SUN: Racing's media makeover paying off

[dalakhani]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

I keep wondering about what sport everyone is refering to? Are we talking about the same one? You know the one where the growth is almost exclusively in account wagering?


The product is gambling. It is neither male or female friendly. The KY Derby and Oaks are not the product nor are the tv ratings for those anything but a sidebar. Horseracing does NOT derive any signifigant revenue from TV unilke other sports which derive the vast majority of their revenue from TV. What Bravo or ABC or NBC focuses on during its telecasts dont change the fact that we need people betting into the pools on days other than Derby days.

It is good news that ratings are up. However no one should think that the increase in ratings is "because of" something done right or that an increase in ratings for a singular event (Derby) translates into "we are going into the right direction with our new focus". All it means was the ratings were up for a 2 hour period one day of the year.

I agree with pretty much everything you say here. The model has to change. Is it possible that racing could one day thrive where handle is just a portion of the revenue as opposed to nearly all of it? And if it can't, we need to look into new ways to generate handle.

[Scav]

Originally Posted by Bigsmc

There's bound to be some waitresses that think they can sing....

It is gonna be milf central. I wasn't going to go but it might be too priceless not to go.

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by dalakhani

I agree with pretty much everything you say here. The model has to change. Is it possible that racing could one day thrive where handle is just a portion of the revenue as opposed to nearly all of it? And if it can't, we need to look into new ways to generate handle.

How exactly could it change? What other revenue sources could there be? TV revenue? That is a pipedream.

Your last sentence is the key. No doubt that is the best way for the game to survive and thrive. Betfair is a perfect example yet virtually no one is pushing for it within the game and there really hasnt been a groundswell from the people who put the money through the windows either. And the depressing part is that not only would incorporating Betfair style gambling be difficult in determining how to split the income but will almost assuredly be opposed by politicians.

While I do understand that there is a certain percentage of woman that gamble and follow horseracing I simply dont believe that there is some huge, secret group of women that are waiting to be coaxed into going to the track.

[dalakhani]

Originally Posted by randallscott35

We don't need people to fall in love with the sport, we need people to BET!

How do they even know to BET unless they are exposed to it?????? Do you think the Joe Camel adds were there because the character is cute????

[Antitrust32]

ugh. The RTIP is filled with young adults / actual adults, who love horse racing and want to make a career in it. I dont know if its changed since I've been there.. but..

When I first started there were mostly men in the program, but a solid 30% women in the program.. by the time I left it was 50 / 50 because we got a ton of 18 year old girls one year (most people in the program dont start right after high school).

Not one of the girls gambled. They loved horse racing very much and followed it all the time... and a lot of them now have pretty good and influential jobs in the industry (not me of course).. as a group, including me, we probably put $300 total in the pools in a year.

On the other hand..

A lot of the guys in the program were in what they called "the Ramen Noodle Club". Because they bet constantly and bet their lunch money so all they could ever afford to eat was Ramen Noodle's.

[Scav]

Originally Posted by Antitrust32

ugh. The RTIP is filled with young adults / actual adults, who love horse racing and want to make a career in it. I dont know if its changed since I've been there.. but..

When I first started there were mostly men in the program, but a solid 30% women in the program.. by the time I left it was 50 / 50 because we got a ton of 18 year old girls one year (most people in the program dont start right after high school).

Not one of the girls gambled. They loved horse racing very much and followed it all the time... and a lot of them now have pretty good and influential jobs in the industry (not me of course).. as a group, including me, we probably put $300 total in the pools in a year.

On the other hand..

A lot of the guys in the program were in what they called "the Ramen Noodle Club". Because they bet constantly and bet their lunch money so all they could ever afford to eat was Ramen Noodle's.

Thank you Uncly or whatever your nickname is.

[dalakhani]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

How exactly could it change? What other revenue sources could there be? TV revenue? That is a pipedream.

Your last sentence is the key. No doubt that is the best way for the game to survive and thrive. Betfair is a perfect example yet virtually no one is pushing for it within the game and there really hasnt been a groundswell from the people who put the money through the windows either. And the depressing part is that not only would incorporating Betfair style gambling be difficult in determining how to split the income but will almost assuredly be opposed by politicians.

While I do understand that there is a certain percentage of woman that gamble and follow horseracing I simply dont believe that there is some huge, secret group of women that are waiting to be coaxed into going to the track.

There aren't...yet. Again, we have to adjust our thinking to a changing world. The role of women in sports and commerce is changing. Surely you understand this. We are the first generation of women that have grown up with this level of empowerment. Do you think that is going to go backward somehow?

The sports that have embraced the female sports fan have thrived, the ones that haven't are in trouble. Gambling is the same way. Women in the past didn't have the independence financially or otherwise to make decisions on how money was spent. Now?

You check out the way Las Vegas has changed their approach to the female gambler. Racing has, for the most part, been stuck in the fifties.

How many women do you see at football games today as opposed to 20 years ago? Baseball? how about hockey? How many women do you know that fill out tournament brackets? Has that gone up?

And TV is NOT a pipedream. If networks pay millions to watch rednecks drive a chevy around an oval for 5 hours, Im sure racing can put together a product that would at least be equally appealling.

[randallscott35]

Originally Posted by dalakhani

There aren't...yet. Again, we have to adjust our thinking to a changing world. The role of women in sports and commerce is changing. Surely you understand this. We are the first generation of women that have grown up with this level of empowerment. Do you think that is going to go backward somehow?

The sports that have embraced the female sports fan have thrived, the ones that haven't are in trouble. Gambling is the same way. Women in the past didn't have the independence financially or otherwise to make decisions on how money was spent. Now?

You check out the way Las Vegas has changed their approach to the female gambler. Racing has, for the most part, been stuck in the fifties.

How many women do you see at football games today as opposed to 20 years ago? Baseball? how about hockey? How many women do you know that fill out tournament brackets? Has that gone up?

And TV is NOT a pipedream. If networks pay millions to watch rednecks drive a chevy around an oval for 5 hours, Im sure racing can put together a product that would at least be equally appealling.

Those women at the football games are not betting on the games. We need bettors, not spectators. Racing would do better with whales at the track rather than 10k small players

[dalakhani]

Originally Posted by Antitrust32

ugh. The RTIP is filled with young adults / actual adults, who love horse racing and want to make a career in it. I dont know if its changed since I've been there.. but..

When I first started there were mostly men in the program, but a solid 30% women in the program.. by the time I left it was 50 / 50 because we got a ton of 18 year old girls one year (most people in the program dont start right after high school).

Not one of the girls gambled. They loved horse racing very much and followed it all the time... and a lot of them now have pretty good and influential jobs in the industry (not me of course).. as a group, including me, we probably put $300 total in the pools in a year.

On the other hand..

A lot of the guys in the program were in what they called "the Ramen Noodle Club". Because they bet constantly and bet their lunch money so all they could ever afford to eat was Ramen Noodle's.

I don't disagree that this was/is the case. I am not at all debating that women gamble less, much much less, than men....right now.

The point is that this will change. Not might change-will change. Its changing every day. This is irrefutable.

[ddthetide]

Originally Posted by Coach Pants

I haven't been to Churchill this year so not completely sure about the prices...

$5 parking
$3 admission
clubhouse? $5
program $3
Daily Racing Form $7.50
Food for two $15-20

Say a couple brings $100-$150 to the track... a large percentage is already going to the greedy corporate tax. So with the money they have left over their chances of making a few bucks and not losing it all are stacked against them.

And if they go on a day outside of the derby they are likely to have a bad experience. It's like trying to get into the White House in some parts. "No you need a pass for this area, another $10 bucks"

They nickle and dime the average Joe to death.

And you wonder why this sport can't grow?

[Kasept]

Originally Posted by randallscott35

Those women at the football games are not betting on the games. We need bettors, not spectators. Racing would do better with whales at the track rather than 10k small players

Every whale starts out as a minnow.

[randallscott35]

Originally Posted by Kasept

Every whale starts out as a minnow.

A male minnow though.

We need limos to get whales to the track. Dinners, dancing, etc...Rewards points isn't cutting it. Look what casinos do for their big bettors. Why isn't racing doing the same?

[Kasept]

Originally Posted by randallscott35

A male minnow though.

We need limos to get whales to the track. Dinners, dancing, etc...Rewards points isn't cutting it. Look what casinos do for their big bettors. Why isn't racing doing the same?

Because state governments regulate them..

[randallscott35]

Originally Posted by Kasept

Because state governments regulate them..

Well that needs to change.

[Antitrust32]

Originally Posted by dalakhani

I don't disagree that this was/is the case. I am not at all debating that women gamble less, much much less, than men....right now.

The point is that this will change. Not might change-will change. Its changing every day. This is irrefutable.

While I pretty much agree with your reply to Chuck.. I just dont believe this change will occur in horse racing. IMO, racing has a much greater chance of going under completely than this change occuring. There are more than a few reasons I feel this way (ugh, I better not say "I" too much or SCUDS will get on me)

1) perceived cheating (drugs) keeps lots of people away from racing
2) breakdowns are a huge turn off
3) there's a perception out there that racing is cruel, and I believe women would buy into that easier (we have bigger hearts)
4) high take out keeps lots of people away
5) there are much easier forms of gambling out there that are more appealing
6) most importantly.. women will always be more responsible (or how did Math put it about his wife?) with their $

[dalakhani]

Originally Posted by randallscott35

A male minnow though.

We need limos to get whales to the track. Dinners, dancing, etc...Rewards points isn't cutting it. Look what casinos do for their big bettors. Why isn't racing doing the same?

So your fix for racing is to send limos out for big players? You think that a person of means is going to go to Laurel park on a saturday afternoon because you sent a car to his house? Surely you jest.

[randallscott35]

Originally Posted by dalakhani

So your fix for racing is to send limos out for big players? You think that a person of means is going to go to Laurel park on a saturday afternoon because you sent a car to his house? Surely you jest.

Who says they will be betting on Laurel?...It works for AC and its a cess pool down there.....Limos are a start. I'm talking full court treatment.

[dalakhani]

Originally Posted by randallscott35

Who says they will be betting on Laurel?...It works for AC and its a cess pool down there.....Limos are a start. I'm talking full court treatment.

It works for AC? Huh? AC is broke Randall. It is a dying town and the only viable casino there is far off the strip. What is that viable casino? Hmmmmm..

Would this casino have restaurants by celebrity chefs? Would it have a dance club that packs in beautiful people? Would it have concerts and shows? Would it have a nice spa??? Would it have a shopping arcade???

[randallscott35]

Originally Posted by dalakhani

It works for AC? Huh? AC is broke Randall. It is a dying town and the only viable casino there is far off the strip. What is that viable casino? Hmmmmm..

Would this casino have restaurants by celebrity chefs? Would it have a dance club that packs in beautiful people? Would it have concerts and shows? Would it have a nice spa??? Would it have a shopping arcade???

AC is broke b/c gambling is available everywhere. Pocono, Foxwoods indian casinos all over....Just more of a reason for racing to make itself a whales first option. Lowering WPS to 10% has to happen as well. Good luck trying to convince people of this.

Would it have a spa that has a vajazzle booth?