Puzzling Kentucky Derby Picture

[jms62]

Originally Posted by Kasept

Gus.. If Cairo Prince doesn't get in the Derby, it's not an indictment of the point system, it's an indictment of the way he's been campaigned.

But doesn't some of that have to do with the point system and its Grossly overweighting of late Derby Preps. In my opinion they need to weight by Grade and start with Breeders cup Juvenile. A Grade 1 Win in the Juvenile should be the same as A Grade 1 Win in March. For the most part we have had lower field sizes until late Feb and some very large ones after.

[cakes44]

Originally Posted by jms62

A Grade 1 Win in the Juvenile should be the same as A Grade 1 Win in March.

I could not disagree more.

[Indian Charlie]

Originally Posted by cakes44

I could not disagree more.

Horses that have run in the top four in the BC have done quite well in the derby

[cakes44]

Originally Posted by Indian Charlie

Horses that have run in the top four in the BC have done quite well in the derby

No doubt, they have had a nice run of success.

[10 pnt move up]

Originally Posted by Indian Charlie

Horses that have run in the top four in the BC have done quite well in the derby

and this affects Cairo Prince's issue? Where did he finish in that race?

[jms62]

Originally Posted by cakes44

I could not disagree more.

Usually when someone makes such a statement as you have they would provide a scintilla of reasoning why they feel that way. Sorry if I have such high expectations.

[cakes44]

Originally Posted by jms62

Usually when someone makes such a statement as you have they would provide a scintilla of reasoning why they feel that way. Sorry if I have such high expectations.

No problem on your expectations.

1. Many horses are much different animals in May than November. Much more so than the difference between March and May anyways. IC's point(though sarcastic) about how poorly the top 4 finishers from the BCJ do in the Derby is spot on.

2. Horses getting enough points in the BCJ to already get into the Derby will promote connections to go with even less preps than they do now IMO.

3. The quality of horses you have to beat in a March prep is much better than a November G1, which also makes them more significant.

[jms62]

Originally Posted by cakes44

No problem on your expectations.

1. Many horses are much different animals in May than November. Much more so than the difference between March and May anyways. IC's point(though sarcastic) about how poorly the top 4 finishers from the BCJ do in the Derby is spot on.

2. Horses getting enough points in the BCJ to already get into the Derby will promote connections to go with even less preps than they do now IMO.

3. The quality of horses you have to beat in a March prep is much better than a November G1, which also makes them more significant.

I pretty much ignore IC as I have never seen him post a real bet. Yadda Yadda Yadda but never see him in the selections thread. Where you and I disagree is that I see the current system as encouraging less preps since the real preps don't start until mid Feb. i think they can structure the system where a G1 or G2 win would be nearly automatic but a G3 not. As horse playerI want to see a meaningful prep schedule to look forward to from Breeders cup to Derby.

[Indian Charlie]

Originally Posted by jms62

I pretty much ignore IC as I have never seen him post a real bet. Yadda Yadda Yadda but never see him in the selections thread. Where you and I disagree is that I see the current system as encouraging less preps since the real preps don't start until mid Feb. i think they can structure the system where a G1 or G2 win would be nearly automatic but a G3 not. As horse playerI want to see a meaningful prep schedule to look forward to from Breeders cup to Derby.

That's ok.

As I've never seen you post anything interesting, or even something insightful, I feel the same way towards you.

[jms62]

Originally Posted by Indian Charlie

That's ok.

As I've never seen you post anything interesting, or even something insightful, I feel the same way towards you.

Cool I'm good with that but at least I have the balls to post my opinions however bad they are in the selections thread. You however seem incapable of leaving the Paddock but seem to know everything about everything. Good luck when you finally decide to put down a bet.

[cakes44]

Originally Posted by jms62

As horse playerI want to see a meaningful prep schedule to look forward to from Breeders cup to Derby.

Me and you are on the same page there. The old system was broke because horses that finished 2nd in either the BCJ or Delta Jackpot were already in the KD, no matter what they did afterward. However, the new system doesn't seem to be doing any better in terms of making horses run as 3-year-olds, which I thought was kind of the goal of it.

[tanner12oz]

Originally Posted by jms62

But doesn't some of that have to do with the point system and its Grossly overweighting of late Derby Preps. In my opinion they need to weight by Grade and start with Breeders cup Juvenile. A Grade 1 Win in the Juvenile should be the same as A Grade 1 Win in March. For the most part we have had lower field sizes until late Feb and some very large ones after.

you need to run in order to get points...lighting up the clocks in the am for months doesn't do you any good earning your way into the gate and that's exactly what they tried doing with Cairo prince