8/7 (DMR): Clement L. Hirsch S. (G1)

[Rupert Pupkin]

What is so silly is that many of you keep making the same silly arguments that you were making last year. You all thought that she wasn't anything special because she wasn't beating much and she wasn't winning by big margins. You all thought she had little or no chance in the BC Classic.

After she stepped up and won the BC Classic, I would have thought that that would be enough for you to realize that you were wrong and that her winning margins and her level of competition are pretty much meaningless. Her win in the BC Classic proved that there's more in the tank than she's showing. And yet here you go again making this same argument that she must not be that good because she's beating mediocre competition by small margins. I just don't get it. The BC Classic proved that that argument is wrong and yet you guys still make that same argument.

I'm not saying that she's the greatest horse ever. I'm simply saying that you can't measure her based on these races because she is clearly capable of doing more as she proved in the BC Classic.

[Smooth Operator]

The Streak is drivin' the haters crazy.

[Rupert Pupkin]

Originally Posted by Smooth Operator

The Streak is drivin' the haters crazy.

That is true. It is driving them crazy.

Some of what they are saying is true. She has faced some pretty weak fields in many of her races. But she also stepped up and beat the boys in the BC Classic. Was that BC Classic a really strong field? No, I wouldn't say so but it was a good enough field. You have to be a pretty darn good mare to step up and win that race.

[CSC]

Originally Posted by Smooth Operator

The Streak is drivin' the haters crazy.

One more race in So Cal before the BC SO?

[Smooth Operator]

Originally Posted by CSC

One more race in So Cal before the BC SO?

Yeah, you can bet on it, CSC.

They don't need to ship cross-country looking for RA at this point.

It's all about the BCC now.

Prepping at home … on synthetic … gives her the best chance to be at her best for the Cup, in my estimation (although I wish the race at Anita was 9f instead of 8.5).

[The Indomitable DrugS]

Originally Posted by Rupert Pupkin

You all thought that she wasn't anything special because she wasn't beating much and she wasn't winning by big margins. You all thought she had little or no chance in the BC Classic.

I gave her a big chance to win the BC Classic last year. Who was more deserving of favortisim than her in that spot?

It was a terrible edition of the BC Classic .. Tiago had the best finish of any American in the '08 Classic.

Her competiton and margins of victory are only being so wholeheartedly mocked because of the fact that people are wildly overrating her - run a poll on who the greatest horse of all time, male or female is ... Secretariat or Spectacular Bid have NO chance with Zenyatta.

[ateamstupid]

Originally Posted by Rupert Pupkin

What is so silly is that many of you keep making the same silly arguments that you were making last year. You all thought that she wasn't anything special because she wasn't beating much and she wasn't winning by big margins. You all thought she had little or no chance in the BC Classic.

After she stepped up and won the BC Classic, I would have thought that that would be enough for you to realize that you were wrong and that her winning margins and her level of competition are pretty much meaningless. Her win in the BC Classic proved that there's more in the tank than she's showing. And yet here you go again making this same argument that she must not be that good because she's beating mediocre competition by small margins. I just don't get it. The BC Classic proved that that argument is wrong and yet you guys still make that same argument.

I'm not saying that she's the greatest horse ever. I'm simply saying that you can't measure her based on these races because she is clearly capable of doing more as she proved in the BC Classic.

Holy crap, how do you people still not understand this?

We don't think she sucks. We think she's awesome, which is what makes her campaign even more disappointing and infuriating. She's not being allowed to prove herself and her greatness. One challenging race a year isn't acceptable for a supposed all-time great. We get sick of hearing about her incredible accomplishments when she's not doing anything historically significant except extending a winning streak that no one with a brain cares about. If she's capable of more, they should show it. She's going to go down in the history books as the biggest 'what if' horse whose career wasn't ended early.

This straw man argument about how anyone who isn't satisfied with these monotonous life-and-death victories over claimers automatically must think she's awful, it has to go. She's a beast, and she deserves applause. But stop telling me how legendary she is, when she's never allowed to prove it against top competition.

[Rupert Pupkin]

Originally Posted by ateamstupid

Holy crap, how do you people still not understand this?

We don't think she sucks. We think she's awesome, which is what makes her campaign even more disappointing and infuriating. She's not being allowed to prove herself and her greatness. One challenging race a year isn't acceptable for a supposed all-time great. We get sick of hearing about her incredible accomplishments when she's not doing anything historically significant except extending a winning streak that no one with a brain cares about. If she's capable of more, they should show it. She's going to go down in the history books as the biggest 'what if' horse whose career wasn't ended early.

This straw man argument about how anyone who isn't satisfied with these monotonous life-and-death victories over claimers automatically must think she's awful, it has to go. She's a beast, and she deserves applause. But stop telling me how legendary she is, when she's never allowed to prove it against top competition.

I'm not putting you in the category of the people who don't think she's great. You have been clear that you think she's great and you would like to see her in tougher races. I can see your point. I'm not arguing your point. I'm arguing with the people that are saying she must not be that good because she's beating mediocre horses by small margins.

[ateamstupid]

Originally Posted by Rupert Pupkin

I'm not putting you in the category of the people who don't think she's great. You have been clear that you think she's great and you would like to see her in tougher races. I can see your point. I'm not arguing your point. I'm arguing with the people that are saying she must not be that good because she's beating mediocre horses by small margins.

And I think that there are far fewer of those people than you are insinuating. Most people on here, I'd say, are in my camp.

[The Indomitable DrugS]

Originally Posted by Rupert Pupkin

I'm arguing with the people that are saying she must not be that good because she's beating mediocre horses by small margins.

Ok, She's clearly better than Secreatariat and Spectacular Bid? Is that better, or do I have to go way further and say that Pepper's Pride is also better than those two?

[randallscott35]

The truth is we will never know how good she is. I think we have to come to grips with that. As a board family

[Rupert Pupkin]

Originally Posted by randallscott35

The truth is we will never know how good she is. I think we have to come to grips with that. As a board family

We will see how she runs in the BC Classic this year. That should give people a better idea.

[randallscott35]

Originally Posted by Rupert Pupkin

We will see how she runs in the BC Classic this year. That should give people a better idea.

agreed but I think she will run in the Distaff

[Indian Charlie]

Originally Posted by Rupert Pupkin

We will see how she runs in the BC Classic this year. That should give people a better idea.

And when she doesn't run in that race????????????

[Rupert Pupkin]

Originally Posted by The Indomitable DrugS

Ok, She's clearly better than Secreatariat and Spectacular Bid? Is that better, or do I have to go way further and say that Pepper's Pride is also better than those two?

Who are you argung with? I didn't hear anyone say that she is better than Secretariat or Spectacular Bid.

The Pepper's Pride argument is a joke. How can you compare a mare that's won 16 graded stakes races in a row including the BC Classic to a mare that was runing against New Mexico breds? It's absurd.

[herkhorse]

Originally Posted by Rupert Pupkin

Who are you argung with? I didn't hear anyone say that she is better than Secretariat or Spectacular Bid.

The Pepper's Pride argument is a joke. How can you compare a mare that's won 16 graded stakes races in a row including the BC Classic to a mare that was runing against New Mexico breds? It's absurd.

see? now you know how we feel. It's that simple.

[randallscott35]

The Shirreffs 3 calls a day to TVG lately about whether he will run or not is grotesque. I hope he never wins another race.

[10 pnt move up]

Whats the most interesting thing about her PP's, other than being unbeaten, is that the pace calls of her races. I would imagine without looking 15 of the 18 have had below par pace calls, to be a closer into that dynamic is pretty amazing.

The poly crap junk just makes winning that much more of a crap shoot, what did drugs say the routing favorites have done on it?

[Thunder Gulch]

Originally Posted by ateamstupid

Holy crap, how do you people still not understand this?

We don't think she sucks. We think she's awesome, which is what makes her campaign even more disappointing and infuriating. She's not being allowed to prove herself and her greatness. One challenging race a year isn't acceptable for a supposed all-time great. We get sick of hearing about her incredible accomplishments when she's not doing anything historically significant except extending a winning streak that no one with a brain cares about. If she's capable of more, they should show it. She's going to go down in the history books as the biggest 'what if' horse whose career wasn't ended early.

This straw man argument about how anyone who isn't satisfied with these monotonous life-and-death victories over claimers automatically must think she's awful, it has to go. She's a beast, and she deserves applause. But stop telling me how legendary she is, when she's never allowed to prove it against top competition.

Yeah, what he said. It's impossible to question what is a history of races against lesser competition without some of these jacks thinking you believe she sucks and taking offense to it. Clearly this is not the case. However, let's not confuse the ridiculous exhibitions vs allowance horses as legend making efforts. Is anyone seriously more impressed today by Zenyatta than Blame? No contest.

[herkhorse]

If there is more in her tank why not use it? There is no shame in losing a race once in a while FFS! If she's really the best then run against the best and there would be no argument.Yeesh! One great race out of 17, cool!, and I'm far from a hater but get real. maggots, yea right. I love the horse but you are all nuts.