Inducement for stamina-building breeding?

[Kasept]

Originally Posted by DaHoss9698

The marathon has been a great idea. I know I can't wait for the epic battle between Delosvientos and Big Booster.

Isn't that being short-sighted Jay? If the idea was too make-over the route-going handicap division, you have to start somewhere. While there may be a dearth of quality competitors in the 12f 'division' this year, this could end up a successful concept long term.

If the purse money is big they will wait and come. You dont even need to worry about the sire thing. Long races for bucks. Do the wagerers want to see these long races and would the tracks put them up.

Big Market for long races?

No offense to European racing but if the races end up like that in this country I, and I'm sure many others, will stop supporting this sport.

[Kasept]

Originally Posted by DaHoss9698

The idea of a marathon distance division is the direct opposite to what the breeders are doing right now. It's speed, speed and more speed. In my opinion, thinking that carding a few extra races a year, so that glorified claimers can run in a Breeders Cup race is being kind of naive.

This is partially why I was so honery about the hearings the other day. The racing secretaries group resolved 2 years ago to card more routes in the attempt to reinforce opportunities for older horses. That has morphed into a cohesive program incorporating 10-12f events leading to the BC Dirt Marathon and I can't see why there would be disdain at its' prospect.

[paisjpq]

Originally Posted by Kasept

This is partially why I was so honery about the hearings the other day. The racing secretaries group resolved 2 years ago to card more routes in the attempt to reinforce opportunities for older horses. That has morphed into a cohesive program incorporating 10-12f events leading to the BC Dirt Marathon and I can't see why there would be disdain at its' prospect.

ornery?

[Payson Dave]

Originally Posted by paisjpq

ornery?

...either that or horny??

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by paisjpq

ornery?

He was so mad he may have become aroused?

[paisjpq]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

He was so mad he may have become aroused?

I just choked on my free-range, grain fed, organic egg salad

[Danzig]

Originally Posted by paisjpq

I just choked on my free-range, grain fed, organic egg salad

free range eggs??? what, they lay in the sun instead of an incubator??

[Payson Dave]

How do you feed grain to an egg???

[paisjpq]

Originally Posted by Danzig

free range eggs??? what, they lay in the sun instead of an incubator??

it was a reference to a certain someone who finds my eating habits rather unorthodox....free-range as in outdoor chickens (from the Amish farm up the street in this case)....grain fed as in no hormones or other animals.

[Bobby Fischer]

with the BC Marathon being on synthetic for 2 straight years, the horses that should be entering are the more competitive also rans from Arlington Million and Sword Dancer days.

11 and 12 furlong turf horses who are almost good enough to try the BC Turf.

[Cajungator26]

Originally Posted by Payson Dave

...either that or horny.

Most likely the latter.

[Kasept]

Originally Posted by DaHoss9698

Prospect for what? A Breeders Cup Claiming race? I've very excited about it. I just don't think we are going to see the top class horses competing in these races. We clearly aren't getting it now and I really don't think the game is suddenly going to change. Do you? Until the people breeding the horses are behind it, it's a waste of time IMO.

Of course it won't change things overnight, but considering how everyone has been so critical that little gets done in the game, I don't understand the disinterest in supporting a pro-active direction like this no matter how inconsequential its' effect may be in the short term.

[Cajungator26]

Originally Posted by DaHoss9698

I'll believe it when I see it. Thats's all I'm saying.

Sissy.

[Cannon Shell]

Races that are restricted to certain sires are an interesting way to go but since they cant be graded they will never be really important. The best thing that could happen to horse 'racing' at the higher levels is the elimination of the grading system. It is too easy to gain "credentials" with the grading system by winning or placing in one graded race regardless of the strenght or weakness of the race. The way commercial breeders think all grade 3's are pretty much equal because they are the same grade. After a few years everybody forgets the relative strength or weakness of a race and it is remembered as a Grade 3 win period. Graded placings and wins gives far too much value to ordinary horses who happen to luck into a weak division or watered down race. I dont think there is one fan who won't attend the Travers because there is no grade attached to it. I dont think there is one fan who would attend a race because the races grade was added or moved up. I know the breeders will hate this it but it may help.

[RolloTomasi]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

Races that are restricted to certain sires are an interesting way to go but since they cant be graded they will never be really important. The best thing that could happen to horse 'racing' at the higher levels is the elimination of the grading system. It is too easy to gain "credentials" with the grading system by winning or placing in one graded race regardless of the strenght or weakness of the race. The way commercial breeders think all grade 3's are pretty much equal because they are the same grade. After a few years everybody forgets the relative strength or weakness of a race and it is remembered as a Grade 3 win period. Graded placings and wins gives far too much value to ordinary horses who happen to luck into a weak division or watered down race. I dont think there is one fan who won't attend the Travers because there is no grade attached to it. I dont think there is one fan who would attend a race because the races grade was added or moved up. I know the breeders will hate this it but it may help.

I agree with this and have suggested it elsewhere. Maybe not necessarily across the board, but wouldn't the elimination of graded designations for at least juvenile races preclude certain "stallion producing" stables and farms from securing breeding rights to top 2yos with the intention of early retirement?

I think purse restrictions on the top 2yo races would also discourage those sorts of moves, though it might not be particularly fair in the short term for owners trying to make money by actually racing their horses.

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by RolloTomasi

I agree with this and have suggested it elsewhere. Maybe not necessarily across the board, but wouldn't the elimination of graded designations for at least juvenile races preclude certain "stallion producing" stables and farms from securing breeding rights to top 2yos with the intention of early retirement?

I think purse restrictions on the top 2yo races would also discourage those sorts of moves, though it might not be particularly fair in the short term for owners trying to make money by actually racing their horses.

I guess I was thinking more of the fillies as most of the stallion making races dont need grades for anyone to know they are important. The grade just overinflates the value of so many fillies that may stick around another year to try to pad the resume if they dont have that grade to fall back on. Who knows how many would thrive with another year of racing? But you do have a point on the premature breeding rights deals.

[Pedigree Ann]

Originally Posted by RolloTomasi

I agree with this and have suggested it elsewhere. Maybe not necessarily across the board, but wouldn't the elimination of graded designations for at least juvenile races preclude certain "stallion producing" stables and farms from securing breeding rights to top 2yos with the intention of early retirement?

I think purse restrictions on the top 2yo races would also discourage those sorts of moves, though it might not be particularly fair in the short term for owners trying to make money by actually racing their horses.

When graded started, there were no G1 races raced at 6f or 7f except a couple for 2yos. The only G1 race at 8f was the Met Mile and the only G1 race at 1 1/16 was the Californian (again for 3 and up). Including turf races. The Monmouth H (Iselin), Gulfstream Park H, Widener H and Woodward H were all G1 10f tests for the East Coast handicap horses, with the championship race at the end of the season the Jockey Club Gold Cup at 2 miles. And the 10f Trenton H and Meadowlands Cup gave G2 prep races and prizes for second level stayers. Horses who could stay less than 10f had limited chances to garner a G1 win after their 3yo spring.

The grading system has been warped and distorted by the committee that has set up the absurd 'objective' criteria that end up making G1s of sprints that tracks throw a lot of money into.

[ateamstupid]

How about races limited to horses whose parents weren't made of glass.