Slots are in at Gulfstream

[blackthroatedwind]

Originally Posted by eurobounce

Do you think that the 7 or 7.5 is fair?

Fair or not I believe it is the general going rate.

Originally Posted by blackthroatedwind

Fair or not I believe it is the general going rate.

I know it is the going rate. But I believe that the 7.5% is a number used to appease the horsemen. I think that the number will shrink over time.

[blackthroatedwind]

Originally Posted by eurobounce

I know it is the going rate. But I believe that the 7.5% is a number used to appease the horsemen. I think that the number will shrink over time.

Could well be. How long is the current deal structure?

One thing we know....racing at Gulfstream is VERY low on Frank's list of priorities.

Originally Posted by blackthroatedwind

Could well be. How long is the current deal structure?

One thing we know....racing at Gulfstream is VERY low on Frank's list of priorities.

Racing in general is low in Franks priorities. He is a smart man and knows there is no money to be made in racing. You make money by offering casino type of gambling. Frank has used racing as a vehicle to get casino type of operations.

[blackthroatedwind]

Originally Posted by eurobounce

Racing in general is low in Franks priorities. He is a smart man and knows there is no money to be made in racing. You make money by offering casino type of gambling. Frank has used racing as a vehicle to get casino type of operations.

Anybody as enamored with Gene Stevens as Frank is can't be very smart.

[philcski]

Originally Posted by blackthroatedwind

I'm always leery of the first stretch out by a sprinter. I find that is usually the best effort they will have going long. Add that to the fact that he dictated the pace on a speed favoring track and save Barbaro there was little in the way of competition in the race and it's hard to be overly enthusiastic about his performance. On the other hand, he still lost a close one to a very good horse. However, it was hardly Barbaro's best race.

All in all, Sharp Humor's return was encouraging, as there's nothing wrong with Gold and Roses. From what I've heard they are not going into 2007 with the intention of throwing him to the wolves. Sounds like a good plan.....we'll see if they stick to it.

I'd like to test your theory, however to agree with your idea the most successful stretchout angle to me is the maiden sprinter who stretches out for the first time, suddenly they find themselves all alone on the front end for the first time and run a career top. Next time in tougher company, not the same scenario as invariably someone beats them to the first call or the pace is significantly stronger.

Throwing SH to the wolves, or G and R?

[Pedigree Ann]

Originally Posted by oracle80

I rememeber when Gulf was THE PLACE in the winter and when the cards were great.

Boy, I'm getting old. I remember when HIALEAH was THE PLACE in the winter, and Gulfstream was the afterthought of the winter season. No Calder, no year-round racing; all the Northern horses came South for the winter, the late, lamented Tropical Park in Nov/Dec, Hialeah in Jan/Feb, Gulfstream in March/Apr. Then all the horses would ship up to fill races at northern tracks. Midwest still works that way, to some degree - Fair Grounds in winter, Oaklawn shading over into spring; FG and OP horses ship north to Kee/CD and AP/Haw, reversing the direction in November.

[blackthroatedwind]

Originally Posted by philcski

Throwing SH to the wolves, or G and R?

Sharp Humor.

I sort of like a horse who stretches out for the first time who should speed while sprinting. I really like the horse if there is no other speed in the race.

[Pedigree Ann]

Originally Posted by oracle80

Ahh, but you didn't address the incredibly stupid track configuration.
Don't you think that some was asleep at the whell when they ok'd a track config that eliminated mile and a sixteenth races(at of all places a track that prides itself on being a place where three year olds go to prepare for the crown)? And even worse made the mile and an eigth races exteremely hard to win from outside post 5?
Trainers only have one two turn option, a mile and an eigth, and many three year olds don't wanna go that far in Jan and Feb and even in March.
It wasn't exactly well thought out, to say the least.

Oddly enough, Hialeah, the empress of the Florida tracks, was a 9f circuit. It had a program of 3yo races to prepare them to go long, based on the assumption that the colts would have had a break of a couple months or more. For example, the schedule in 1970 was; 21 Jan Hibiscus S at 6f - 4 Feb Bahamas S at 7f - 18 Feb Everglades S at 9f - 3 March Flamingo S at 9f. Of course, it was assumed that these 3yos would go on to run in further 2-turn races before the Derby. For example, Arts and Letters, the champion 3yo of 1979, won the Evergaldes and Blue Grass, was second in the Flamingo, Fountain of Youth and Florida Derby. Went on to run close seconds in the Derby and Preakness, then win the Met Mile, Belmont, Travers, Woodward and JCGold Cup.

Ann, I simply love your posts. They are always well written and filled with info.

[philcski]

Originally Posted by Pedigree Ann

Oddly enough, Hialeah, the empress of the Florida tracks, was a 9f circuit. It had a program of 3yo races to prepare them to go long, based on the assumption that the colts would have had a break of a couple months or more. For example, the schedule in 1970 was; 21 Jan Hibiscus S at 6f - 4 Feb Bahamas S at 7f - 18 Feb Everglades S at 9f - 3 March Flamingo S at 9f. Of course, it was assumed that these 3yos would go on to run in further 2-turn races before the Derby. For example, Arts and Letters, the champion 3yo of 1979, won the Evergaldes and Blue Grass, was second in the Flamingo, Fountain of Youth and Florida Derby. Went on to run close seconds in the Derby and Preakness, then win the Met Mile, Belmont, Travers, Woodward and JCGold Cup.

They also ran a mile and a sixteenth there quite frequently...
I remember because i'd asked my grandmother at a young age (who lived in hialeah back in the early '80's) "why do they start on the turn? isn't that not fair?"

[ArlJim78]

Paging Nurse Ratched, please call your office. Emergency medication alert!

[Dunbar]

Originally Posted by blackthroatedwind

I'm always leery of the first stretch out by a sprinter. I find that is usually the best effort they will have going long. Add that to the fact that he dictated the pace on a speed favoring track and save Barbaro there was little in the way of competition in the race and it's hard to be overly enthusiastic about his performance. On the other hand, he still lost a close one to a very good horse. However, it was hardly Barbaro's best race.

All in all, Sharp Humor's return was encouraging, as there's nothing wrong with Gold and Roses. From what I've heard they are not going into 2007 with the intention of throwing him to the wolves. Sounds like a good plan.....we'll see if they stick to it.

I pretty much agree with everything Philcski's written about SH in this thread. btwind, what makes you say the Fla Derby was "hardly Barbaro's best race"? I suspect you are using circular reasoning: something like, 'He had trouble getting by the nothing special SH, therefore, it wasn't Barbaro's "A" race.'

We shall see. If the odds are good enough, I won't hesitate to bet on SH.

--Dunbar

[blackthroatedwind]

Originally Posted by Dunbar

I pretty much agree with everything Philcski's written about SH in this thread. btwind, what makes you say the Fla Derby was "hardly Barbaro's best race"? I suspect you are using circular reasoning: something like, 'He had trouble getting by the nothing special SH, therefore, it wasn't Barbaro's "A" race.'

We shall see. If the odds are good enough, I won't hesitate to bet on SH.

--Dunbar

No, it wasn't a particularly " fast " race. The only race he ran in, that he finished, where he may have run worse was the Holy Bull, which was in the mud.

I'm sorry, which race do you think he ran that was so much worse? To me he was a better turf horse than dirt horse, and relatively speaking his 2YO turf races were more impressive than his Florida Derby win and, and feel free to disagree with this, I thought his Kentucky Derby was better than his Florida Derby. You know, he only ran a total of seven races.

[ArlJim78]

Originally Posted by Dunbar

I pretty much agree with everything Philcski's written about SH in this thread. btwind, what makes you say the Fla Derby was "hardly Barbaro's best race"? I suspect you are using circular reasoning: something like, 'He had trouble getting by the nothing special SH, therefore, it wasn't Barbaro's "A" race.'

We shall see. If the odds are good enough, I won't hesitate to bet on SH.

--Dunbar

BTW can answer for himself but I have an opinion on it. Watching Barbaro in that race I got the impression that they were trying to use him at the minimum required level to win the race in order to leave as much in the tank for the derby as possible. I think they didn't anticipate SH getting so stubborn on the rail. What I saw was less than an all our effort from Barbaro.
To me the derby pretty much confirmed this in my eyes.
With that said, I still thought it was a great effort that day by SH.

[Dunbar]

Originally Posted by blackthroatedwind

No, it wasn't a particularly " fast " race. The only race he ran in, that he finished, where he may have run worse was the Holy Bull, which was in the mud.

I'm sorry, which race do you think he ran that was so much worse? To me he was a better turf horse than dirt horse, and relatively speaking his 2YO turf races were more impressive than his Florida Derby win and, and feel free to disagree with this, I thought his Kentucky Derby was better than his Florida Derby. You know, he only ran a total of seven races.

Fair enough, btwind. I'll just say I'm skeptical of attempts to label a race as 'not trying' or 'toying with competition'. I realize you are not saying either of those. As far as "fast", I thought the BSF compared well with Barbaro's other races, but I could be remembering that wrong.

I actually started reading this thread because of the "slots are in at Gulfstream" title, before getting distracted by mention of one of my fav current horses, Sharp Humor.

The savvy folks at vpFREE (a Yahoo group focussed on video poker) have looked at the Gulfstream video poker offerings and pronounced them "terrible". The payoff tables are apparently extremely poor from the players' perspective. This isn't too surprising--it's what often happens when there is little competition. The average gambler will lose at a rate 2-4% faster than they would in many Las Vegas or Atlantic City casinos. That fig is for video poker, but I suspect the same holds true for the mindless slots, too.

--Dunbar