Empire Way

Originally Posted by Kasept

65 Beyer

Wow. That's a shock. Visually it looked alot better than that. BTW kids don't be fooled by how the rider either drives or doesn't. I've learned over the years to TRUST THE NUMBER. I've seen a thousand races where the jocks was motionless but the horse especially a young one was doing his best. The horses don't have the reasoning in their minds to gear it down. They just run. Rosario asked him to roll pretty good going to the quarter pole. From there in regardless of what he did I expect Empire Way was pretty much doing close to his best. The numbers tend to be the closest things to fact. Adjusting off those with something tough to quantify usually is not nearly as reliable. TRUST THE NUMBERS. Will be very interesting to see what Thoro-graph and Ragozin give him.

[blackthroatedwind]

Originally Posted by v j stauffer

Wow. That's a shock. Visually it looked alot better than that. BTW kids don't be fooled by how the rider either drives or doesn't. I've learned over the years to TRUST THE NUMBER. I've seen a thousand races where the jocks was motionless but the horse especially a young one was doing his best. The horses don't have the reasoning in their minds to gear it down. They just run. Rosario asked him to roll pretty good going to the quarter pole. From there in regardless of what he did I expect Empire Way was pretty much doing close to his best. The numbers tend to be the closest things to fact. Adjusting off those with something tough to quantify usually is not nearly as reliable. TRUST THE NUMBERS. Will be very interesting to see what Thoro-graph and Ragozin give him.

Piece of information, Vic.....most people here understand horse racing better than you.

[freddymo]

Originally Posted by blackthroatedwind

Piece of information, Vic.....most people here understand horse racing better than you.

I find that hard to fathom. Vic has worked as a race caller, bloodstock agent, and Jocks agent at the same time!!! How many people have been able to juggle so many balls, with the level of integrity and knowledge that Vic has? You think its easy to be an expert at all three areas of the industry and keep your feet firmly planted in Loyalty and Honesty?

Just call me one of Vic's Kids

[Rudeboyelvis]

Originally Posted by v j stauffer

Wow. That's a shock.

What was so shocking about the number, Vic? They crawled and came home slow

Split times - R4) 23 / 46.3 / 1.11.3 / 1.17.4 (1.17.93)

32k claimers immediately preceding - R3) 23 / 46.1 / 1.09.3 / 1.15.3 (1.15.79)

The only thing particularly impressive, visually or otherwise, about that performance is where they found the plugs to line up with him.... I don't take anything away from him - a win is a win and he got the job done without urging, in nothing more than a typical workout fashion - that number is generous if anything at all.

[Indian Charlie]

Perhaps Empire Way is a dirt horse too.

I don't see any relevance to what number he got for this spot.

[RolloTomasi]

Originally Posted by Indian Charlie

Perhaps Empire Way is a dirt horse too.

I don't see any relevance to what number he got for this spot.

One way to look at it is to factor in Mike Harrington's opinion. Perhaps he was full of sh!t or perhaps his judgement isn't particularly sharp, but he claimed he'd be "surprised" if that horse won yesterday. He was certain the horse needed two turns.

Coupling the speed figure the winner earned with the fact that he did win despite the trainer's reservations suggests that the race was utterly horrendous. In that sense, you might say that Empire Way is still a "maiden" (especially since it didn't appear to be even much of a schooling race for him). And yet he will be facing winners next time out.

Originally Posted by blackthroatedwind

Piece of information, Vic.....most people here understand horse racing better than you.

OK. Who knows more about horse racing wasn't exactly the purpose of my post. Just contributing to the thread about Empire Way.

Originally Posted by Rudeboyelvis

What was so shocking about the number, Vic? They crawled and came home slow

Split times - R4) 23 / 46.3 / 1.11.3 / 1.17.4 (1.17.93)

32k claimers immediately preceding - R3) 23 / 46.1 / 1.09.3 / 1.15.3 (1.15.79)

The only thing particularly impressive, visually or otherwise, about that performance is where they found the plugs to line up with him.... I don't take anything away from him - a win is a win and he got the job done without urging, in nothing more than a typical workout fashion - that number is generous if anything at all.

Maybe shocking is not the right word. However he seemed to look like he was running better than a 65. Again, that's why I trust the figures much more than my eye. Even after 30 years.

Originally Posted by freddymo

I find that hard to fathom. Vic has worked as a race caller, bloodstock agent, and Jocks agent at the same time!!! How many people have been able to juggle so many balls, with the level of integrity and knowledge that Vic has? You think its easy to be an expert at all three areas of the industry and keep your feet firmly planted in Loyalty and Honesty?

Just call me one of Vic's Kids

Freddy! Please no more kids. Guess you can't make everybody happy. Don't forget this year I added another juggle to the resume. Steward. Wow. What a ride that was.

Thanks for the kind words.

[blackthroatedwind]

Originally Posted by v j stauffer

OK. Who knows more about horse racing wasn't exactly the purpose of my post. Just contributing to the thread about Empire Way.

No, you were being your usual condescending self, acting the bigshot deigning to talk to the little folk.

You're like Mr. Short Term Memory Man in that you occasionally forget that this is the board that DOESN'T fall for your act.

Originally Posted by blackthroatedwind

No, you were being your usual condescending self, acting the bigshot deigning to talk to the little folk.

You're like Mr. Short Term Memory Man in that you occasionally forget that this is the board that DOESN'T fall for your act.

Wow. Saying BTW Kids is condescending? Ok if you say so.

So what about HOY?

[blackthroatedwind]

Originally Posted by v j stauffer

Wow. Saying BTW Kids is condescending? Ok if you say so.

I hear the International Room is where the cool kids are hanging these days.

[Scav]

Originally Posted by Cardus

You can't help yourself.

You missed alot of the better stuff

[Duvalier]

Bwahaha

[asudevil]

Originally Posted by blackthroatedwind

No, you were being your usual condescending self, acting the bigshot deigning to talk to the little folk.

You're like Mr. Short Term Memory Man in that you occasionally forget that this is the board that DOESN'T fall for your act.

I went to webster.com for that one. At Derby Trail, I learn something new every day.

[golfer]

Just when you think this may become an INSTANT CLASSIC, censorship rears it's ugly head

[RolloTomasi]

Originally Posted by golfer

Just when you think this may become an INSTANT CLASSIC, censorship rears it's ugly head

Call it the Riot Police.

Originally Posted by Cardus

You can't help yourself.

I wish I could. I'm 52. Started in the business at 17. Actually that's 35 years. Yeesh and I thought I couldn't feel any worse.

Why would saying I trust the numbers more after 30 years than my eye prompt you to say "Can't help yourself"?

Wow. I just posted about a horse I called Sunday.

Didn't realize there was such a smoldering caldron.

[Riot]

Originally Posted by RolloTomasi

Call it the Riot Police.

Tell us, Rollo, what do you think of Empire Way's Beyer?

[my miss storm cat]

Originally Posted by golfer

Just when you think this may become an INSTANT CLASSIC, censorship rears it's ugly head

The great Homeric tales were passed down orally from generation to generation...

This can be like the DT version and we who witnessed it can recall it for future DT generations.