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#141
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![]() No idea what happened..it's like one of those proton thread bombs that leaves everything intact, yet sucks all of the collective brain cells into a black hole.
I don't get how some people will look for every excuse in the book to discount this horse's effort to validate their own biases. I imagine if I were a Dortmund fan, perhaps I'd feel the same - I don't know. I'm not really even a fan of this horse. That said, the horse has done absolutely nothing wrong. Ran further than anyone else, persisted, won the friggin Derby. Somehow he's unworthy because Dortmund had a belly ache for a few hours 2 weeks prior, Upstart had a bad day, Firing Line purportedly didn't switch leads, Materiality had a bad break, etc. It's silly. I only hope he gets even more of a pace and more dirt in his face. Of course if he draws outside and no one goes with him, that's on him as well. ![]() |
#142
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#143
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![]() Yeah, critical analysis is way overrated, especially in horse racing. Silly me.
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Just more nebulous nonsense from BBB |
#144
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I thought my breakdown of Upstarts career as a close up stalker vs the perceived myth of him being a deep closer was pretty analytical and blew that myth out of the water. I used observations, past performances and logic to illustrate my conclusion. You? You just continued with your Zen chant that I'm biased, summarily dismissing the FACTS I presented to you, instead of showing me how I'm wrong. That is often the tactic used by either someone without a leg to stand on, or someone who is threatened by evidence that threatens a tightly held belief. I'm going with the latter. Mostly. |
#145
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#146
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#147
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![]() Sorry 38 years, time flies!!
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#148
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#149
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Two facile wins leading up to the Derby; slow-paced merry-go-round Derby; Victor Espinoza aboard... The only difference is War Emblem ran quite a bit faster. |
#150
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Felix Unger talking to Oscar Madison: "Your horse could finish third by 20 lengths and they still pay you? And you have been losing money for all these years?!" |
#151
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Who could have been more wrong about the Derby then Doug? Doug is friggin world class in his knowledge of racing. Doesnt mean he wasnt dreadfully wrong in one stupid race. Beyer sees the race at one speef fig CJ sees it a bit faster, both are highly credible. You are better off listening and learning why you are wrong then trying to argue points that dont work |
#152
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#153
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![]() Not true. War Emblem won an allowance at 2 from mid-pack. He also did not have the lead for the first 3/4s of the Preakness, albeit under stout restraint by Espinoza.
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#154
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![]() yeah, in the preakness he was all of a head off the lead. the point is, War Emblem was a need the lead type of horse. American Pharaoh has shown he can sit off the lead by at least a length or two as well as win on the lead. he's more versatile and adaptable.
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#155
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But thanks for clarifying the goalposts...and ignoring the 2yo allowance race. |
#156
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On to the rest of your post. Why is it that it is me that is wrong, when we are interpreting this data Fred?? How am I arguing points that don't work? How am I wrong? I gave Serling a more detailed breakdown of how I interpret Upstart's career, racing style, etc., in an honest attempt at a two way dialog. What I got in return was a quick dismissal by saying that I'm biased. That to me, is being closed minded and an unwillingness to possibly admit to being wrong on his part. I went back and watched all of Upstarts races. I now have a better appreciation for the horse, but at the same time, it confirmed what I already felt about him. He's a presser that lays up close to the lead and probably prefers a one turn type of race say from 7/8ths to 8.5 furlongs in distance. This notion that he is some sort of stone cold closer is completely unsubstantiated by both his PPs and his actual racing style. Hell, in his first few starts, the jock is trying to get him to rate and Upstart fights the jockey very noticeably! I say this with no sarcasm. I'd love to have someone illustrate how I am wrong with this. Of course, nobody will. |
#157
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I doubt BTW thinks or Nick think he is a stone cold closer I believe what both think are that he he is best suited to make one well timed run. I am not of opinion BTW or Nick think the colt is a Zenyatta type last to first colt. |
#158
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And yeah, I realize the fan club is not making him out to be a Zenyatta type of closer. I keep bringing that up because they said he was taken out of his style, in various races. The reality is quite different from their claims though. He pretty much runs the same style every time. I still see no evidence that those guys are right. |
#159
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![]() This semantics argument about his running style is just one big diversion from the indefensibly asinine opinion that arguably the fastest horse in the crop on paper is best suited to NY-bred races.
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#160
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![]() This.
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Just more nebulous nonsense from BBB |