HOY - what is the benefit?

OK ... here's the real simple answer ...

... in most years ... it's widely known who will be named Horse Of The Year long in advance of the voting ... so ...

... by the time the actual voting takes place ... and is announced ... retirement plans have long been finalized ... and the actual designation means little ... especially nowadays ... when few horses race again after winning the honor.

[Revolution]

Originally Posted by Bold Brooklynite

OK ... here's the real simple answer ...

... in most years ... it's widely known who will be named Horse Of The Year long in advance of the voting ... so ...

... by the time the actual voting takes place ... and is announced ... retirement plans have long been finalized ... and the actual designation means little ... especially nowadays ... when few horses race again after winning the honor.

this is not correct. there are often escalators in contracts. you have to remember a decent horse that might stand for $25K can boost his fee to $50K with the honor. that means millions for the first two to three years.

Originally Posted by Revolution

this is not correct. there are often escalators in contracts. you have to remember a decent horse that might stand for $25K can boost his fee to $50K with the honor. that means millions for the first two to three years.

See my Post #12 on this thread ...

... it addresses those circumstances.

[Revolution]

Originally Posted by Bold Brooklynite

See my Post #12 on this thread ...

... it addresses those circumstances.

unfortunately i have never owned one, but you are partially correct that it is an award for bragging rights more than for fees.

Originally Posted by Revolution

unfortunately i have never owned one, but you are partially correct that it is an award for bragging rights more than for fees.

It's simply a matter of timing ... when negotiattions take place toward the end of the year ... it's usually known if the stallion prospect has already earned HOTY ... so the actual award makes little difference.

If negotiations take place early in the year ... there'll be a bonus clause. If the horse doesn't earn HOTY ... there's no bonus. If he does earn HOTY ... the bonus applies ... but ... the owner probably would have done just as well without the bonus if he had waited 'til the end of the racing season.

Originally Posted by Bold Brooklynite

See my Post #12 on this thread ...

... it addresses those circumstances.

Bold you are dead wrong, completely wrong.
Any contract done on a horse who isn't doen racing yet includes bonuses.
I can tell you this for a fact.
Its the only way the deals get done.
Noone would sell breeding rights before the horse was done racing without them.
When you work on one of these deals, gimme a ring.

Originally Posted by oracle80

Bold you are dead wrong, completely wrong.
Any contract done on a horse who isn't doen racing yet includes bonuses.
I can tell you this for a fact.
Its the only way the deals get done.
Noone would sell breeding rights before the horse was done racing without them.
When you work on one of these deals, gimme a ring.

You're right ...

... and so am I ... see Post #22.

Originally Posted by Bold Brooklynite

You're right ...

... and so am I ... see Post #22.

You really aren't.
There are lots more clauses than just HOY.
In some cases:
Win a grade one(assuming the horse hasn't won on yet)- one mill
every additional grade one- 1 mill
wins championship- 1-3 mill
wins HOY- 1-5 mill

Thats how these deals are done.
Bonus clauses became popular because farms wanted to gamble on a prospect who had upside. Owners didn't wanna lose all that possible upside and would wait until the horse was done racing to do a deal.
On these clauses, they way they are designed, believe me the last words spoken by the farm that buys the rights are "Man, I sure hope I get to send you another 5 million". Seller "me too!!"

Originally Posted by oracle80

You really aren't.

I really am ...

... if a horse runs well enough to earn all the bonuses ... his owner would probably have gotten about the same if he waited until the racing season was over to talk turkey.

If the horse doesn't run well enough to earn any bonuses ... well ... there are no bonuses ... so the owner doesn't get any more money.

In either case ... the owner winds up with about the same amount of money ... if he syndicates early in the year ... or if he waits 'til the end of the year.

Early season + Bonus(es) = Late season without bonus(es)

Chisled in stone for a good reason.

[Rupert Pupkin]

Originally Posted by Bold Brooklynite

You're right ...

... and so am I ... see Post #22.

Winning HOY was huge for Saint Liam. It made his value much greater and that deal was made late in the year. After he won the BC Classic, it was a foregone conclusion that he would win HOY. I don't know if there was any clause in the contract about the terms changing if he somehow didn't win HOY. I can tell you that winning HOY always makes a difference in the value of the horse. Winning HOY is a big deal.

I don't think that Kurt's question was a dumb question at all. I have been in the business for a long time and didn't even know the answer of that question until last year. I actually asked one of my trainers who has been involved in many syndications deal that same question. I asked him if HOY meant anything. He told me it makes the horse's value for breeding go way up. He said winning HOY is a huge deal monetarily.