A funny thing happened on the way to the coronation...

[CheekyBird]

Originally Posted by Rupert Pupkin

Everybody knows that Republicans try to suppress votes from legitimate, registered voters. How anybody could believe such BS is unbelievable. But that is the only argument that dems can make to stop legitimate voter ID laws. There is no possible legitimate argument against wanting people to have to show ID. It is the only way that you can assure at least some integrity in elections. Since there is no legitimate argument against making people show ID, the dems claim that making people show ID will disenfranchise people. It is one of the most absurd things I have ever heard. But even more shocking is that some gullible people actually believe it.

In this country you need to show ID for practically everything. To argue that you shouldn't have to show ID to vote is beyond ludicrous. In California, there is a list of voters posted on the wall outside of every precinct. It gives every voter's name and address for that precinct. So you can look at the list and choose a name and walk into the polling place and vote using that name. If you wanted to, you could do this at 30 different polling places. You can literally vote as many times as you want and there is virtually no way to get caught. How many people do this? I have no idea, but to say that nobody is doing it is absurd. In any competition, people will try to cheat. Even when there are safeguards in place, there are some people that will still cheat. So when there are no safeguards in place, there will obviously be plenty of cheating.

To say that we should not take steps to ensure the integrity of elections is crazy. The dem leaders know that there is plenty of cheating. The Project Veritas sting operation proved that people high up in the democratic party are in on the cheating. The only reason that dems don't want voter ID laws put in place is because they know it will make it harder for them to cheat.

It is completely reasonable to require that voters present valid identification that permits them to vote. It is only after being challenged in court that several states that engaged in unreasonable ID requirement practices NOW have reasonable requirements.

Voter suppression ID practices include disallowing student IDs, requiring 80 year-olds who don't drive but have voted since blacks were permitted to vote produce birth certificates or travel miles to obtain "valid" voter identification.

Voter ID Laws notwithstanding, it is completely dishonest to suggest that there haven't been efforts to make voting (particularly for minorities and poor people who would vote democratic) if not difficult, frustrating.

Here's a compilation of quotes and efforts towards that end:

Governor Chris Christie: Same-Day Voter Registration Is a “Trick” and GOP Needs to Win Gubernatorial Races So They Control “Voting Mechanisms”


***(Let me hasten to add that I am conflicted about same day registration. There should be a voter registration period and deadlines that must be adhered to, but it is not a "trick" and why should the GOP "control" voting mechanisms??)***


Georgia Senator Fran Miller Complains About Polling Place Being Too Convenient for Black Voters: “[T]his location is dominated by African-American shoppers and it is near several large African-American mega churches such as New Birth Missionary Baptist… Is it possible church buses will be used to transport people directly to the mall since the poll will open when the mall opens?



In 2012, Republican officials in Ohio were limiting early voting hours in Democratic-majority counties, while expanding them on nights and weekends in Republican counties. In response to public outcry, Ohio Secretary of State Jon Husted mandated the same early voting hours in all 88 Ohio counties. He kept early voting hours from 8 a.m. to 5 p.m. on weekdays from October 2 to 19 and broadened hours from 8 a.m. to 7 p.m. from October 22 to November 2. But he refused to expand voting hours beyond 7 p.m. during the week, on weekends or three days prior to the election — which is when voting is most convenient for many working-class Ohioans. Here’s what the Franklin Party (Columbus) Ohio GOP chair, Doug Preis said about limiting early voting. “I guess I really actually feel we shouldn’t contort the voting process to accommodate the urban — read African-American — voter-turnout machine.” (And yes, he actually said “read African-American,” that wasn’t inserted.)


In an interview last year with The Daily Show, Don Yelton, a GOP precinct chair in Buncombe County, North Carolina, defended the state’s new voter ID law, saying so many offensive things, he was asked to resign the day after it aired. Yelton admits at the start of the segment that the number of Buncombe County residents who commit voter fraud is one or two out of 60,000 a year. The interview correspondent, Aasif Mandvi, replies that those numbers show “there’s enough voter fraud to sway zero elections,” and[b] then Yelton replies, [/B]“Mmmm…that’s not the point.” He goes on to say that “if it hurts a bunch of lazy blacks that want the government to give them everything, so be it.” and then adds, “The law is going to kick the Democrats in the butt.”


More: http://billmoyers.com/2014/10/24/voter-discrimination/

[mclem0822]

Originally Posted by CheekyBird

It is completely reasonable to require that voters present valid identification that permits them to vote. It is only after being challenged in court that several states that engaged in unreasonable ID requirement practices now have reasonable requirements.

Voter suppression ID practices includes disallowing student IDs, requiring 80 year-olds who don't drive but have voted since blacks were permitted to vote produce birth certificates or travel miles to obtain "valid" voter identification.

Voter ID Laws notwithstanding, it is completely dishonest to suggest that there haven't been efforts to make voting (particularly for minorities and poor people who would vote democratic) if not difficult, frustrating.

Here's a compilation of quotes and efforts towards that end:

Governor Chris Christie: Same-Day Voter Registration Is a “Trick” and GOP Needs to Win Gubernatorial Races So They Control “Voting Mechanisms”


***(Let me hasten to add that I am conflicted about same day registration. There should be a voter registration period and deadlines that must be adhered to, but it is not a "trick" and why should the GOP "control" voting mechanisms??)***


Georgia Senator Fran Miller Complains About Polling Place Being Too Convenient for Black Voters: “[T]his location is dominated by African-American shoppers and it is near several large African-American mega churches such as New Birth Missionary Baptist… Is it possible church buses will be used to transport people directly to the mall since the poll will open when the mall opens?



In 2012, Republican officials in Ohio were limiting early voting hours in Democratic-majority counties, while expanding them on nights and weekends in Republican counties. In response to public outcry, Ohio Secretary of State Jon Husted mandated the same early voting hours in all 88 Ohio counties. He kept early voting hours from 8 a.m. to 5 p.m. on weekdays from October 2 to 19 and broadened hours from 8 a.m. to 7 p.m. from October 22 to November 2. But he refused to expand voting hours beyond 7 p.m. during the week, on weekends or three days prior to the election — which is when voting is most convenient for many working-class Ohioans. Here’s what the Franklin Party (Columbus) Ohio GOP chair, Doug Preis said about limiting early voting. “I guess I really actually feel we shouldn’t contort the voting process to accommodate the urban — read African-American — voter-turnout machine.” (And yes, he actually said “read African-American,” that wasn’t inserted.)


In an interview last year with The Daily Show, Don Yelton, a GOP precinct chair in Buncombe County, North Carolina, defended the state’s new voter ID law, saying so many offensive things, he was asked to resign the day after it aired. Yelton admits at the start of the segment that the number of Buncombe County residents who commit voter fraud is one or two out of 60,000 a year. The interview correspondent, Aasif Mandvi, replies that those numbers show “there’s enough voter fraud to sway zero elections,” and[b] then Yelton replies, [/B]“Mmmm…that’s not the point.” He goes on to say that “if it hurts a bunch of lazy blacks that want the government to give them everything, so be it.” and then adds, “The law is going to kick the Democrats in the butt.”


More: http://billmoyers.com/2014/10/24/voter-discrimination/

[Rupert Pupkin]

Originally Posted by CheekyBird

It is completely reasonable to require that voters present valid identification that permits them to vote. It is only after being challenged in court that several states that engaged in unreasonable ID requirement practices NOW have reasonable requirements.

Voter suppression ID practices include disallowing student IDs, requiring 80 year-olds who don't drive but have voted since blacks were permitted to vote produce birth certificates or travel miles to obtain "valid" voter identification.

Voter ID Laws notwithstanding, it is completely dishonest to suggest that there haven't been efforts to make voting (particularly for minorities and poor people who would vote democratic) if not difficult, frustrating.

Here's a compilation of quotes and efforts towards that end:

Governor Chris Christie: Same-Day Voter Registration Is a “Trick” and GOP Needs to Win Gubernatorial Races So They Control “Voting Mechanisms”


***(Let me hasten to add that I am conflicted about same day registration. There should be a voter registration period and deadlines that must be adhered to, but it is not a "trick" and why should the GOP "control" voting mechanisms??)***


Georgia Senator Fran Miller Complains About Polling Place Being Too Convenient for Black Voters: “[T]his location is dominated by African-American shoppers and it is near several large African-American mega churches such as New Birth Missionary Baptist… Is it possible church buses will be used to transport people directly to the mall since the poll will open when the mall opens?



In 2012, Republican officials in Ohio were limiting early voting hours in Democratic-majority counties, while expanding them on nights and weekends in Republican counties. In response to public outcry, Ohio Secretary of State Jon Husted mandated the same early voting hours in all 88 Ohio counties. He kept early voting hours from 8 a.m. to 5 p.m. on weekdays from October 2 to 19 and broadened hours from 8 a.m. to 7 p.m. from October 22 to November 2. But he refused to expand voting hours beyond 7 p.m. during the week, on weekends or three days prior to the election — which is when voting is most convenient for many working-class Ohioans. Here’s what the Franklin Party (Columbus) Ohio GOP chair, Doug Preis said about limiting early voting. “I guess I really actually feel we shouldn’t contort the voting process to accommodate the urban — read African-American — voter-turnout machine.” (And yes, he actually said “read African-American,” that wasn’t inserted.)


In an interview last year with The Daily Show, Don Yelton, a GOP precinct chair in Buncombe County, North Carolina, defended the state’s new voter ID law, saying so many offensive things, he was asked to resign the day after it aired. Yelton admits at the start of the segment that the number of Buncombe County residents who commit voter fraud is one or two out of 60,000 a year. The interview correspondent, Aasif Mandvi, replies that those numbers show “there’s enough voter fraud to sway zero elections,” and[b] then Yelton replies, [/B]“Mmmm…that’s not the point.” He goes on to say that “if it hurts a bunch of lazy blacks that want the government to give them everything, so be it.” and then adds, “The law is going to kick the Democrats in the butt.”


More: http://billmoyers.com/2014/10/24/voter-discrimination/

In 2000, there were some overseas ballots of servicemen that hadn't been counted. Gore and Lieberman tried to block those ballots from being counted. There are some politicians on both sides of the aisle that will try to win at any cost. But in general I think the vast majority of citizens on both sides think that anyone who is a citizen should be able to vote, and I also think that the vast majority of citizens on both of the aisle think that you should be required to show a valid ID when you vote.

As I said before, California is a joke. No ID is required. You walk in to the polling place and you tell them your name. Then they ask you for your address, you give it to them, they find it on their list, you sign your name, they cross your name off and give you your ballot. But as I said before, every person's address is posted outside the polling place. So if a person wanted to they could find a name that has not voted yet (the list is updated every 2 hours) and then walk in and claim to be that person. There would be practically no way to get caught. How insane is that? If anyone bothered checking the signatures after the fact, they would see that the signature doesn't match, but nobody at the polling place checks your signature with the signature database. I don't think they even have access to the signature database at the polling place. I don't know if anyone goes over the signatures after the election is over. If they did, it would be too late at that point any way. Maybe they could throw that ballot out. But the person who tried to vote under the fake name could not be caught. There would be no way of knowing who the person was who tried to vote under the phony name.

The other thing that is ridiculous is that there are probably over 1 million illegal aliens who vote. How do they get away with it? It is simple. Anyone can register to vote. They are not allowed to ask you for proof of citizenship. How ridiculous is that? If you walk in to register to vote and you can hardly speak English, shouldn't they ask you to see proof of citizenship? Of course they should. But they are not allowed to. It is illegal for them to ask you for proof of citizenship. That is insane. So how many illegal aliens actually vote? Here are the estimates: http://watchdog.org/260524/illegal-i...2016-election/

[joeydb]

[Rudeboyelvis]

Starting to think that it may not be a coincidence at all that anyone close to the Clintons seems to wind up in jail, indicted waiting for trial, or dead.

Hillary's close friend, former Pennsylvania AG Kathleen Kane, suits up for prison.

http://www.nytimes.com/2016/10/25/us...ison.html?_r=0

[casp0555]

Originally Posted by Rudeboyelvis

Starting to think that it may not be a coincidence at all that anyone close to the Clintons seems to wind up in jail, indicted waiting for trial, or dead.

Hillary's close friend, former Pennsylvania AG Kathleen Kane, suits up for prison.

http://www.nytimes.com/2016/10/25/us...ison.html?_r=0

feel sorry for the kids but the prisons are full of people that used terrible judgement and made life changing decisions well before the well-being of their family. 10 months for what she is guilty of is light.....

[saratogadew]

She faced 24 years in prison. She received 10-23 months. She was taken to jail and then bailed out in 2 hours. She is back at home while the appeal process will go on for another year or two. in the end, she'll probably do like 90 days. Anyone else that is not politically connected would be rotting in jail for 10 years.

[saratogadew]

Originally Posted by saratogadew

She faced 24 years in prison. She received 10-23 months. She was taken to jail and then bailed out in 2 hours. She is back at home while the appeal process will go on for another year or two. in the end, she'll probably do like 90 days. Anyone else that is not politically connected would be rotting in jail for 10 years.

She is kind of hot though

[CheekyBird]

Originally Posted by Rupert Pupkin

In 2000, there were some overseas ballots of servicemen that hadn't been counted. Gore and Lieberman tried to block those ballots from being counted. There are some politicians on both sides of the aisle that will try to win at any cost. But in general I think the vast majority of citizens on both sides think that anyone who is a citizen should be able to vote, and I also think that the vast majority of citizens on both of the aisle think that you should be required to show a valid ID when you vote.

I am not well-versed in the particulars of the Bush v. Gore fiasco, so I will have to do some research regarding the counting of the overseas ballots. I'll, as it were, punt on this one.[/quote]

As I said before, California is a joke. No ID is required. You walk in to the polling place and you tell them your name. Then they ask you for your address, you give it to them, they find it on their list, you sign your name, they cross your name off and give you your ballot. But as I said before, every person's address is posted outside the polling place. So if a person wanted to they could find a name that has not voted yet (the list is updated every 2 hours) and then walk in and claim to be that person. There would be practically no way to get caught. How insane is that? If anyone bothered checking the signatures after the fact, they would see that the signature doesn't match, but nobody at the polling place checks your signature with the signature database. I don't think they even have access to the signature database at the polling place. I don't know if anyone goes over the signatures after the election is over. If they did, it would be too late at that point any way. Maybe they could throw that ballot out. But the person who tried to vote under the fake name could not be caught. There would be no way of knowing who the person was who tried to vote under the phony name.

I am inclined to support showing proof of citizenship for voting, however, it is my understanding that in some states, permanent residents can vote in local or state elections. Will have to research this one, but I can't imagine why there would be push back to showing proof, unless you're 100 years old with no birth certificate or passport.

I do not, however, object to registering legal aliens. They need to be deployed once they attain citizenship so that they can vote in the presidential election.

Edited to add that I can't think of how one person or a group of people can appreciably change the outcome of the presidential elections in the U.S. How many polling places in each state would they have to infiltrate? How many millions of ballots would they have to "stuff?" It's just not feasible.

The other thing that is ridiculous is that there are probably over 1 million illegal aliens who vote. How do they get away with it? It is simple. Anyone can register to vote. They are not allowed to ask you for proof of citizenship. How ridiculous is that? If you walk in to register to vote and you can hardly speak English, shouldn't they ask you to see proof of citizenship? Of course they should. But they are not allowed to. It is illegal for them to ask you for proof of citizenship. That is insane. So how many illegal aliens actually vote? Here are the estimates: http://watchdog.org/260524/illegal-i...2016-election/

That 1 million illegal/undocumented people vote is utter nonsense. It completely defies logic. Why expose yourself to possible deportation by providing personal information or committing a felony?? I can't imagine any sane person risking, in many cases, life and limb to come to America just to toss it all away by illegally voting Particularly when you consider the current crop of candidates!!

[Rudeboyelvis]

[CheekyBird]

Originally Posted by Rudeboyelvis

Because 19 votes can swing an election.

[Rudeboyelvis]

Originally Posted by CheekyBird

Because 19 votes can swing an election.

Because only 1 person tied to DNC is a soulless, void-of-ethics, sellout shill.

Oh wait. That's just the Chairbuffalo that lost her CNN gig today.


Hmmm - nope, my bad. Totally forgot about the convicted felon that visited Obama 342 times.

It's Trickle-down corruption. But you know that.

[CheekyBird]

Originally Posted by Rudeboyelvis

Because only 1 person tied to DNC is a soulless, void-of-ethics, sellout shill.

Oh wait. That's just the Chairbuffalo that lost her CNN gig today.


Hmmm - nope, my bad. Totally forgot about the convicted felon that visited Obama 342 times.

It's Trickle-down corruption. But you know that.

I'm sorry. I thought we were talking about the 19 votes that could have swung the election for Hillary Clinton. Pardon me.

[Rupert Pupkin]

Originally Posted by CheekyBird

/QUOTThat 1 million illegal/undocumented people vote is utter nonsense. It completely defies logic. Why expose yourself to possible deportation by providing personal information or committing a felony?? I can't imagine any sane person risking, in many cases, life and limb to come to America just to toss it all away by illegally voting Particularly when you consider the current crop of candidates!!E]

You are right that most illegal aliens don't vote. The reason you gave is probably correct. They probably don't want to risk getting in trouble. That is probably why around 95% of them do not vote. But approximately the other 5% do vote. Why do they risk it? I would say for two reasons. The first would be the same reason they risk getting in trouble for all the other crimes they commit. There are simply a lot of people out there (of all races) who do things that could get them in a lot of trouble, even though they have very little to gain. We hear of guys worth over $100 million who cheat on their taxes. They have so much to lose. They risk going to jail to save a little bit of money, even tough they don't need the money. Then you have successful guys like OJ who actually murder someone and risk going to jail for life. Most of these people are probably sociopaths. Some studies show that sociopaths make up about 4% of the population. They have poor impulse control and will even commit crimes where they are practically assured of getting caught. They don't really worry about the consequences of their actions. They live for the moment.

The second reason a small percentage (around 5%) of illegal aliens vote is because there are some of them out there that know how lax our laws are. They know they are extremely unlikely to get caught, and even if they do get caught, they know that there will probably be no consequences. Look at what the article said. It said that they caught 300 illegal aliens registered to vote in Virginia, half of whom actually did vote. This info was given to the Justice Department. What did they do? Nothing! From the article:

Von Spakovsky said the Obama administration’s Department of Justice is turning a blind eye to the problem – by design.

The elections expert has personal experience with the federal government’s lax oversight.

He served on a Virginia county elections board that found nearly 300 non-citizens registered to vote in that county alone.

“We took them off the list. About half of them had actually illegally voted,” Von Spakovsky told Wisconsin Watchdog on the Vicki McKenna Show earlier this week. “We sent that information to the Obama administration, to the Justice Department, because it’s a felony what (the non-citizens) were doing under federal law.”

“They had no interest in it.”

The Justice Department, in fact, has targeted states that have attempted to purge ineligible voters from their registration rolls, citing the Voting Rights Act and the National Voter Registration Act. And the U.S. Department of Homeland Security has refused to share its immigration database with election officials.

http://watchdog.org/260524/illegal-i...2016-election/

[Rudeboyelvis]

Not that this matters (he's been so woefully incorrect about Trump it's laughable) but even Nate Sliver just acknowledged Florida leaning red.

http://projects.fivethirtyeight.com/.../florida/#plus