Drug O'Neil keeps on a butchering

[randallscott35]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

In the last 5 years O'Neil has had 23 appear to have broken down. He makes a lot of starts but that is a lot of dead horses. Dale Romans with a similar sized outfit during that same period had 5 break down.

Chuck, "It is easier on them." ---o'neill.

[freddymo]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

The big difference between the 2 situations is the Zito horses were never any good, they have been slow from the start. They obviously want to sell them at that price but more importantly from the trainers standpoint, get a win to pad the stats. Since trainers are almost exclusively selected, hired or fired based on win %, Zito figures he can pick up a couple more cheap wins (like C. Clement does every year at Suffolk) as he already was 2 for 3 there. He won one and lost that one and now has 3 more wins to add to the %.

O'Neil drops horses that have been successful at higher levels when they are broke down hoping to get the claimed and maybe even win as well.

There is a big difference between selling slow horses and broke down ones.

And I do not think that it is the responsibility of the owners who bred or bought the horses at auction. It is the responsibility of the current owner and trainer to protect the horse. If they can't spare the couple of grand they shouldnt be in the "business".

I agree that the situations are different TOTALLY.. I doubt HoF trainer Zito give a flyin Fcuk about winning a Mdn 4 at Suffolk.. It's just the easiest way to stop the bills to his owner..

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by randallscott35

Chuck, "It is easier on them." ---o'neill.

Well to be fair he had I think 4 break down in stakes which in itself is quite remarkable

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by freddymo

I agree that the situations are different TOTALLY.. I doubt HoF trainer Zito give a flyin Fcuk about winning a Mdn 4 at Suffolk.. It's just the easiest way to stop the bills to his owner..

He likes wins like everyone else. Maiden 4's show up in the win column the same as grade 1's.

[Payson Dave]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

He likes wins like everyone else. Maiden 4's show up in the win column the same as grade 1's.

Getting Maxine back off of injured reserves should help his win % improve

[randallscott35]

Lets not forget the near breakdown of Lava Man. Who knows how close that may have been after he came back with "the ankles of a 3 yr old" from the voodoo doctor.

[freddymo]

Originally Posted by Scav

It isn't tough, why does a guy like LaPenta even have to run those horses for 4k, why not just retire them to an adaption facility, donate 6 months of care ($1500 roughly at an adaption facility) and clean the books.

These guys are sharp enough to understand that if their trainer is telling them they should run their 6 figure horses for 4k at Suffolk that they aren't very good horses.

Scavs the horses might be ok and perhaps in the hands of a trainer that can focus on them a bit more that might become useful claimers? You have to believe that Zito gave it his best shot but once it became evident that the stock would not be the type that Lapenta cares to campaign perhaps the barn stopped giving their all to get them as perfect as possible.. Not suggesting claiming from Zito is all that bright just that you shouldn't HAVE too retire a 250k 3 year old because one trainer and owner have bigger fish to fry.

[freddymo]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

He likes wins like everyone else. Maiden 4's show up in the win column the same as grade 1's.

Winners share was 5k I wonder if he will even bill the trainers award?

[tiggerv]

It's been a real treat to handicap the horses he sends to CT that can't cut it at Philly or Penn National. I don't remember any breaking down but I could have missed one.

There is actually a lot of money to be made off him since most of his horses go off as heavy favorites or close 2nd choice. Toss the low level claimers and assume the ALW horses are live.

Since Feb1
Starter/Allowance/Stakes - 7 Starts 5-0-1
Claiming 10K+ - 6 Starts 2-3-1
Claiming < 10K - 14 Starts 2-1-1

He has been listed as owner for several that have come to CT directly from SoCal. All have run in claimers and he is 1 for 7. I'm not sure how shipping across the country to run for 11K purses makes sense, but he must be making money off it.

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by freddymo

Winners share was 5k I wonder if he will even bill the trainers award?

I'm sure he doesn't work for free

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by tiggerv

It's been a real treat to handicap the horses he sends to CT that can't cut it at Philly or Penn National. I don't remember any breaking down but I could have missed one.

There is actually a lot of money to be made off him since most of his horses go off as heavy favorites or close 2nd choice. Toss the low level claimers and assume the ALW horses are live.

Since Feb1
Starter/Allowance/Stakes - 7 Starts 5-0-1
Claiming 10K+ - 6 Starts 2-3-1
Claiming < 10K - 14 Starts 2-1-1

He has been listed as owner for several that have come to CT directly from SoCal. All have run in claimers and he is 1 for 7. I'm not sure how shipping across the country to run for 11K purses makes sense, but he must be making money off it.

He had a couple big droppers bite the dust this winter at Philly

[Danzig]

Originally Posted by SCUDSBROTHER

"O’Neill said he turned down offers from individuals to buy Burna Dette beforehand because the owner wanted to win the race and hoped to keep the horse."

Can you really, ever again, trust anything coming out of that mouth?

i thought it sounded like absolute bs as well.

[freddymo]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

I'm sure he doesn't work for free

I guess but sometimes a freebie is appropiate.. Zito has done awesome for Lapenta but maybe this cast aways are on the arm?

[The Indomitable DrugS]

Originally Posted by SCUDSBROTHER

He really entered Tuscan Evening (having a heart attack) into this discussion? WTF ...

Tuscan Evening was 0-for-11 in Europe - and was beaten 20+ lengths in a maiden race at Cork in Ireland in her final Euro start.

Obviously our medication had moved her way up.

[Antitrust32]

Originally Posted by the_fat_man

Someone enlighten me here: are claiming horses typically insured? And, if so, is it for a preset level or does it fluctuate depending on the last race level?

yes.. if a horse drops into a 5k claimer, it can only be insured for 5k. their values are always fluctuating.

edit: probably not "typically" insured, though we do have a lot of claimers we write.

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by freddymo

I guess but sometimes a freebie is appropiate.. Zito has done awesome for Lapenta but maybe this cast aways are on the arm?

I highly doubt it but why would anyone really care anyway?

[Honu]

Originally Posted by The Indomitable DrugS

Tuscan Evening was 0-for-11 in Europe - and was beaten 20+ lengths in a maiden race at Cork in Ireland in her final Euro start.

Obviously our medication had moved her way up.

Lasix will do that for some horses.

[Siena 16]

O'Neil dropping the horse in for 2K is an example of why "it's a dead game" Laddy. and guys like Doug are bringing horse racing to a slow death.
A sport I love played by animals that should be loved at all costs

[RolloTomasi]

Originally Posted by The Indomitable DrugS

Tuscan Evening was 0-for-11 in Europe - and was beaten 20+ lengths in a maiden race at Cork in Ireland in her final Euro start.

Obviously our medication had moved her way up.

Didn't she lose a Group 1 (the Irish 1000 Guineas) by less than a length?

[Rupert Pupkin]

Doug O'Neil is the true definition of "a wolf in sheep's clothes".