I believe it was the great Joisey breeder FREDDYrico MOsio who said it best...

[The Indomitable DrugS]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

FTFY

Stronach has had a lot of success making stallions out of horses that others thought werent worth standing....but I think he is way off base with this one.

His stud fee's only 5K. It's not crazy high expectations we are talking about or anything ... and heck ... they should have kept Giacomo racing with the way the older male division totally deteriorated once he retired.

In Giacomo's final career start - he was 4th beaten 4.5 lengths to Invasor, Bernardini, and Premium Tap in the BC Classic - while running a 109 Beyer. Retired sound.

Maybe his offspring might show more speed than you'd expect ... his sire and dam both had absolutely tremendous raw speed ... he... ah, not so much.

[Linny]

Lion Heart's dam was a $5k claimer at Suffolk if I recall.

[The Indomitable DrugS]

Originally Posted by Linny

Lion Heart's dam was a $5k claimer at Suffolk if I recall.

Very early on she was.

She also ended up becoming a stakes winner - and running very fast figures later on - I think Frank Stronach owned her for a while when she raced.

She was more a rags to riches race horse ... than a slowpoke bottom feeder with stamina.

[The Indomitable DrugS]

I love to monitor these sales for future bets - and more importantly bet againsts - for when these horses start to debut a few months down the line.

This sale isn't one of my favorites ('sup FT Texas and OBS April) for finding possible live debut sprinters to follow for betting purposes because it's easily the highest quality of them all & not big in the way of quantity.

One of the horses from this sale I loved the tape of was the Dehere-Friend of a Friend filly. She left ya with that 'ahhh, now that's a debut winner right there!' feeling.

She ended up selling for 250K to - sadly - Bob Baffert. Probably going to debut on synthetic now and there goes any price...even probable ML bet-down price (for singling into P3's) gets shaved some cause of Baffert.

But anyway ... forget about what you're looking to bet on or against in the future .. and put yourself in the position of the buyer.

The sire Dehere stands for 10K.

The dam Friend of a Friend was a cripple of moderate ability who once blew an easy lead in a 7.5K N2L claiming race at River Downs.



According to the catalog .. this is Friend of a Friend's 2nd foal .. her first foal is UNRACED.

As a buyer looking at expensive horses - you're getting the worst of the gender with her, you're getting a very unfashionable pedigree for the money, you're getting a filly who is very likely to have distance limitations, you're getting a filly who is probably more likely than most to have soundness issues.

It's a lot of knocks for a quarter million ... and in a market like the one a few years ago .. she would have certainly sold for a good bit more money.

[GBBob]

Originally Posted by The Indomitable DrugS

I love to monitor these sales for future bets - and more importantly bet againsts - for when these horses start to debut a few months down the line.

This sale isn't one of my favorites ('sup FT Texas and OBS April) for finding possible live debut sprinters to follow for betting purposes because it's easily the highest quality of them all & not big in the way of quantity.

One of the horses from this sale I loved the tape of was the Dehere-Friend of a Friend filly. She left ya with that 'ahhh, now that's a debut winner right there!' feeling.

She ended up selling for 250K to - sadly - Bob Baffert. Probably going to debut on synthetic now and there goes any price...even probable ML bet-down price (for singling into P3's) gets shaved some cause of Baffert.

But anyway ... forget about what you're looking to bet on or against in the future .. and put yourself in the position of the buyer.

The sire Dehere stands for 10K.

The dam Friend of a Friend was a cripple of moderate ability who once blew an easy lead in a 7.5K N2L claiming race at River Downs.



According to the catalog .. this is Friend of a Friend's 2nd foal .. her first foal is UNRACED.

As a buyer looking at expensive horses - you're getting the worst of the gender with her, you're getting a very unfashionable pedigree for the money, you're getting a filly who is very likely to have distance limitations, you're getting a filly who is probably more likely than most to have soundness issues.

It's a lot of knocks for a quarter million ... and in a market like the one a few years ago .. she would have certainly sold for a good bit more money.

So Dam wise, would you substitute Top Royelle for FOAF?

Not apples to apples I know, but just askin'

[The Indomitable DrugS]

Top Royelle was a much better race horse ... and I would think would have much more of a right to be a better broodmare. How good the foal will be is always a dice throw.

That Dehere filly brought 250K because - IMO - because she was lights out in the under track show. Baffert got himself an athlete.

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by The Indomitable DrugS

His stud fee's only 5K. It's not crazy high expectations we are talking about or anything ... and heck ... they should have kept Giacomo racing with the way the older male division totally deteriorated once he retired.

In Giacomo's final career start - he was 4th beaten 4.5 lengths to Invasor, Bernardini, and Premium Tap in the BC Classic - while running a 109 Beyer. Retired sound.

Maybe his offspring might show more speed than you'd expect ... his sire and dam both had absolutely tremendous raw speed ... he... ah, not so much.

he started at 10k and while Stronach always breeds his own mares to his stallions he seemingly was breeding him to way more than Giacomo had a right to breed. They also sold a ton of mares in foal to him including some nice, young prospects but I refused to put money into a giacomo foal and passed on all of them.