My questions for the weekend

Seattleallstar · #1 06-01-2008, 09:41 PM

Did we really see the real Surf Cat?

Do we throw out Harlem Rockers race on polytrack, or was he supposed to beat those nags anyway no matter what they ran on?

Scav · #2 06-01-2008, 10:01 PM

Lollie Lollie

GPK · #3 06-02-2008, 06:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Seattleallstar

Did we really see the real Surf Cat?

Do we throw out Harlem Rockers race on polytrack, or was he supposed to beat those nags anyway no matter what they ran on?

Jer,

Sadly, Surf Cat's best days are behind him. Hasn't been the same since returning from his injury. He has yet to show that same powerful stride he used to have. I'm not sure if it is a result of his injury, the cushion track or a combination of both.

Hickory Hill Hoff · #4 06-02-2008, 06:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Seattleallstar

Did we really see the real Surf Cat?

Do we throw out Harlem Rockers race on polytrack, or was he supposed to beat those nags anyway no matter what they ran on?

According to many.....yes

ArlJim78 · #5 06-02-2008, 07:54 AM

yes we saw the real Surf Cat, that race did not set up well for him, four horse field at 9furlongs.

I wouldnt give up on Harlem Rocker just yet.

SundayStar · #6 06-02-2008, 10:15 AM

i wish we could see him on dirt again. his loss of speed has coincided with his running on the fake stuff. as mentioned, it could be also that he's lost a step since his last injury or from older age. but i'd still like to see him on dirt... what are the odds of that. 100-1?

Seattleallstar · #7 06-02-2008, 10:50 AM

Thats just too bad for Surf Cat then, I really loved this horse. As for Harlem Rocker I hope we can just throw out the race, even if he should of beaten that field with three legs running on sand from the Middle East.

eajinabi · #8 06-02-2008, 07:41 PM

I believe it was Harlem Rocker's 4th start of his career and beat a 4 horse crap field in his last and that somehow put him in the same category as Big Brown. He has potential thats for sure. Pletcher is very good with 2-3 yr olds but I really do believe this horse will benifit from a Trainer Switch if this horse is to be productive at 4 yr old. Just my opinion.

eajinabi · #9 06-02-2008, 07:56 PM

I will give it to either:

Bill Mott
Richard Mandella
Kiaran Mclaughlin

hockey2315 · #10 06-02-2008, 08:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by eajinabi

I believe it was Harlem Rocker's 4th start of his career and beat a 4 horse crap field in his last and that somehow put him in the same category as Big Brown. He has potential thats for sure. Pletcher is very good with 2-3 yr olds but I really do believe this horse will benifit from a Trainer Switch if this horse is to be productive at 4 yr old. Just my opinion.

He's 3.

eajinabi · #11 06-02-2008, 08:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hockey2315

He's 3.

Read my post again

hockey2315 · #12 06-02-2008, 09:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by eajinabi

Read my post again

I could read it a hundred times and it won't make any more sense or be any more relevant. You're talking about what they should do with the horse when he's 4 halfway through his 3 year-old season.

eajinabi · #13 06-02-2008, 09:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hockey2315

I could read it a hundred times and it won't make any more sense or be any more relevant. You're talking about what they should do with the horse when he's 4 halfway through his 3 year-old season.

Well think about it. He passed all derby preps, passed all TC races. What is he going for?? The Travers?? sorry that goes to Big Brown as well. Even if HR does win the Travers, the 3 YO HOY is bagged up by BB. Knowing Frank Stronach, he is looking for a monster 4 YO with this one. Just my opinion

hockey2315 · #14 06-02-2008, 09:14 PM

You're right - the only race left for the next six months is the Travers and Big Brown's already got that locked up. Wrong. (Just my opinion).

eajinabi · #15 06-02-2008, 09:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hockey2315

You're right - the only race left for the next six months is the Travers and Big Brown's already got that locked up. Wrong. (Just my opinion).

If HR (at this point) couldnt beat pintos in the queens plate TRIAL he surely will contend in other 3 YO stakes races on US soil with regular horses. Fine put 1 or 2 more races in him by years end (G3 or less) to give him some soild racing experience. What do you think?

Bobby Fischer · #16 06-02-2008, 11:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Seattleallstar

Did we really see the real Surf Cat?

I don't know. He isn't better than heatseeker. It seemed like he was closer to the pace and didn't get the momentum that he needs, but I am not a surf cat expert.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Seattleallstar

Do we throw out Harlem Rockers race on polytrack, or was he supposed to beat those nags anyway no matter what they ran on?

He didn't look as good as he has been touted. Cut him back against a week group over a mile on dirt and he should do really well. I may be in the minority, but I wouldn't mind seeing him get his "groove" back in an allowance before facing stakes companty.

eajinabi · #17 06-02-2008, 11:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bobby Fischer

I don't know. He isn't better than heatseeker. It seemed like he was closer to the pace and didn't get the momentum that he needs, but I am not a surf cat expert.

He didn't look as good as he has been touted. Cut him back against a week group over a mile on dirt and he should do really well. I may be in the minority, but I wouldn't mind seeing him get his "groove" back in an allowance before facing stakes companty.

I want to say its the poly track. Try him on Turf cause he really does have a late turn of foot that can suit on Turf but then again Headley isnt a Turf trainer. Ok, take him east and run him in the Forego then lead him into the Cigar Mile

RolloTomasi · #18 06-02-2008, 11:56 PM

Surf Cat looked uncomfortable on the pace (as he did in his disastrous turf experiment last fall) with his head bent towards the rail. How much of that was being taken out of his game or due to chronic wear-and-tear is anyone's guess. Either way he's better served pointing to the Triple Bend at 7f than the Hollywood Gold Cup at 10f.

He's never really established himself as a solid 9f horse (aside from a paltry Swaps victory) much less at 10f (he got browbeat by Borrego in the Pac Classic), so why try now?

At least he won't have Greg's Gold to deal with anymore if he cuts back to sprints.

CSC · #19 06-03-2008, 08:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Seattleallstar

Do we throw out Harlem Rockers race on polytrack,

Here is some info from after his race. The source has been spot on with his info.

"I spoke with Adena today about Harlem Rocker and he seems to have come
out of the race OK. As of now, the plan is for HR to remain at Woodbine. They have not given up on the Queen's Plate as an immediate target and want HR to have a chance to train over the Woodbine surface before making a final decision about his ability to handle that kind of track.

Coa said this after the race: "He kind of made a move and realized it wasn't his game and he decided not to run. He never made me feel that he was handling it at the beginning of the race, I wasn't worried about it. But he never picked up the bit."

Coa told Adena that the distance was not the problem, and that HR was not really acting like himself prior to the race either. He did not load easily, and never really got into the bit at all during the race. I'm sure we will get some updates on his training over the next week or so and will let you know how he is doing."

CSC · #20 06-03-2008, 08:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by eajinabi

If HR (at this point) couldnt beat pintos in the queens plate TRIAL he surely will contend in other 3 YO stakes races on US soil with regular horses. Fine put 1 or 2 more races in him by years end (G3 or less) to give him some soild racing experience. What do you think?

I would like to think we have gotten past this apparent conceit that our horses are so much more superior than horses not based in The U.S.