Best race in Delaware Park history???

[Danzig]

Originally Posted by jcs11204

giants causeway has the potential to be one of the best sires ever, i have been saying that for years...

as for him on the track, well listen, ppl on this site say curlin would get destroyed in the ARC, so what does that say about the giant, he came here first time on dirt vs americas best, and almost got it done.... he is very underated as a race horse and sire.

GC always got his just due as a racer, and he's overrated as a sire. especially by you.

[parsixfarms]

Originally Posted by jcs11204

heatseeker
first samurai

First Samurai is retired. Heatseeker is an older horse that has thrived on synthetic surfaces, and did not win a stakes race here until he was 5; he's not going to change Giant's Causeway's perception. GC needs to produce a good 2YO or 3YO on conventional dirt or his stock will continue to fall.

[jcs11204]

Originally Posted by Danzig

you'd be better off cheering for tiznow, he's turning out to be quite a sire, without the price tag.

and they asked for dirt horses, heatseeker is a dirt horse? besides, if that's the best/all he can produce at his price, he needs to go back to the uk.

heetseeker is the second best older horse in the usa right now, and you really cant even argue that...

and oaklawn park is dirt ? correct ? heetseeker did run huge there, and earned a decent number, comparable to curlins races.

[jcs11204]

Originally Posted by parsixfarms

First Samurai is retired. Heatseeker is an older horse that has thrived on synthetic surfaces, and did not win a stakes race here until he was 5; he's not going to change Giant's Causeway's perception. GC needs to produce a good 2YO or 3YO on conventional dirt or his stock will continue to fall.

first sam, he was a great 2 yr old... on conventional dirt... and with racing now a days, major meets like keenland on synthatic, i dont really think it matters.

[Danzig]

Originally Posted by jcs11204

heetseeker is the second best older horse in the usa right now, and you really cant even argue that...

and oaklawn park is dirt ? correct ?

heatseeker manages one second at oaklawn, and now he's a dirt horse? and again, if that's the best horses (and two at that) that giants causeway can produce, he needs a serious price reduction!

as for second best of anything, who cares whose second. you think five years down the road, someone will care it was the lakers who finished second in the '08 season?

[jcs11204]

Originally Posted by Danzig

heatseeker manages one second at oaklawn, and now he's a dirt horse? and again, if that's the best horses (and two at that) that giants causeway can produce, he needs a serious price reduction!

as for second best of anything, who cares whose second. you think five years down the road, someone will care it was the lakers who finished second in the '08 season?

so if heetseeker wins the breeders cup classic, that does nothing for giants causeway as a sire ? is that what your saying. ?

because with curlins status, right now heetseeker has to be the favorite for the classic.

[jcs11204]

Originally Posted by Danzig

heatseeker manages one second at oaklawn, and now he's a dirt horse? and again, if that's the best horses (and two at that) that giants causeway can produce, he needs a serious price reduction!

as for second best of anything, who cares whose second. you think five years down the road, someone will care it was the lakers who finished second in the '08 season?

the way you say manages ? name a older horse besides curlin, who can beat heetseeker on dirt ? ... i think he could actually run with curlin

[Danzig]

Originally Posted by DaHoss9698

I actually disagree that he gets his due for what he did on the track, at least in this country. He is overated as a sire and this fascination stuff is weird. But he was a hell of a runner.

i thought he got a lot of credit here, especially after his bc--and that that was why they kept him here to stand.

[Danzig]

Originally Posted by jcs11204

the way you say manages ? name a older horse besides curlin, who can beat heetseeker on dirt ? ... i think he could actually run with curlin

tiago beat him on dirt.

[jcs11204]

Originally Posted by Danzig

tiago beat him on dirt.

tiago is a good horse, who continues to find himself in paceless races....
i know ppl who think very highly of tiago.

[Danzig]

Originally Posted by jcs11204

so if heetseeker wins the breeders cup classic, that does nothing for giants causeway as a sire ? is that what your saying. ?

because with curlins status, right now heetseeker has to be the favorite for the classic.

dirt is king in the us, regardless of where the bc is run. winning on AWT only cements the perception the giants causeway can't sire a top dirt horse.

[jcs11204]

Originally Posted by DaHoss9698

Maybe I'm remembering it wrong. Either way I need to get out of this conversation soon or my head is going to explode.

please stay

[Danzig]

Originally Posted by jcs11204

tiago is a good horse, who continues to find himself in paceless races....
i know ppl who think very highly of tiago.

congratulations.

as for paceless races, that's just another excuse for not winning.

[Danzig]

Originally Posted by DaHoss9698

Maybe I'm remembering it wrong. Either way I need to get out of this conversation soon or my head is going to explode.

what's wrong dahoss, the tone getting too shrill in here?

or was it the 'heatseeker can run with curlin' comment??

[jcs11204]

Originally Posted by Danzig

dirt is king in the us, regardless of where the bc is run. winning on AWT only cements the perception the giants causeway can't sire a top dirt horse.

i disagree... how is dirt king still ? dont get me wrong, i love dirt, and i hate synthetic, i would prefer every track dirt, but the next 2 breeders cup's are more then likely on AWT.... major tracks keenland and arlington, woodbine, all of Cali.... As much as i hate to say it AWT is taking over...

[jcs11204]

Originally Posted by Danzig

congratulations.

as for paceless races, that's just another excuse for not winning.

im not sticking up for him... but its a fact... he runs into these small groups, heetseeker is more tactical then him... i will say tiago was a bit flat to begin the year, but Mike Veitch is high on him.

[parsixfarms]

Originally Posted by jcs11204

first sam, he was a great 2 yr old... on conventional dirt... and with racing now a days, major meets like keenland on synthatic, i dont really think it matters.

If the fact that he hasn't produced a top 2YO or 3YO dirt horse in this country in the past three years doesn't matter (First Samurai was in his first crop), then why then has his advertised stud fee dropped from $300,000 to $125,000?

[jcs11204]

Originally Posted by Danzig

what's wrong dahoss, the tone getting too shrill in here?

or was it the 'heatseeker can run with curlin' comment??

i said i think, and if not heatseeker then who else ?

if they raced today on AWT, who wins ?

[jcs11204]

Originally Posted by parsixfarms

If the fact that he hasn't produced a top 2YO or 3YO dirt horse in this country in the past three years doesn't matter (First Samurai was in his first crop), then why then has his advertised stud fee dropped from $300,000 to $125,000?

125 is a bargain

[Danzig]

Originally Posted by jcs11204

i disagree... how is dirt king still ? dont get me wrong, i love dirt, and i hate synthetic, i would prefer every track dirt, but the next 2 breeders cup's are more then likely on AWT.... major tracks keenland and arlington, woodbine, all of Cali.... As much as i hate to say it AWT is taking over...

churchill, belmont, saratoga. dirt is still the #1 surface here, regardless of cali. as for keeneland, they are part owner of an AWT company, so no joke they switched.