Awful: 'Mattress Mack' fires Borell day after fairytale BC Sprint win

[jms62]

Originally Posted by Arletta

A comment on the PR from a guy named Wane Stacy says it best:

"Lets make no mistake about the purpose and tone of my post; or my experience in the industry....I have none. I am a photographer. I see emotion and read people through a lens. I have been an acquaintance of Marie for a little over a year. But I am not a "dear friend". I have seen how she has treated and cared for this horse, and it is beyond anything I have seen before when it comes to turning around a "failing" in any business.

To remove Maria as trainer of this horse is going to be devastating for this animal. Does anyone actually believe that RH is going to receive the same attention from Wohlers? is she going to take naps in the stall with this horse? spend nights in the barn with this horse? Not a chance, outside of workout day, and race day she will never be near this animal, and on those days, she won't get any closer than the grandstand, or the rail, until it is time for a photo op.

People have continually tried to throw Wohlers "training" experience up as though she has some wonderful resume.....when the obverse is actually true.

Since the year 2000 she has had 11 stakes races, and her best finish was 2nd with Objective, in 2006. She has only finished in the money that one time. throwing out the 2nd place finish, she has an average finish of 6th place over 10 races in 15 years.....is that who you want training your horse, if you are in fact someone who wants your racehorses to win money?

While on the obverse...Maria has had 6 stakes races, and finished 1st in all but one, a 12th place finish by Sgt. Sandals in 2014...

Young, new, old, hot, ugly.......if you are a horseman/woman, this is who you want training your horses.

Unless,....

What I do know is business, and business is no different from one type to the next. You have businesses that are geared to profit, and those geared to failure. some do it by design, others do it out of ignorance, some do it out of love.

People open restaurants because they love food, and they want you to love their food. Most close within 5 years; many within 24 months....it wasn't about money. It was about love.

Many big businesses want profits from the creation of a service, or device, to dominate, Apple, Microsoft, etc, etc......if a service or product fails, it kills it because its all about the profits.

there are two kinds of of racehorse owners...

Those who out of love and ignorance will invest time, energy, and countless dollars into an animal and a team because they have love for an animal and they believe in it......the money is no consideration.

Those who look at a racehorse as a way to write off debt as a capital gains loss, and tax deduction.

Jim McIngvale is the later in my opinion. Every single time he has a trainer, rider, horse that is ready to take the world by storm, create a great buzz, put the stakes earnings on track to profit......he destroys it. Because if the horse is a winner, then he pays taxes...he is no longer creating deductions on loses.

This man keeps throwing horses at his inept sister in law because he knows she couldn't train a barrel to hold trash.

Maria was fired because she and RH made money......

You want proof?

First off, you don't fire 35 (now 36) of the best trainers in the business over the course of 18 years without being a little bit touched in the head...

Since 1997 McIngvales has posted 31 stakes horses. subtract RH from the lot and you are left with 27 races. in 18 years his horses have had three 1st place finishers, two 2nd place finishers, and two 3rd place finishers.....in 18 years. his average finish for a horse is 5.4 always outside the money.

It doesn't take a rocket scientist to see that he uses horse racing to offset the profits obtained as the "mattress king"...

Wohlers is a middle management yes man(woman), who went crying to the brass when she didn't get her way in front of the "help". McIngvales is a narcissist who believes anyone else's face on the screen or in print other than his own...does him an injustice.

If RH goes off to California and finishes a race higher than 5th place.......I will be beyond astounded.

They can try to spin their PR all they like, but they can't spin math and statistics."

Mattress King is a class 1 doucgebag but what I highlighted above is preposterous that is in it to lose.... If that was the case then why run a horse that is favored in a race with a 1.5 million dollar purse ?

[Danzig]

Originally Posted by jms62

Mattress King is a class 1 doucgebag but what I highlighted above is preposterous that is in it to lose.... If that was the case then why run a horse that is favored in a race with a 1.5 million dollar purse ?

well, for horses and taxes, you have to show a profit two of seven years. so, this will probably be one of those two.

[Dunbar]

Originally Posted by jms62

Mattress King is a class 1 doucgebag but what I highlighted above is preposterous that is in it to lose.... If that was the case then why run a horse that is favored in a race with a 1.5 million dollar purse ?

I had the same reaction. It makes no sense to purposely lose money so that you pay less taxes on your other income. You still come out a net loser on the combined income/loss. The guy is stupid, but probably not that stupid. Or, at least his accountants are probably not that stupid.

[Danzig]

Originally Posted by Dunbar

I had the same reaction. It makes no sense to purposely lose money so that you pay less taxes on your other income. You still come out a net loser on the combined income/loss. The guy is stupid, but probably not that stupid. Or, at least his accountants are probably not that stupid.

i don't recommend using logic to try to understand illogical things or people. it'll give you a headache!

[Seattleallstar]

It hasn't been pointed out yet that Maria is quite the cutie too

[RHT2004]

Originally Posted by Seattleallstar

It hasn't been pointed out yet that Maria is quite the cutie too

I said it on here after seeing her at Saratoga. She's beautiful.

[GenuineRisk]

Originally Posted by Danzig

i don't recommend using logic to try to understand illogical things or people. it'll give you a headache!

True 'dat. Like, why does a guy worth $70 million not just pay the woman the $126,000 she claims she's owed and be done with it.

That said, there's no one like the ultra wealthy to be ultra cheap.

I'm also skeptical the issue was over trying to create a tax loss, because, if he's been losing money every year on the horses, the IRS likely doesn't let him claim them as deductions anymore anyway. Hobby loss, or something like that.

If anyone's interested, this article explains profit and loss in the horse business pretty well:
https://asci.uvm.edu/equine/law/horselaw/hobby.htm

The particular one that I think would make it hard for the Mattress King to declare the racing expenses a loss against his other income is:

"8. Taxpayer's financial status. The fact that the taxpayer does not have substantial income unrelated to the horse activities may indicate that the activity is engaged in for a profit. The cases in which the IRS challenges deductions under the hobby rule are cases in which the taxpayer has a very substantial income from sources unrelated to the horse activity."

[blackthroatedwind]

With all due respect, do people here make the same sort of snap judgments in their everyday lives that they are making in this thread? If so, how does that work out for you?

There are a lot of moving parts in this discussion, and I think it's at least reasonable to assume the story is not as black and white as people here, and all over the internet, are suggesting.

[Alabama Stakes]

3 sides to every story. His / hers / the truth. Pretty sure it's been like that for 100 years

[10 pnt move up]

Originally Posted by blackthroatedwind

With all due respect, do people here make the same sort of snap judgments in their everyday lives that they are making in this thread? If so, how does that work out for you?

There are a lot of moving parts in this discussion, and I think it's at least reasonable to assume the story is not as black and white as people here, and all over the internet, are suggesting.

of course, but what kind of fun is that logic.

[Danzig]

Originally Posted by blackthroatedwind

With all due respect, do people here make the same sort of snap judgments in their everyday lives that they are making in this thread? If so, how does that work out for you?

There are a lot of moving parts in this discussion, and I think it's at least reasonable to assume the story is not as black and white as people here, and all over the internet, are suggesting.

i have no doubt that is true.
i haven't made any judgements, because there's always at least three sides to every story...
but i did want to make sure anyone saying 'tax write off' knows that he can't have a loss each year, else it's a hobby.

as for the firing, i don't know why anyone would be surprised that he fired his latest trainer, he has quite a track record of that.

[jms62]

We are not in the industry nor do we have a means to talk directly to the parties therefore we shouldn't voice an opinion based upon what is being presented in the media and on the Internet. Business as usual.

[Arletta]

Originally Posted by blackthroatedwind

With all due respect, do people here make the same sort of snap judgments in their everyday lives that they are making in this thread? If so, how does that work out for you?

There are a lot of moving parts in this discussion, and I think it's at least reasonable to assume the story is not as black and white as people here, and all over the internet, are suggesting.

The guys reputation speaks for itself and any criticism made towards him is more than warranted. No one respected the guy much before this, and even less so now. He deserves all the backlash that he is getting.

[Holybull1]

Originally Posted by blackthroatedwind

With all due respect, do people here make the same sort of snap judgments in their everyday lives that they are making in this thread? If so, how does that work out for you?

There are a lot of moving parts in this discussion, and I think it's at least reasonable to assume the story is not as black and white as people here, and all over the internet, are suggesting.

Surprisingly, not much has been mentioned about this whole saga by Steve on ATR.

[OldDog]

Originally Posted by Holybull1

Surprisingly, not much has been mentioned about this whole saga by Steve on ATR.

He pretty much said his peace Tuesday (2nd hour).

[Revidere]

Originally Posted by Holybull1

Surprisingly, not much has been mentioned about this whole saga by Steve on ATR.

Because like everything else in today's society, it's a microwave saga spurred and egged on by social media. For people that don't "want" to hash this out publicly, they both are out there....

[Kasept]

Originally Posted by Holybull1

Surprisingly, not much has been mentioned about this whole saga by Steve on ATR.

I called McIngvale's operation 'laughable connections that would never win' in January on twitter as well as on air and feel that the assertion has been borne out even with Runhappy's success. You can hear my comments on the latest imbroglio ham-handed Gallery Racing finds itself in from Tuesday's show at the start of Hour 2.

I wanted to make sure that it was clear that bloodstock agents Kerry Thomas and Pete Denk received appropriate credit for finding the horse and driving his purchase (despite the spin machine claiming otherwise) and that when I saw Runhappy up close before and after the King's Bishop, only Maria Borell was around him. Those are 2 of the facts I could speak to directly. I won't engage in the reporting of innuendo and smears as being practiced by the dysfunctional, shockingly bizarre horse owners.