NYTHA Lasix Primer & Letter to NYS RWB

[cmorioles]

A lot of good information, but also plenty omitted and clearly biased.

[Kasept]

Originally Posted by cmorioles

A lot of good information, but also plenty omitted and clearly biased.

Good. That means it's at least level with the omitted and biased information promulgated by the opposition.

[cmorioles]

Originally Posted by Kasept

Good. That means it's at least level with the omitted and biased information promulgated by the opposition.

Of course. Are you going to post that side as well?

[Kasept]

Originally Posted by cmorioles

Of course. Are you going to post that side as well?

No. You can if you want to though.

[cmorioles]

Originally Posted by Kasept

No. You can if you want to though.

I've given my thoughts. I'll have to check the thread others mention since I didn't see it.

The biggest thing I have trouble with is that nobody wants to test if horses that don't need Lasix run faster with it than without it. Everything I've learned about racing in 30 years of following the sport seems to point to the fact that it does, but nobody wants to address this.

[Danzig]

Originally Posted by cmorioles

I've given my thoughts. I'll have to check the thread others mention since I didn't see it.

The biggest thing I have trouble with is that nobody wants to test if horses that don't need Lasix run faster with it than without it. Everything I've learned about racing in 30 years of following the sport seems to point to the fact that it does, but nobody wants to address this.

as i've asked before, how can you tell if a horse needs it? it's my understanding that eiph can occur at any time without warning, and that severe enough episodes can cause permanent lung damage. so, how does one determine when a horse will bleed? and if you can't tell, isn't it better to prevent something that could happen, rather than have regret for not preventing it, and having permanent consequences as a result?
it is also my understanding that the only enhancement is that a horse hindered by bleeding is no longer hindered when given lasix. that way he can run to his talent-not below, not above.

[cmorioles]

Originally Posted by Danzig

as i've asked before, how can you tell if a horse needs it? it's my understanding that eiph can occur at any time without warning, and that severe enough episodes can cause permanent lung damage. so, how does one determine when a horse will bleed? and if you can't tell, isn't it better to prevent something that could happen, rather than have regret for not preventing it, and having permanent consequences as a result?
it is also my understanding that the only enhancement is that a horse hindered by bleeding is no longer hindered when given lasix. that way he can run to his talent-not below, not above.

So we are back to this...just drug all horses whether they need it or not.

I keep hearing this about only helping a horse run to its ability, but I don't think it is true.

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by cmorioles

I've given my thoughts. I'll have to check the thread others mention since I didn't see it.

The biggest thing I have trouble with is that nobody wants to test if horses that don't need Lasix run faster with it than without it. Everything I've learned about racing in 30 years of following the sport seems to point to the fact that it does, but nobody wants to address this.

Some horses run faster in blinkers than without them but no one is suggesting that they are performance enhancers when they clearly can be.

Just sayin...

[cmorioles]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

Some horses run faster in blinkers than without them but no one is suggesting that they are performance enhancers when they clearly can be.

Just sayin...

They aren't a drug...just sayin...

[Riot]

Originally Posted by cmorioles

The biggest thing I have trouble with is that nobody wants to test if horses that don't need Lasix run faster with it than without it. Everything I've learned about racing in 30 years of following the sport seems to point to the fact that it does, but nobody wants to address this.

It is so rewarding to do measurable science in a vacuum. Why have Gluck, with million of dollars in donations dedicated to equine science? You know, get the answers people want? Answers like, "How fast do horses run on lasix, versus off lasix?

I don't know what's worse: not knowing it exists, or repeatedly and deliberately ignoring it exists.

[cmorioles]

Originally Posted by Riot

It is so rewarding to do measurable science in a vacuum. Why have Gluck, with million of dollars in donations dedicated to equine science? You know, get the answers people want? Answers like, "How fast do horses run on lasix, versus off lasix?

I don't know what's worse: not knowing it exists, or repeatedly and deliberately ignoring it exists.

I tried running this through babblefish, but it couldn't translate the post either. I seem to remember you quoted a study that said some horses run faster, others do not. In any case, the studies I saw were vague and the conclusions dubious at best. Surely we can do better in 2012.

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by cmorioles

Of course. Are you going to post that side as well?

I believe the cleanracing.org thread would qualify.

[Riot]

Originally Posted by cmorioles

A lot of good information, but also plenty omitted and clearly biased.

Reality has a distinctive bias towards objectivity.