What Horses are not in the Hall of Fame you think should be?

[blackthroatedwind]

Yes, Seattle Slew was an amazing horse for doing what he did with Cruget on his back.

Finally the connections had enough and got Cordero.

[cmorioles]

Dyever and Dollar Bill.

[The Indomitable DrugS]

No love for Sun King?

[blackthroatedwind]

Originally Posted by cmorioles

Dyever and Dollar Bill.

I assumed they were both already in. Surely Dynever deserves his own wing.

[Thunder Gulch]

Originally Posted by Cardus

I was a big fan of Lemon Drop Kid, but I don't think that he belongs in the Hall of Fame.

Very good, but no way he's HOF, and that's without stirring the pot by calling him a New York specialist.

[blackthroatedwind]

Of course Lemon Drop Kid doesn't belong in the Hall of Fame. But, lumping him with Cruget sort of covered up his lack of merit.

To further Cruget's merits....he was 0 for 90 something at Gulfstream in 1994. Look it up.

[kgar311]

Originally Posted by blackthroatedwind

Yes, Seattle Slew was an amazing horse for doing what he did with Cruget on his back.

Finally the connections had enough and got Cordero.

Major Racing Wins (Jean Cruguet)

United States Triple Crown (1977)
Travers Stakes (1968)
Lawrence Realization Stakes (1969, 1970, 1975, 1978)
Metropolitan Handicap (1969)
Toboggan Handicap (1969)
Cowdin Stakes (1970)
Laurel Futurity (1970)
Manhattan Handicap (1974)
Stuyvesant Handicap (1974)
Alabama Stakes (1975, 1983)
Hopeful Stakes (1975, 1976)
Champagne Stakes (1976)
Mother Goose Stakes (1976, 1977)
Flamingo Stakes (1977)
Wood Memorial Stakes (1977, 1984)
Futurity Stakes (1978)
Washington, D.C. International (1978, 1993)
Jerome Handicap (1979)
Ladies Handicap (1979)
Saranac Handicap (1979)
Withers Stakes (1979)
Blue Grass Stakes (1983)
Tremont Stakes (1983)
Coaching Club American Oaks (1984)
Dwyer Stakes (1984)
Knickerbocker Handicap (1985, 1986, 1988, 1992)
Matron Stakes (1986)
American Classic Race wins:

Kentucky Derby (1977)
Preakness Stakes (1977)
Belmont Stakes (1977)
International Race wins

Prix Vermeille (1972)
Poule d'Essai des Pouliches (1972)
Champion Stakes (1973)
Canadian International Stakes (1978, 1989)
Significant Horses

Arts and Letters, Hoist The Flag, San San, Bold Reason, Seattle Slew


Man all those horses he won these races with must of been world beaters seeing they had a rock on their back like Cruguet.

[kgar311]

Originally Posted by blackthroatedwind

Of course Lemon Drop Kid doesn't belong in the Hall of Fame. But, lumping him with Cruget sort of covered up his lack of merit.

To further Cruget's merits....he was 0 for 90 something at Gulfstream in 1994. Look it up.

Cruguet retired from racing in '89, in '94 we would of been talking about a 55yr old Cruguet. He won a G1 race in Canada at 50. The twilight of Cruguet riding career was less than stellar, we can all agree on that. But in his prime,60s-70s, he was a top jock in 2 different countries. Won all the major stakes in the states and even has a triple crown under his belt. There are jocks with far less credentials in the hall as we speak.

[blackthroatedwind]

Originally Posted by kgar311

Cruguet retired from racing in '89, in '94 we would of been talking about a 55yr old Cruguet. He won a G1 race in Canada at 50. The twilight of Cruguet riding career was less than stellar, we can all agree on that. But in his prime,60s-70s, he was a top jock in 2 different countries. Won all the major stakes in the states and even has a triple crown under his belt. There are jocks with far less credentials in the hall as we speak.

He was a terrible jockey.

[kgar311]

Originally Posted by blackthroatedwind

He was a terrible jockey.

He may have been in your book and many peoples that watched him race in the 80s, but there isnt a jockey racing now a days that wouldnt die for the credentials he has and a triple crown alone would be enough for some.

[kgar311]

Originally Posted by kgar311

Major Racing Wins

United States Triple Crown (1977)
Travers Stakes (1968)
Lawrence Realization Stakes (1969, 1970, 1975, 1978)
Metropolitan Handicap (1969)
Toboggan Handicap (1969)
Cowdin Stakes (1970)
Laurel Futurity (1970)
Manhattan Handicap (1974)
Stuyvesant Handicap (1974)
Alabama Stakes (1975, 1983)
Hopeful Stakes (1975, 1976)
Champagne Stakes (1976)
Mother Goose Stakes (1976, 1977)
Flamingo Stakes (1977)
Wood Memorial Stakes (1977, 1984)
Futurity Stakes (1978)
Washington, D.C. International (1978, 1993)
Jerome Handicap (1979)
Ladies Handicap (1979)
Saranac Handicap (1979)
Withers Stakes (1979)
Blue Grass Stakes (1983)
Tremont Stakes (1983)
Coaching Club American Oaks (1984)
Dwyer Stakes (1984)
Knickerbocker Handicap (1985, 1986, 1988, 1992)
Matron Stakes (1986)
American Classic Race wins:

Kentucky Derby (1977)
Preakness Stakes (1977)
Belmont Stakes (1977)
International Race wins

Prix Vermeille (1972)
Poule d'Essai des Pouliches (1972)
Champion Stakes (1973)
Canadian International Stakes (1978, 1989)
Significant Horses

Arts and Letters, Hoist The Flag, San San, Bold Reason, Seattle Slew

Now look at the list WITHOUT Cruguet's name attached to it and tell me that isnt a hall of fame career

[Revidere]

Originally Posted by blackthroatedwind

He was a terrible jockey.

Who said this?

"The Belmont lasts 2 and a half minutes and that's a long time to go without the Frenchman screwing it up."


Hint: He put Cruguet up on Road Princess to win the Mother Goose at 42-1 earlier in the day.

[mikekay]

Was it J. P. Campo?

[kgar311]

Not to keep beating this but here is Randy Romeros Hall of Fame Career

Randy Romero
Replace this image male.svg
Occupation Jockey
Birthplace Erath, Louisiana, United States
Birth date December 22, 1957
Career wins 4,285
Major racing wins, honours & awards
Major racing wins
Clark Handicap (1982)
Essex Handicap (1982)
Isaac Murphy Handicap (1982)
Ladies Handicap (1984, 1986)
Arlington Classic (1986)
Champagne Stakes (1986)
Coaching Club American Oaks (1986)
Cowdin Stakes (1986)
Frizette Stakes (1986)
Hawthorne Gold Cup Handicap (1986)
Jockey Club Gold Cup (1986)
Carter Handicap (1987)
Garden City Handicap (1987)
Hopeful Stakes (1987)
Jamaica Handicap (1987)
Queens County Handicap (1987)
Spinster Stakes (1987)
Woodward Stakes (1987)
Beldame Stakes (1988, 1990)
Bernard Baruch Handicap (1988)
Fall Highweight Handicap (1988, 1989)
Florida Derby (1988)
Gazelle Handicap (1988)
Queen Elizabeth II Challenge Cup Stakes (1988)
Vosburgh Stakes (1988, 1989)
Whitney Handicap (1988)
Blue Grass Stakes (1989 & 1995)
Commonwealth Stakes (1989)
Alabama Stakes (1990)
Arlington Oaks (1990)
Mother Goose Stakes (1990)
Secretariat Stakes (1990)
Test Stakes (1990)
Brooklyn Handicap (1992)
Adirondack Stakes (1993)
Arlington Handicap (1995)
Arlington-Washington Lassie Stakes (1996)

Breeders' Cup wins:
Breeders' Cup Distaff (1987, 1988)
Breeders' Cup Juvenile Fillies (1989)
Honours
Louisiana Sports Hall of Fame (2005)
National Museum of Racing and Hall of Fame (2010)
Significant horses
Polish Navy, Personal Ensign
Sacahuista, Go For Wand,

[blackthroatedwind]

Romero may or may not belong in the Hall of Fame as well....but the Cruget discussion is just too funny.

You really have to be either kidding or a relative.

I mentioned this to someone at the track today whose response to your suggestion that Cruget belongs in the Hall of Fame was " what sport? "

[blackthroatedwind]

Originally Posted by mikekay

Was it J. P. Campo?

He trained Road Princess.

[kgar311]

Originally Posted by blackthroatedwind

Romero may or may not belong in the Hall of Fame as well....but the Cruget discussion is just too funny.

You really have to be either kidding or a relative.

I do think that the HOF committee should make it ALOT more difficult for a jockey to make it in the hall. With that being said im just comparing the numbers of some jockeys already in to his. The guy won G1 races in 3 different decades in 3 different countries. Won a G1 in his 50s. Won the triple crown. I mean what more do you have to do to get in when they are letting jockeys like Romero in?

[kgar311]

Originally Posted by blackthroatedwind

Romero may or may not belong in the Hall of Fame as well....but the Cruget discussion is just too funny.

You really have to be either kidding or a relative.

I mentioned this to someone at the track today whose response to your suggestion that Cruget belongs in the Hall of Fame was " what sport? "

Well why dont you show the credentials of Cruguet without his name attached to it and then ask if that jock belongs in the HOF. Im sure 9 out of 10 would say yes

[Cannon Shell]

Growing up in Saratoga I can't remember one person ever saying a single nice thing about Jean Cruget as a jockey. If I remember correctly he was not a bad sire but those years are all a bit fuzzy....

[blackthroatedwind]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

Growing up in Saratoga I can't remember one person ever saying a single nice thing about Jean Cruget as a jockey. If I remember correctly he was not a bad sire but those years are all a bit fuzzy....

I laughed.