashioned Mark McGwire and Barry Bonds treatment by the racing officials could go a long way. But no, because these folks control so much stock they control whether the races go, and ipso facto, control racing.

Open to other ideas....

Do you remember the All in the Family episode when Archie does an op ed commentary on Hi Jacking? His brilliant idea was to give everyone "a piece" to combat crimnals.

How hard is it to really find out what Juan Carlos/Rudy/Ness etc. is giving the horses. you have to get the FBI involved and clean out the vermin. They will come back in time but it is insane now.

Yeah lets get the FBI involved. This is of the utmost importance.

[randallscott35]

Originally Posted by Coach Pants

Yeah lets get the FBI involved. This is of the utmost importance.

Aren't they busy with Cam Newton

Originally Posted by randallscott35

Aren't they busy with Cam Newton

Indirectly. They're after a few bankers who just so happen to be Auburn boosters.

Try again.

[freddymo]

Originally Posted by Coach Pants

Yeah lets get the FBI involved. This is of the utmost importance.

There are billions wagered and a lot of chicanery going on. The people are the government and both are getting screwed. Real money being stolen from people who should be protected. The results are basically fixed and therefore indeed authorities need be involved.

You cant compete so if you want to survive you have to give your stock to an envelope pusher and I will and have. If you want to be involved you have to vet the schiit out the horse and play in the gray area. I dont think any owner should do less, until authorities cleans up the skys/tracks..."give everyone a piece"! if someone is coming into your house every week with a gun and stealing your stuff you have to go out and buy a gun or the government has to protect you. it really is pretty simple. All these trainers that are using pure horsemanship to try and survive aren't. You think juan Carlos knows more about horses then ......... ........... ..........and........? Please.. Within weeks of getting his trainers license Rudy was moving up horses like crazy.. How does that happen? How do the people that are suppose to protect the public let that happen?..

F it go get your gun and protect your investment nobody who can make a difference has. It's the wild wild west on the backstretch.

Originally Posted by freddymo

There are billions wagered and a lot of chicanery going on. The people are the government and both are getting screwed. Real money being stolen from people who should be protected. The results are basically fixed and therefore indeed authorities need be involved.

You cant compete so if you want to survive you have to give your stock to an envelope pusher and I will and have. If you want to be involved you have to vet the schiit out the horse and play in the gray area. I dont think any owner should do less, until authorities cleans up the skys/tracks..."give everyone a piece"! if someone is coming into your house every week with a gun and stealing your stuff you have to go out and buy a gun or the government has to protect you. it really is pretty simple. All these trainers that are using pure horsemanship to try and survive aren't. You think juan Carlos knows more about horses then ......... ........... ..........and........? Please.. Within weeks of getting his trainers license Rudy was moving up horses like crazy.. How does that happen? How do the people that are suppose to protect the public let that happen?..

F it go get your gun and protect your investment nobody who can make a difference has. It's the wild wild west on the backstretch.

A pebble in an ocean.

[blackthroatedwind]

Originally Posted by freddymo

Do you remember the All in the Family episode when Archie does an op ed commentary on Hi Jacking? His brilliant idea was to give everyone "a piece" to combat crimnals.

How hard is it to really find out what Juan Carlos/Rudy/Ness etc. is giving the horses. you have to get the FBI involved and clean out the vermin. They will come back in time but it is insane now.

I believe he said " arm your passengers. " One of my all-time favorites.