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#1
08-05-2007, 05:59 PM
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Godolphin/Darley article
After speaking to a friend of mine today, who i thought was still a senior manager at Godolphin, he advised me that i found this article and gave it a read.
He has left his fantastic position because he had "had enough of it" and was "sick of working with people that had no idea of running an organisation". From what he was saying, it makes me wonder how much longer Godolphin actually last. There have been major fallings out at the top of the ladder and many of their experienced staff are leaving on a regular basis. Anyway, here is the link to the article. Give it a good read, because it is one of the best artivle ever written about Godolphin. Unlike most journalists, they actually speak the truth. http://observer.guardian.co.uk/sport...ticle_continue
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Avatar ~ Nicky Whelan  and now we murderers because we kill time 
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#2
08-05-2007, 08:07 PM
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Interesting article. Almost sounds like he doesn't have a true direction in mind unlike Coolmore.
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#3
08-05-2007, 08:33 PM
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Considering he clearly has (shock of all shocks) an agenda, it's a well-written (slanted!) piece anyway.
A question.... this Mr. Jeffreys ("... they scorn prying eyes"???) is a freelance writer or is he on the staff? A few points..... most Sunday newspaper features are put to bed on Thursday so I'd assume there were two versions..... the one where the Godolphin runner won and this one. I'm assuming, of course, that this piece appeared in the print version. My reason for bringing this up is that it seems to me a pre-meditated (what's a word for an attack that doesn't seem like it's an attack? Insert it here) .... his ducks were lined up and he was just waiting, hoping to use the better version where the runner failed. The part the author left out was the fact that they didn't have faith in Laverock and PUBLICALLY SAID SO a day or two before the race. Jealousy is a funny thing and i keep wondering if they were not Arab..... There is racism in racing... has it always been that way? To be fair, Godolphin has had 14 winners in the past month... Ramonti Rio de las Plata Scriptwriter Twilight Star Blue Ksar Stage Gift Emirates to Dubai Spring City Pictivia Gongidas Rio de la Plata Perfectperformance Purple Emperor Mariotto How long will they last, you ask? Hopefully for a longass time. They support racing all over the world, they're good for the game and this microscope that they're under is not only unfair it's getting old. It's their money.... when they offer exorbitant amounts for horses no one bothers to slam the seller(s)..... Okay well I can go on and on here but I'll end it. GO GODOLPHIN, GO! 
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#4
08-05-2007, 08:42 PM
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Didn't mean it as a knock on Godolphin. Personally I don't like the way Coolmore is run. All they seem to care about is stallions and breeding them into the ground. Just meant that he wants to build this huge state of the art sports complex (which I think is a great business plan) and at this time has alot of irons in the fire. I've always thought of him as a knowledgeable horseman. Every stable has their down years. Last year he or his family were winning everything over here.
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#5
08-06-2007, 05:10 AM
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Quote:
I know you are a big fan of all things Godolphin, but this has clouded your judgement in my opinion. They are next to ruined. Saeed Bin Suroor is getting all the blame for what has happened over the past few years (even from me) until i found out he has very little to do with the training of the horses, apart from having his name written next to every horse and maybe watching them train in the mornings. Simon Crisford sticks his nose in and starts telling people how to train and which horses they should be buying (all of this coming from someone who was just a journalist before landing this job, and didn't have a clue about horses when he was younger when he started to work at a stud farm). He and Saeed have fallen out many times about the decisions that have been made. Then there is John Ferguson, apparently one of the top bloodstock agents in the world. He must go to the sale ring with a blindfold on, is all i can say. It is true that Coolmore have started bidding for a horse they don't even like to make sure John bids slightly higher and then looks a fool (Jalil, anyone). But as long as he beats Coolmore in a bidding war, Sheikh Mohammed is happy. Now that is jealousy. How bad must it feel to have that much money and not be able to compete in this sport at all? MMSC, you list the winners they have had in the past month. Fair enough but i noticed you didn't put the races in which they won and the prize money they picked up or a percentage of runners to winners in the past month. Or what would look even worse the percentage of runners to horses they have in the stables at the moment. People get unhappy with particular trainers when horses break down, how come no one gets mad with Godolphin? That's because no one ever knows. I will let you think what you like of the gallop watcher's comment in the article. They have no plan, no agenda, no clue. They buy everything they see just in hope of getting a good horse. The problem is that they have bought good horses, but they ruin them. Imperial Stride, Vista Bella, The Geezer, Prince Tamino, Rallying Cry, Hinterland...... i could continue but it would get silly. The worrying thig is that most of the horses they bred themselves have turned out to be very moderate by their (past) standards. Then we come to the breeding operation. As Tony Morris summed up, it is useless. No good stallions, no one particularly wants to send their mares to a Darley stallion. They are having to spend a huge amount of money, which will take years to break even on (and that isn't certain to happen, either). Yes they have the money and they can do what they like with it, but they have shown time and time again that they cannot run a business, let alone a business of this size. You say blame the sellers, why? If some fool offers you $1milion for a horse which you know is only worth $150,000 you would say no? I very much doubt it. Put it this way, if someone knocked on your door and said here's $250,000 for your car, can i have it? You would take the money and throw them the keys without any questions asked. The sellers are running a successful business, that is the difference. A few things Godolphin need to do to start being successful. Sack Crisford, he has shown time and again he cannot handle the role he is working as. Let Saeed do his thing, he is a good horseman and he would certainly give these horses time instead of breaking them down on the gallops and have them sent as dog meat. They should also cut down on the size of the training operation, they cannot handle 300-400 horses, no one can. You're telling me that within those 400 horses they couldn't find one good enough to run in the guineas, derby or eclipse? If that is true then they really do have problems. 150 horses MAX and they will know each horse as an individual, like Aidan O'Brien does. Stop buying all these yearlings, they have to give their breeding operation a chance, but instead they are basically saying "we don't trust our breeding operation" and what sort of an image does that put out to mare owners around the world? I want them to succeed because i'm fed up with Coolmore storming clear each and every year. The fact is that Coolmore run a business, they know all the horses they train. They don't go mad at the sales and they stick to a budget (something, which all businesses must do, no matter how much money they have disposable). They back their breeding operation up by winning all of these races with home breds. It's a free marketing campaign for them. They don't have to spend thousands of full page spreads in ever horse racing publication around, their record is good enough marketing on it's own. Godolphin need to take a long hard look at themselves and come up with a strict plan. They are ruining European racing with these tactics and they are ruining themselves. This "stupidity" about not buying any progeny of a coolmore stallion has to stop, it hasn't worked out as they had planned, in fact it has been thrown back in their face. Over the years they have done this, Coolmore have pulled further and further clear. The article that was written has nothing to do with jealousy, it is a fact based article, with many different opinions, all of which are saying that something needs to be done. This article sums up what i get told on a weekly basis from a friend that works there, but not for much longer. The staff are sick of it, they are there for the healthy wage packet they get (25-30,000 a year) just for riding a few horses out every day and only having to work 3 afternoons a week. I know of storied where the work riders have come into work at 6.30am and then they have finished by 7.30am because there aren't enough horses to ride. Up to 400 horses and there aren't enough to ride, mostly because about 50% of them are crippled. Come to Newmarket for a week, MMSC and i'm certain your attitude towards Godolphin would change. I respect you and i like how you have stuck by them, but the amount of horses i have liked that have been ruined by them was enough for me. Before i knew the ex General manager, i had no idea about the business side of things but the stories i was told left me in complete shock. I hope you don't see this as a dig at you in anyway, but i'm trying to get you to see sense.
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Avatar ~ Nicky Whelan and now we murderers because we kill time
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#6
08-06-2007, 01:25 PM
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If I'm not mistaken (and I may be), didn't the Sheikh want to concentrate more on racing in the US (TC races in particular) and Japan? He did pretty good last year here and he's now gotten into Japan. Also I heard last year at Saratoga that he had bought a farm very close to the track specifically for his 2 year olds and layups. Anyone know anything about that? Thanks. Deb
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#7
08-06-2007, 01:39 PM
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they should go be like Juddmonte
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#8
08-06-2007, 03:29 PM
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Just read another artivle on the Racing Post, and this just sums it up for me. This is Simon Crisford's comment regarding the next best race in the UK: “It is unlikely that we will have runners as things stand at the moment.” I mean, what are they doing with these horses? They have so many horses, and they can'tt find one to run over 10 furlongs in a Gr1 for a massive prize? If not, then the Observer article that i posted couldn't be closer to the truth.
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Avatar ~ Nicky Whelan and now we murderers because we kill time
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#9
08-06-2007, 03:47 PM
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Sorry for being scattered but a few things..... No, I don't take it as a dig at all. The part about blaming the sellers (... and you're right. Much as i'd like to think I wouldn't sell the reality is that I'm sure i would)... what i meant was that they're slammed over and over for their purchases while the sellers have some kinda immunity. The Geezer (I still don't understand why they bought him but i do like him very much) and Hinterland... why would you say they're ruined? Short version is this... I have absolutely no problem with your post. Clearly you know much more than I as you've followed this your whole life and I'm just a Smarty-era inductee. What i defend is their right to do what they choose with their horses. It's that simple. If a writer is penning a piece and they choose not to play along and answer questions I hold no grudge, especially after some of the nasty things written about them in the American press. You know for a fact I'm a big fan of AOB and I'm sick to death of the mentality that it's either / or... do you get what i'm saying? You and most here or all here thought it was a good piece. I thought it was propaganda. No big deal... all opinions are valid, right? One last thing..... I remember how slow they were to release the Blues and Royals news but they've been up front since then, haven't they? Again, sorry for being scattered..... just short of time.
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#10
08-06-2007, 04:16 PM
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The horses i listed, including Hinterland looked like nice horses before they went to Godolphin, but what happened after then? Nothing. Over night they lost all their ability? or Godolphin just can't train very well at all. They are the only two options. Same with short skirt and Silca's Sister, the later was a very good filly. She is now injured (what a surprise and is doubtful to run again). Vista Bella finished 3rd in the 1,000 guineas as a three year old. She was packed off to Godolphin and within THREE (yes, three) months she was seriously injured and has since shown nothing on the track. I wouldn't mind, but this happens so much, same happened with Imperial Stride, Narivk, Winged Cupid etc etc. The reason you ask? They train the horses too hard. They gallop the cr*p out of them, and they think that is how to train a racehorse. Go to the races in England and you will never see an unfit Godolphin horse, they will always look as fit as a flea because they have been galloped sensless. Yes, it gets them fit, but a horse CANNOT be trained like that. They do the same with their 2yo's as well, which is why it is very rare to see a Godolphin 2yo show the same sort of form at 3. David Loder quit training the Godolphin 2yo's because he was sick that he was being told they "had to win first time out" which meant galloping these poor 2yo's into the ground time after time. It was disgusting to hear of the break downs that they suffered, but they didn't care because they would just go and buy one to replace it. People have tried to change their ways, but if anyone trys to change them, they have a letter of resignation through the post for them to sign the very next day and a letter of confidentiality....... i wonder why! Put it this way, the news about Electrocusionist wasn't what you would call prompt You defend what they do with their horses? You defend the non stop galloping, you defend all of the injuries (most of which could be stopped), you defend the arrogance? That doesn't seem like you at all. As i said, come to Newmarket for a week and speak to the people in the know. I will introduce you to some people and i'm pretty sure you would leave very upset and angry.
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Avatar ~ Nicky Whelan and now we murderers because we kill time Last edited by NoChanceToDance : 08-06-2007 at 04:35 PM.
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#11
08-06-2007, 06:02 PM
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This offends me. The sad Electrocutionist news was released the morning it happened, I don't believe everything i hear / read in print / read online. Not saying you're wrong, only that i don't know if what you say is true just as i don't know if what they say is true. This though..... I lost my thoughts when i read this line. If i didn't know you a bit I'd say how the **** dare you. Since i do know you somewhat, I'll just say I'm surprised that you'd post such a thing. I'd say I'm hurt by it but i don't want to play the role of drama queen. Surprised. I'll leave it at that.
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#12
08-07-2007, 03:58 AM
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Well, this is your quote......
"What i defend is their right to do what they choose with their horses. It's that simple" You said you defend their right to do what they choose with their horses. They choose to gallop them into the ground and cause injuries to many different horses, horses that could have gone places and won big races if they had stayed with their previous trainer. I'm sorry if i have misread what your quote was meant to establish, but to me you are saying you defend what they do????? I was shocked when i reas that post, because i know that isn't like you at all. You know as well as me Godolphin have so many injuries and it happens every year. The Electrocusionist thing......... well, if you say so. Remember where my father works?
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Avatar ~ Nicky Whelan and now we murderers because we kill time
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#13
08-07-2007, 09:46 AM
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Nice. I'm criticized for the angels thread, accused of being overly morbid when all I'm trying to do is show some respect and now I'm accused of the opposite? I understand who you Dad is and that you know more than I BUT please understand..... what you're saying is, to me, hearsay. Rumor, accusation..... I've said before i don't believe everything i read ANYWHERE. I support their right to buy whichever horses they choose. I love many of their horses, I respect the way they pour money into international racing and promote the sport. What's wrong with that and why are you twisting my words and accusing me of supporting any kind of injury to any horses?????
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#14
08-07-2007, 09:55 AM
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#15
08-07-2007, 09:59 AM
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#16
08-07-2007, 10:16 AM
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#17
08-07-2007, 10:31 AM
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Coolmore have a budget, whether you choose to believe that is your problem. Their budget is HUGE, but it is there. Godolphin? well, they spend as much as they can, hoping for a return, which is a very risky game. When i say they don'y go mad, i mean in relation to Godolphin/Darley.
If you believe this article is hearsay or rumour, then you are very much mistaken. As i say, you don't live here, you don't know the ins and outs. Yet you are all telling me that i'm mistaken? Godolphin are a laughing stock over here, a complete laughing stock to anyone involved in racing. It's just that their media friendly position seems to appeal to many for reasons unknown to me.
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Avatar ~ Nicky Whelan and now we murderers because we kill time
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#18
08-07-2007, 10:33 AM
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They do not promote the sport anymore than any racing/stud organisation.
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Avatar ~ Nicky Whelan and now we murderers because we kill time
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#19
08-07-2007, 10:43 AM
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 You've probably got a lot more time on your hands than I...check out the yearling & HIT results within the past few years and tell me how well that tight budget has helped Coolmore in their auction purchases.
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#20
08-07-2007, 10:53 AM
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Lets just say they are more careful with their money than the Godolphin crew, by far. Both are bad for spending the amounts of money they do, but Godolphin do it much more often than Coomore do. I'm not talking about yearlings by the way, this topic was never about yearlings! It was the stupid amounts that they pay for the older horses already in training and been on the track. Ever see Coolmore do that? No, didn't think so.
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Avatar ~ Nicky Whelan and now we murderers because we kill time
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