Derby Trail Forums

Derby Trail Forums (http://www.derbytrail.com/forums/index.php)
-   The Paddock (http://www.derbytrail.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=2)
-   -   Lasix Adjunct? (http://www.derbytrail.com/forums/showthread.php?t=17850)

booner 10-31-2007 01:10 PM

Lasix Adjunct?
 
I have always wondered what the difference is between this and Lasix. Anybody have an explanation?

Cannon Shell 10-31-2007 01:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by booner
I have always wondered what the difference is between this and Lasix. Anybody have an explanation?

It is something that may be given with Lasix. KY Red, Vitamin b-1 and Calcium are a few things that can be used and called an adjunct. Pretty meaningless in the long run and not really useful information.

booner 10-31-2007 01:28 PM

Thought it was useless, but curiousity was killing this cat!!

Thanks for the info!

phystech 10-31-2007 02:38 PM

I thought Amicar was given as the adjunct.....

docicu3 10-31-2007 02:51 PM

Amicar is used to induce clotting and in the scenario you guys are discussung I would think this is pretty risky because clotting would take place everywhere not just in the lungs where the "bleeding" is supposed to take place.

As an aside I have always been skeptical of "bleeding" taking place in horses lungs but rather the human equivalent of pulmonary edema which "looks like bleeding" the lasix both increases capacitance (pipe size thus more pipe less bleeding but also causes urination through a "loop of Henle" mechanism) or the highest and most effacious way to move water fast.

I would think that Zaroxyln could be used as a Lasix adjunct as it is in humans for a more exagerated response...

Probably more than you wanted on this one but I have wondered about this subject for a long time!!

And Chuck.......No way A-Rod is accepted in Boston on any level any time!!!
What would be great would be if he remains unsigned because no team can afford him and ends having to sit out a year but then again I still hold out for the tooth fairy as well....

Riot 10-31-2007 03:52 PM

Quote:

Amicar is used to induce clotting and in the scenario you guys are discussung I would think this is pretty risky because clotting would take place everywhere not just in the lungs where the "bleeding" is supposed to take place.
There isn't good documented efficacy supporting it's use as an anti-fibrinolytic.

Quote:

As an aside I have always been skeptical of "bleeding" taking place in horses lungs but rather the human equivalent of pulmonary edema which "looks like bleeding" the lasix both increases capacitance (pipe size thus more pipe less bleeding but also causes urination through a "loop of Henle" mechanism) or the highest and most effacious way to move water fast.
Give pre-exercise, yes, the goal of lasix is to lower pulmonary artery pressure.

Doc, PM me and send me your e-mail, I'll send you a couple of good summary articles on current thoughts for possible causes of EIPH in the horse (other than strict stress failure of pulmonary capillaries secondary to increased Ppa) and treatments.

Cannon Shell 10-31-2007 04:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by phystech
I thought Amicar was given as the adjunct.....

That too. There are others but most have negligible effect anyway...

Cannon Shell 10-31-2007 04:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by docicu3
Amicar is used to induce clotting and in the scenario you guys are discussung I would think this is pretty risky because clotting would take place everywhere not just in the lungs where the "bleeding" is supposed to take place.

As an aside I have always been skeptical of "bleeding" taking place in horses lungs but rather the human equivalent of pulmonary edema which "looks like bleeding" the lasix both increases capacitance (pipe size thus more pipe less bleeding but also causes urination through a "loop of Henle" mechanism) or the highest and most effacious way to move water fast.

I would think that Zaroxyln could be used as a Lasix adjunct as it is in humans for a more exagerated response...

Probably more than you wanted on this one but I have wondered about this subject for a long time!!

And Chuck.......No way A-Rod is accepted in Boston on any level any time!!!
What would be great would be if he remains unsigned because no team can afford him and ends having to sit out a year but then again I still hold out for the tooth fairy as well....

Why the hate for A Rod???

Bobby Fischer 10-31-2007 05:54 PM

I feel silly asking this , but at tracks like Churchill (http://www.brisnet.com/cgi-bin/insta...7-11-01&race=9)
they have LA next to some horses under medication/equipment. Is this indicating Amicar as well as Lasix?

docicu3 10-31-2007 06:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell
Why the hate for A Rod???


Chuck, A-Rod is a very talented but cancerous, self indulged to new levels, chronic cooler who will always be a phony and a choker. Other that he's a fine upstanding family man who publically displays his harem of mistress's and fondness for strip clubs while still asking for the world to validate his athletic ability..... he's headed for the hall but I think he will always make every team he's on less than what they are while gathering numbers unsurpassed by any baseball player in history.

That's why all the ill feling toward A-Rod...other guys have similiar flaws but none are able to out do A-Rod's cry for attention while showing such classless self promotion. One example would be the announcement for fre agency when the World Series is center stage...

Riot 10-31-2007 07:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bobby Fischer
I feel silly asking this , but at tracks like Churchill (http://www.brisnet.com/cgi-bin/insta...7-11-01&race=9)
they have LA next to some horses under medication/equipment. Is this indicating Amicar as well as Lasix?

Naw, L = lasix and A = "an adjunct". I'm not sure if Amicar (aminocaproic acid) is only adjunct allowable in KY, I believe the other three (carbazochrome - "KY Red", conjugated estrogens, tranexamic acid) can be used in KY. I wouldn't note any of them in your handicapping.

Cannon Shell 10-31-2007 08:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by docicu3
Chuck, A-Rod is a very talented but cancerous, self indulged to new levels, chronic cooler who will always be a phony and a choker. Other that he's a fine upstanding family man who publically displays his harem of mistress's and fondness for strip clubs while still asking for the world to validate his athletic ability..... he's headed for the hall but I think he will always make every team he's on less than what they are while gathering numbers unsurpassed by any baseball player in history.

That's why all the ill feling toward A-Rod...other guys have similiar flaws but none are able to out do A-Rod's cry for attention while showing such classless self promotion. One example would be the announcement for fre agency when the World Series is center stage...

I believe that this is a media portrayal of him to be honest. What teams has he had a negative effect on? Seattle? They were very good before management broke them up. Texas? Please. The Yankees? They have a lot of problems but A Rod wasn't one of them. He takes a lot of blame because of his contract but baseball is not a one man sport where a guy can carry a team. As for his off the field 'issues' if you hated all athletes who went to strip clubs or cheated on their wives you would have very few guys to root for.

Bobby Fischer 10-31-2007 08:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Riot
Naw, L = lasix and A = "an adjunct". I'm not sure if Amicar (aminocaproic acid) is only adjunct allowable in KY, I believe the other three (carbazochrome - "KY Red", conjugated estrogens, tranexamic acid) can be used in KY. I wouldn't note any of them in your handicapping.

Thanks , I was beginning to worry that the "A" stands for A-Rod..

docicu3 10-31-2007 10:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell
I believe that this is a media portrayal of him to be honest. What teams has he had a negative effect on? Seattle? They were very good before management broke them up. Texas? Please. The Yankees? They have a lot of problems but A Rod wasn't one of them. He takes a lot of blame because of his contract but baseball is not a one man sport where a guy can carry a team. As for his off the field 'issues' if you hated all athletes who went to strip clubs or cheated on their wives you would have very few guys to root for.



I agreed that many guys could use some help in the monogamy department but A-Rod seems to take this to excess.....the guys lack of clutch performance makes his period of performing seem inconsequential though the numbers are there for individual stats his lack of impact on a team makes him an empty suit.

The little item this week with his announcement of giving up the remaining years of his current contract couldn't have been more selfish and selfserving if he wanted it to be. His failure to show up for the Henry Aaron award and give deference to one of the greats of the game was another example of how selfish little Alex can be.....sorry game set match Alex is everything I try to teach my kids not to be..


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 04:53 PM.

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.6.8
Copyright ©2000 - 2025, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.