Watch GAZA die

[Downthestretch55]

Originally Posted by pgardn

Way too simplistic. People have been killing each other in the name of Muhammed long before we were even a nation... and in the name of Christ, and for money and goods. We back tyrants because they give a sense of stability. As did the Taliban in Afghanistan.

Add that this the fact that democracy is NOT the natural state of things. This is the one thing that is very hard to swallow for many people. The amount of latitude that individuals have in this country is a gift from heaven and seems to be a short-lived social structure. Thats how I see it.

Depressing, but I have read too much history. I'm sure someone has written a book on how tough it is to start a democracy and the rule of Law in today's world, or in any world. I dont think Im the first person to see this.

Pgardn,
I'm not attempting to be simplistic.
Democracy is a worthy goal, but look at how well the US imposition of it is doing in Iraq, especially when we previously had a compliant tyrant named Saddam.
Mao said, "Power comes from the barrel of a gun."
Sadly, that's exactly what it's looking like to me.
Israel is now inside of Iran's box.
Where does that leave the US with all of the altrusistic dreams of establishing democracies in the Middle East? Hmmmm...and how many American military will pay with their lives before the "leaders" realize that fact?

Originally Posted by Downthestretch55

Pgardn,
I'm not attempting to be simplistic.
Democracy is a worthy goal, but look at how well the US imposition of it is doing in Iraq, especially when we previously had a compliant tyrant named Saddam.
Mao said, "Power comes from the barrel of a gun."
Sadly, that's exactly what it's looking like to me.
Israel is now inside of Iran's box.
Where does that leave the US with all of the altrusistic dreams of establishing democracies in the Middle East? Hmmmm...and how many American military will pay with their lives before the "leaders" realize that fact?

You are allowed to have the dreams. What "we" do is changed by people like you and I. We are the US DTS. So get yourself into a political office.

I listened to NPR the other day and they told this story about a middle Eastern ruler that would incarcerate(sp?) anyone who imagined he was dead.
"We" cant pawn this off on anyone but ourselves. No Reps this, Demo's that stuff.

[Downthestretch55]

Originally Posted by pgardn

You are allowed to have the dreams. What "we" do is changed by people like you and I. We are the US DTS. So get yourself into a political office.

I listened to NPR the other day and they told this story about a middle Eastern ruler that would incarcerate(sp?) anyone who imagined he was dead.
"We" cant pawn this off on anyone but ourselves. No Reps this, Demo's that stuff.

Pgardn,
You get no disagreement on this from me.
As an aside, I have previously served in a political office. No thanks!
I learned my lesson, and came out before I could be bought.
Yes, WE (US) all own what we've wrought. We bought it, we fund it, and we can't pawn it off on anyone but ourselves.
It's not a Rep or Dem issue.
though I wish one of those hadn't been so tough of the Dixie Chicks or France.

Originally Posted by Downthestretch55

Pgardn,
though I wish one of those hadn't been so tough of the Dixie Chicks or France.

Hindsight...

Move forward. I dont think the Dixie Chicks knew that 400,000 troops making sure the infrastructure of Iraq was taken care of would do the trick. In hindsight it was the appropriate action if we were totally committed to removing all WMD's AND securing the country. And WE voted to move in.

But WE could not tolerate that type of commitment. Another lesson learned could very well be: IF YOU WANT TO GET A JOB DONE, DONT DO IT HALF-AS SED. Some say it was a mistake in the first place, others say we did the job half way. Colin Powell thinks it was correct to go in, but we did not send nearly enough troops... So anything goes looking back.
France did not look very smart after WWI, WWII, Vietnam... so their history allows them to tell us we told you so? Does not make the country that gave us Napolean correct either.

[SentToStud]

I think the best current reporting on this is in the Jerusalem Post. Lots of great and balanced reporting and opinion pieces. You can get a real good sense of the politics involved. www.jpost.com. There's a fairly new book out by Dennis Ross named Statecraft. Ross was Middle East policy chief under Bush 1 and Clinton.

Originally Posted by SentToStud

I think the best current reporting on this is in the Jerusalem Post. Lots of great and balanced reporting and opinion pieces. You can get a real good sense of the politics involved. www.jpost.com. There's a fairly new book out by Dennis Ross named Statecraft. Ross was Middle East policy chief under Bush 1 and Clinton.

Thanks.
I needed a read. I think I will go get this. Can ya believe I get tired of reading Physics sometimes. Really, I do like books on the Middle East. From Beirut to Jerusalem was one of the first books that got me more interested, to try and figure it out, and I find I just get more confused. The more ya know, the less ya know ya know thing.