Commentator.. nice!

[blackthroatedwind]

Originally Posted by The Indomitable DrugS

Commentator, her first foal, was foaled in March of 2001. Seems like Distorted Humor got his dam when she was a early 2-year-old.

Yet another horse who had done enough.

[King Glorious]

Originally Posted by Indian Charlie

Why not? Heck, try to find a grass course that favors speed, I could see him being really tough!

Better than going in a 6f race against quicker horses where he has little hope, or going in a ybred race for very little money.

I'm with you here in asking "why not?" I don't understand that comment Andy made. What does it mean "it's just not what you do"? Don't you do what you want to do with your horse? Forget about traditions and long held beliefs. Have an open mind to at least try different things. Putting him in races like the BC Sprint and the Forego should be the things that you don't do when it's extremely obvious that that's not his game. His game is in races of 8-9f (remember his Whitney?) where he's more likely to be able to control the pace and has the stamina to finish. If there aren't many mile races on the dirt for him, what's so wrong with at least trying the grass? It's not like if he fails, his career is over.

[blackthroatedwind]

Originally Posted by King Glorious

I'm with you here in asking "why not?" I don't understand that comment Andy made. What does it mean "it's just not what you do"? Don't you do what you want to do with your horse? Forget about traditions and long held beliefs. Have an open mind to at least try different things. Putting him in races like the BC Sprint and the Forego should be the things that you don't do when it's extremely obvious that that's not his game. His game is in races of 8-9f (remember his Whitney?) where he's more likely to be able to control the pace and has the stamina to finish. If there aren't many mile races on the dirt for him, what's so wrong with at least trying the grass? It's not like if he fails, his career is over.

Everything every trainer does is not the right thing. They will all tell you this. However, when a trainer has a substantial resume of success it seems a little presumptuous for any of us to think we know better than them.

Commentator was 4:5 when he ran in the Forego. You show me a trainer that doesn't run a horse that is 4:5 in a Grade 1 and I will show you a moron. Commentator was 9:1 in the BC Sprint. You tell me the turf race that was more prestigious where he would have been a shorter price. One could argue that the best course of action is to consider your equity and go where it's highest. Especially when you have a horse that you pray can stay sound for even a short period of time.

Frankly, the person who thinks Indian Blessing should be pointing for the KY Derby is in absolutely no position to recommend the course of any horse.

[hoovesupsideyourhead]

does that make the donn still a bad move..lol

[blackthroatedwind]

Originally Posted by hoovesupsideyourhead

does that make the donn still a bad move..lol

Not, apparently, if it was a turf race.

[King Glorious]

Originally Posted by blackthroatedwind

Everything every trainer does is not the right thing. They will all tell you this. However, when a trainer has a substantial resume of success it seems a little presumptuous for any of us to think we know better than them.

Commentator was 4:5 when he ran in the Forego. You show me a trainer that doesn't run a horse that is 4:5 in a Grade 1 and I will show you a moron. Commentator was 9:1 in the BC Sprint. You tell me the turf race that was more prestigious where he would have been a shorter price. One could argue that the best course of action is to consider your equity and go where it's highest. Especially when you have a horse that you pray can stay sound for even a short period of time.

Frankly, the person who thinks Indian Blessing should be pointing for the KY Derby is in absolutely no position to recommend the course of any horse.

Just because someone has a great record of success doesn't mean that they are never wrong. Wayne Lukas is arguably the most successful trainer in the history of the TC series and it's preps. Does it mean that his decision to press on with Going Wild was a good one? Does his record mean that nobody should have the right to question the move? I don't believe his record makes him beyond reproach. Same goes for Zito. Even so, I didn't say Zito was at fault for the places he ran the horse. I don't know who makes the call on where the horse runs. For all I know, the owner could be the one making the decisions against Zito's better judgment. If the only people that should be qualified to question anything on this forum are those that have a better track record in the game than Zito, I suspect that it would get pretty quiet around here pretty fast.

Who in the world cares if Commentator was 4/5 in the race? Does that mean that Zito should always run his horses where the public thinks he has the best shot? Using the odds a horse goes off at to suggest that they deserve those odds is weak. Arazi was the favorite in the 1992 BC Mile. I believe Favorite Trick held that same role in the 1998 running of the same race. Did either of them deserve to be? Absolutely not. So what do odds mean? I told anyone that would listen, and it's on here in print, that he had NO SHOT to win. I've said many times that he'll never win a top level sprint race. Wouldn't matter if he was 1/10. What if they had maybe tried the grass before last year's BC? What if he liked it? Then they could have considered the Mile instead of the Sprint.

Finally, I'm not sure what Indian Blessing has to do with any of this other than your constant need to try and belittle people's opinions. But at least you should be right about it when you do bring her up. I don't believe that I said she SHOULD run in the Derby. I don't believe I said she should be even POINTING to the Derby. If she were mine, that is not the direction I would be going with her. I said that I thought that at this point, I think she is one of the top five 3yos and Derby prospects out there. I don't think though that she's got a shot against War Pass or El Gato Malo so I wouldn't be looking to take them on unless I saw something in her next couple of races that told me that I have to go there.

Same old same old
with this horse.
Give em an easy run
in the first part of a race,
uncontested early, he looks
like a monster.

He can win sprints.
If they go 22.5, 46 and he
leads these fractions.
Good luck with that.

[hoovesupsideyourhead]

Originally Posted by King Glorious

Just because someone has a great record of success doesn't mean that they are never wrong. Wayne Lukas is arguably the most successful trainer in the history of the TC series and it's preps. Does it mean that his decision to press on with Going Wild was a good one? Does his record mean that nobody should have the right to question the move? I don't believe his record makes him beyond reproach. Same goes for Zito. Even so, I didn't say Zito was at fault for the places he ran the horse. I don't know who makes the call on where the horse runs. For all I know, the owner could be the one making the decisions against Zito's better judgment. If the only people that should be qualified to question anything on this forum are those that have a better track record in the game than Zito, I suspect that it would get pretty quiet around here pretty fast.

Who in the world cares if Commentator was 4/5 in the race? Does that mean that Zito should always run his horses where the public thinks he has the best shot? Using the odds a horse goes off at to suggest that they deserve those odds is weak. Arazi was the favorite in the 1992 BC Mile. I believe Favorite Trick held that same role in the 1998 running of the same race. Did either of them deserve to be? Absolutely not. So what do odds mean? I told anyone that would listen, and it's on here in print, that he had NO SHOT to win. I've said many times that he'll never win a top level sprint race. Wouldn't matter if he was 1/10. What if they had maybe tried the grass before last year's BC? What if he liked it? Then they could have considered the Mile instead of the Sprint.

Finally, I'm not sure what Indian Blessing has to do with any of this other than your constant need to try and belittle people's opinions. But at least you should be right about it when you do bring her up. I don't believe that I said she SHOULD run in the Derby. I don't believe I said she should be even POINTING to the Derby. If she were mine, that is not the direction I would be going with her. I said that I thought that at this point, I think she is one of the top five 3yos and Derby prospects out there. I don't think though that she's got a shot against War Pass or El Gato Malo so I wouldn't be looking to take them on unless I saw something in her next couple of races that told me that I have to go there.

you know el gatos fig was way downgraded due to a goof speed bias..

[Cajungator26]

Originally Posted by merasmag

i liked this horsie, and his trainer, as much as anybody, but eventually ya gotta make room for the ones that are actually doing somethin...i drop certain ones outta my stable mail confident that if they are in a race (stakes) i wanna bet, i'll know about it---he is in that category...once every 6 months...bye-bye

LOL

And the alcohol has spoken.

[Cajungator26]

Originally Posted by merasmag

mrs hunter

Could be Mrs. Paul on January 29th.

[Danzig]

Originally Posted by Cajungator26

Could be Mrs. Paul on January 29th.

you going to sell frozen fish?!

[Danzig]

Originally Posted by merasmag

mrs hunter

and that wasn't alcohol...it was knowing what i'm talkin bout

glad someone does!

[Danzig]

Originally Posted by merasmag

i was with children long enuf today...if u don't understand my writing u can either go back to school or sit down and shut up and think for a minute...god gave u a brain, use it!

it's really not worth the effort.

[Cajungator26]

Originally Posted by merasmag

i was with children long enuf today...if u don't understand my writing u can either go back to school or sit down and shut up and think for a minute...god gave u a brain, use it!

I drank too much tonight to decipher any of this. Nite, y'all!

[The Indomitable DrugS]

Originally Posted by King Glorious

Finally, I'm not sure what Indian Blessing has to do with any of this

I hope you still aren't willing to argue steadfastly that she doesn't have stamina issues to address.

[blackthroatedwind]

Originally Posted by King Glorious

Just because someone has a great record of success doesn't mean that they are never wrong. Wayne Lukas is arguably the most successful trainer in the history of the TC series and it's preps. Does it mean that his decision to press on with Going Wild was a good one? Does his record mean that nobody should have the right to question the move? I don't believe his record makes him beyond reproach. Same goes for Zito. Even so, I didn't say Zito was at fault for the places he ran the horse. I don't know who makes the call on where the horse runs. For all I know, the owner could be the one making the decisions against Zito's better judgment. If the only people that should be qualified to question anything on this forum are those that have a better track record in the game than Zito, I suspect that it would get pretty quiet around here pretty fast.

Who in the world cares if Commentator was 4/5 in the race? Does that mean that Zito should always run his horses where the public thinks he has the best shot? Using the odds a horse goes off at to suggest that they deserve those odds is weak. Arazi was the favorite in the 1992 BC Mile. I believe Favorite Trick held that same role in the 1998 running of the same race. Did either of them deserve to be? Absolutely not. So what do odds mean? I told anyone that would listen, and it's on here in print, that he had NO SHOT to win. I've said many times that he'll never win a top level sprint race. Wouldn't matter if he was 1/10. What if they had maybe tried the grass before last year's BC? What if he liked it? Then they could have considered the Mile instead of the Sprint.

Finally, I'm not sure what Indian Blessing has to do with any of this other than your constant need to try and belittle people's opinions. But at least you should be right about it when you do bring her up. I don't believe that I said she SHOULD run in the Derby. I don't believe I said she should be even POINTING to the Derby. If she were mine, that is not the direction I would be going with her. I said that I thought that at this point, I think she is one of the top five 3yos and Derby prospects out there. I don't think though that she's got a shot against War Pass or El Gato Malo so I wouldn't be looking to take them on unless I saw something in her next couple of races that told me that I have to go there.

I don't have the energy.......I think you are pretty much completely wrong about everything in this post.....just as I think your outlandish position on Indian Blessing highlights how much I disagree with your positions. No, I don't think everything you say is wrong, but some of it is so wrong that I have to reevaluate my positions when I agree with you.

[King Glorious]

Originally Posted by The Indomitable DrugS

I hope you still aren't willing to argue steadfastly that she doesn't have stamina issues to address.

I haven't seen any yet. I won't use how she ran this past weekend as any evidence of anything other than the fact that Baffert had her ready to win a 7f race in fast time in her 3yo debut. There was no need for her to be ready to rate and show enough stamina to convince the masses that she could go 9f or more in that race. I believe that a horse should be trained for what they are going to be asked to do. This is the same thing I went through with Smarty in 2004. People said he wouldn't have the stamina to go past a mile. They used his run in the Southwest Stakes (a tiring win where the closers were coming at him) as proof. They were wrong. Maybe they will end up right about Indian Blessing. This past weekend's race means nothing towards that end though, IMO. If one was seeing her for the first time this past weekend, they would assume that she couldn't last a step beyond 7f but we know that's not true because she's already won at 8.5f around two turns in grade one company.

[Cajungator26]

Originally Posted by King Glorious

This is the same thing I went through with Smarty in 2004. People said he wouldn't have the stamina to go past a mile. They used his run in the Southwest Stakes (a tiring win where the closers were coming at him) as proof. They were wrong.

OH NO. Comparing Indian Blessing to Smarty Jones again.

[The Indomitable DrugS]

I bet against Smarty Jones in the EhorseX exchange market the day of the Southwest because there was no way he wasn't getting cooked in that race - He got cooked - and still gave only marginal late ground to Two Down Automatic.

Since her remarkable debut at 5.5 furlongs, Indian Blessing has shown vulnerability through the stretch run in each start. To compare her at this point - with Smarty Jones after the Southwest Stakes - is ridiculious.

[The Bid]

I was amazed how badly he was winging out in his right front. Bdw you are familiar with the horse is that normal for him? I dont recall it ever being so pronounced watching him run. Still a strong effort