Andy Beyer, Dutrow, DRF

[blackthroatedwind]

Originally Posted by pweizer

I don't get into pissing matches on the internet. They can't be won. People can say whatever they want about others they have never met. You apparently know him far better than I do.

Paul

You don't want to get into a pissing match, which I understand, but actually you are the only one in this thread that made unfair accusations. Don't you feel a need to answer to that?

[Scav]

Man oh man. Gotta love a 'drugs' conversation. Want to get a message board going, talk about drugs, jockeys, hilarious announcers, or bs horses.

The only people that know what is going on are the people themselves, and the people that possibly may be helping them. All of this is obvious statistical speculation, which can be considered strong. Personally I can only go off what I hear, my opinion is almost worthless when it comes to this topic.

I will say that the move ups of both MA and Its a Bird are quite interesting. Its a Bird couldn't win a race at Arlington Park last year and now he is winning 500k races. I don't know what he is doing, but whatever he is doing, it works.

[Pedigree Ann]

Originally Posted by Scav

M Its a Bird couldn't win a race at Arlington Park last year and now he is winning 500k races. I don't know what he is doing, but whatever he is doing, it works.

Now that one isn't hard: hates Poly. Don't let the purse fool you: this race is a gift to Florida/Cal breeders and the people who buy them and could have been run for a fifth of the purse and attracted the same horses.

With MA, maybe Wolfson fixed the horse's feet (there are a lot of farriers who still cut toe-long, heel-short), or his teeth, or his stomach (undiagnosed ulcers) or his brain. Maybe the horse needed more conditioning between races, or less. There are so many things that can effect a horse's performance that aren't drugs that it can be hard to disentangle the effects.

[The Indomitable DrugS]

Originally Posted by Pedigree Ann

Now that one isn't hard: hates Poly.

Funny - he seemed to hate all surfaces for Pletcher. Especially dirt. Heck, when Larry Pilloti trained him, he got beat in a lifetime condition claiming race on dirt.

[Scav]

Originally Posted by The Indomitable DrugS

Funny - he seemed to hate all surfaces for Pletcher. Especially dirt. Heck, when Larry Pilloti trained him, he got beat in a lifetime condition claiming race on dirt.

I wasn't even going to respond to her ridiculousness.

[sumitas]

I can't imagine Pletcher not knowing surfaces . The man is a great trainer .

[Kasept]

Originally Posted by sumitas

I can't imagine Pletcher not knowing surfaces . The man is a great trainer .

What makes you think Todd Pletcher ever even saw Ikigai? Ever? Do you think Pletcher spends a great deal of time overseeing his Chicago string? No one has brought up that a lot of horses that have 'Trained by Todd Pletcher' attached to them are trained by him in name only. Pletcher is indeed great, but even he is hard-pressed to lay hands and eyes on the 300 horses in the 5-6 venues that have his name on the shed. They're being trained by his assistants in the Pletcher "program" method. Every horse treated more or less the same. So when one or 20 of them fall through the cracks because they didn't respond to the "program" and needed singular attention, don't be so dumbfounded.