Obama's support for Ground Zero Mosque

[SCUDSBROTHER]

Originally Posted by Riot

Ad hominem is a great debate tactic at times - glad you find it useful.

There's a marked difference between discussing a religion in an objective, inquisitive manner, and maintaining anyone remotely associated with it is an evil murdering anti-American terrorist.

When you do that, you seem so rabid. Why do you distort people's positions so much? It's like a less expensive form of lying.

[Honu]

I wonder how people would have felt in 1950 if in Pearl Harbor the Japanese would have wanted to build a cultural center near the shore of the U.S.S Arizona.

[hi_im_god]

Originally Posted by Honu

I wonder how people would have felt in 1950 if in Pearl Harbor the Japanese would have wanted to build a cultural center near the shore of the U.S.S Arizona.

http://jcch.com/

google map the address.

they probably would have wanted to put the f'in slants in internment camps.

hey! i've got a great idea! let's repeat that fine moment in civil liberties over and over again!

[Honu]

Originally Posted by hi_im_god

http://jcch.com/

google map the address.

they probably would have wanted to put the f'in slants in internment camps. again.

hey! i've got a great idea! let's repeat this over and over again!

But they didnt build the fn thing 10 years after they bombed the crap out of us.
The Hawaiians are a pretty forgiving folk the military people who were there who survived maybe not so much. I think had the U.S not had a base there and was able to keep the Japanese from taking over the island the Hawaiians might have had just a lil diffirent view. Had the Japanese conqured the island and did to the Hawaiian people what they did to the other islands they captured maybe the locals would have a diffirent outlook.

[hi_im_god]

Originally Posted by Honu

But they didnt build the fn thing 10 years after they bombed the crap out of us.
The Hawaiians are a pretty forgiving folk the military people who were there who survived maybe not so much. I think had the U.S not had a base there and was able to keep the Japanese from taking over the island the Hawaiians might have had just a lil diffirent view. Had the Japanese conqured the island and did to the Hawaiian people what they did to the other islands they captured maybe the locals would have a diffirent outlook.

i think the problem is you're conflating an act of war by a foreign government with an act of terrorism by people who were muslim.

there is no united states of islam that attacked us.

confusing the two doesn't serve any national goal. it serves a narrow political purpose for one party over the next few months.

[Honu]

Originally Posted by hi_im_god

i think the problem is you're conflating an act of war by a foreign government with an act of terrorism by people who were muslim.

there is no united states of islam that attacked us.

confusing the two doesn't serve any national goal. it serves a narrow political purpose for one party over the next few months.

But the terrorists have declared war on "us" just because they dont all reside in one country doesnt mean that it isnt a combined effort. Just like Im sure not all the Japanese people wanted to have a war with America but the loudest and proudest did. So when the Taliban was in control of the government of Afghanastan and sent out its recruits to commit Jihad against the infidels that wasnt a sort of "government " act?
Anyway, I just think that the American Islamic community should be just a little more sensitive to the people of New York and how close to the surface this still is for them. Yes they have a right to do whatever they want to do but if they were really trying to bridge a gap between how they are and how people percieve Muslims then they would say" hey you know what, we feel you New Yorkers and we will move our cultural center somewhere else".
Instead they are pushing forward with something that is causing protests and arguments and think its just fine. They need to set an expmple of the religion of peace by making some and putting their building somewhere else.

[hi_im_god]

Originally Posted by Honu

But the terrorists have declared war on "us" just because they dont all reside in one country doesnt mean that it isnt a combined effort. Just like Im sure not all the Japanese people wanted to have a war with America but the loudest and proudest did. So when the Taliban was in control of the government of Afghanastan and sent out its recruits to commit Jihad against the infidels that wasnt a sort of "government " act?
Anyway, I just think that the American Islamic community should be just a little more sensitive to the people of New York and how close to the surface this still is for them. Yes they have a right to do whatever they want to do but if they were really trying to bridge a gap between how they are and how people percieve Muslims then they would say" hey you know what, we feel you New Yorkers and we will move our cultural center somewhere else".
Instead they are pushing forward with something that is causing protests and arguments and think its just fine. They need to set an expmple of the religion of peace by making some and putting their building somewhere else.

if we're going to successful in the struggle against religious extremism, we need to educate ourselves enough that we can distinguish between terrorists and muslims.

some muslims are going to be terrorists. a lot of terrorists are going to be muslim. i get all that.

but i think the united states vs. muslims is a much tougher fight than the united states vs. terrorists and i just hope we don't waste so much time jerking off over what serves narrow short term political gain that we lose sight of what actually matters for our long term benefit.

sufis are the unitarians of the the islamic world. if we don't have them on our side, we've taken on a much tougher fight than needed.

[Danzig]

Originally Posted by Honu

But they didnt build the fn thing 10 years after they bombed the crap out of us.
The Hawaiians are a pretty forgiving folk the military people who were there who survived maybe not so much. I think had the U.S not had a base there and was able to keep the Japanese from taking over the island the Hawaiians might have had just a lil diffirent view. Had the Japanese conqured the island and did to the Hawaiian people what they did to the other islands they captured maybe the locals would have a diffirent outlook.

i agree. no country that attacks us should be able to build a cultural center in that area. when one wants to do so, let us know.

[SCUDSBROTHER]

Originally Posted by hi_im_god

http://jcch.com/

google map the address.

they probably would have wanted to put the f'in slants in internment camps.

hey! i've got a great idea! let's repeat that fine moment in civil liberties over and over again!

Not wanting a Mosque somewhere sensitive is the same as putting people in internment camps?

[hi_im_god]

Originally Posted by SCUDSBROTHER

Not wanting a Mosque somewhere sensitive is the same as putting people in internment camps?

not at all. i was responding to honu's use of pearl harbor as an example. it was an exaggeration to make a smaller point.

i do think the idea that we restrict religious expression based on other's sensitivities is problematic.

[Antitrust32]

Originally Posted by hi_im_god

not at all. i was responding to honu's use of pearl harbor as an example. it was an exaggeration to make a smaller point.

i do think the idea that we restrict religious expression based on other's sensitivities is problematic.

I think that loser pastor that protests military funerals should be restricted religious expression based on other's sensitivities also.

[Danzig]

Originally Posted by Antitrust32

I think that loser pastor that protests military funerals should be restricted religious expression based on other's sensitivities also.

it would be nice to do so, since i think his actions are unpardonable. however, there's no legal way to stifle them-unless of course funerals were made invitation only-and i don't even know that would work.

[Riot]

Originally Posted by SCUDSBROTHER

When you do that, you seem so rabid. Why do you distort people's positions so much? It's like a less expensive form of lying.

Yes, I think there is plenty of beyond-obvious Muslim hate on this board, from some.

[Rupert Pupkin]

Originally Posted by Riot

Yes, I think there is plenty of beyond-obvious Muslim hate on this board, from some.

I think your definition of "hate" is quite different from the rest of us. If a person expresses concerns about aspects of a religion, it does not mean they "hate" all the members of that religion.

[Riot]

Originally Posted by Rupert Pupkin

I think your definition of "hate" is quite different from the rest of us. If a person expresses concerns about aspects of a religion, it does not mean they "hate" all the members of that religion.

I hope so. For example, my definition doesn't include referring to all Muslims together as "they" or "tame", or denigrating as in, "This so called religion (more of a hate group than a religion)" or "the most severe hypocrites on earth"

[SCUDSBROTHER]

Originally Posted by Riot

I hope so. For example, my definition doesn't include referring to all Muslims together as "they" or "tame", or denigrating as in, "This so called religion (more of a hate group than a religion)" or "the most severe hypocrites on earth"

It's still not an excuse to say any of us think over 2 million Moslem Americans are killing people. You're switching back n' forth. Changing subjects, and targets.

[SCUDSBROTHER]

Originally Posted by Riot

I hope so. For example, my definition doesn't include referring to all Muslims together as "they" or "tame", or denigrating as in, "This so called religion (more of a hate group than a religion)" or "the most severe hypocrites on earth"

Thank you for 1 time being accurate. You've still had to go all the way to me to try to justify a comment that you made about Rupert.

[SCUDSBROTHER]

Originally Posted by Riot

Yes, I think there is plenty of beyond-obvious Muslim hate on this board, from some.

LOL...You weren't responding to me. Even if you're were, it's pretty obvious America doesn't have over 2 million Moslems killing people (like their prophet gave them the authority to do.) Lady, you got a definite accounting problem. Why don't you present a person's position as it is? Embellishing it is a bad habit that you've picked up.

[Riot]

Originally Posted by SCUDSBROTHER

LOL...You weren't responding to me. Even if you're were, it's pretty obvious America doesn't have over 2 million Moslems killing people (like their prophet gave them the authority to do.) Lady, you got a definite accounting problem. Why don't you present a person's position as it is? Embellishing it is a bad habit that you've picked up.

Yes, I'm the one doing embellishing, when you describe Islam as you do.

[SCUDSBROTHER]

Originally Posted by Riot

Yes, I'm the one doing embellishing, when you describe Islam as you do.

Facts are on my side. He told them to kill non-Muslims, or tax them for being non-Muslim. 2 women's testimony= 1 mans. Treat your women like your other possessions(i.e. farm animals.) You want me to put a list of their prophets instructions up? I'm not creating the religion. All you apologists are ignoring the basics of that religion. Hence, you don't get why people have a problem with it.