Pletcher KY Derby Entrants - Page 2

zippyneedsawin · #21 03-11-2007, 04:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by easy goer

Grapelli is on your grocery store shelves. Look in the olive oil section.

I thought Lucas had the record w/ 5 in 1986 (Grindstone's win). I dont know if Zito had 5, what year?

Zito had five in 2005.. Bellamy Road(7th), Andromeda's Hero (8th), Noble Causeway (14th), "the great" Sun King (15th), and High Fly (20th)

Sightseek · #22 03-11-2007, 04:59 PM

I think of all of his contenders, Ravel is the most interesting.

I'm not sure what to make of the way he is being brought into the Derby. It seems that Circular Quay would be the horse he'd be most likely to baby since he has a 2 year old foundation, yet he is choosing to bring Ravel into the Derby off 4 or 5 starts. So is there something wrong with Ravel or is Pletcher that confident in him?

SniperSB23 · #23 03-11-2007, 05:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sightseek

I think of all of his contenders, Ravel is the most interesting.

I'm not sure what to make of the way he is being brought into the Derby. It seems that Circular Quay would be the horse he'd be most likely to baby since he has a 2 year old foundation, yet he is choosing to bring Ravel into the Derby off 4 or 5 starts. So is there something wrong with Ravel or is Pletcher that confident in him?

I think he's a very fragile horse and Pletcher is just hoping to get him to the Derby in one piece by racing him sparingly.

zippyneedsawin · #24 03-11-2007, 05:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sightseek

I think of all of his contenders, Ravel is the most interesting.

I'm not sure what to make of the way he is being brought into the Derby. It seems that Circular Quay would be the horse he'd be most likely to baby since he has a 2 year old foundation, yet he is choosing to bring Ravel into the Derby off 4 or 5 starts. So is there something wrong with Ravel or is Pletcher that confident in him?

I'm leaning toward 'something wrong' ... or at least he's likely very fragile.

XIIPointStables · #25 03-11-2007, 06:56 PM

I wonder how seriously he'll have to think about Rags to Riches at this point after the way she romped in the SA Oaks.

She looked ultra impressive. The HRTV host never bothered to ask Pletcher directly what the plans were after the race. I think she asked Michael Tabor and he was non-committal, but said she would stay on "a road towards the Triple Crown" or something like that. But it sounded like they were leaning towards no.

randallscott35 · #26 03-11-2007, 06:57 PM

Can Denman get a new race call? I mean Durkin is creative.

zippyneedsawin · #27 03-11-2007, 08:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by XIIPointStables

I wonder how seriously he'll have to think about Rags to Riches at this point after the way she romped in the SA Oaks.

She looked ultra impressive. The HRTV host never bothered to ask Pletcher directly what the plans were after the race. I think she asked Michael Tabor and he was non-committal, but said she would stay on "a road towards the Triple Crown" or something like that. But it sounded like they were leaning towards no.

this was on bloodhorse:

Pletcher was asked about running her in the Kentucky Derby presented by Yum! Brands (gr. I).

“Well, when we first started out, the plan was the Las Virgenes, the Santa Anita Oaks, and the Kentucky Oaks (May 4), but when you get a filly that’s bred like this, that obviously, the further they go, the better she’s supposed to get, it makes you think about other possibilities.

"She’s had a pretty easy race today, so I’d say it opens up the possibility of maybe trying something in between this and the Kentucky Oaks. We’d have to decide what that is. It maybe opens up the option of running her against colts between now and the Oaks. That (next race) might make a decision on whether or not she actually runs in the Oaks.”

robfla · #28 03-11-2007, 08:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by randallscott35

Can Denman get a new race call?

"They'd have to sprout wings to catch her" ......is better than..."we have a new leader"..."is straight and strong in the Donn handicap" ( Vic Stauffer )

zippyneedsawin · #29 03-11-2007, 08:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by zippyneedsawin

this was on bloodhorse:

Pletcher was asked about running her in the Kentucky Derby presented by Yum! Brands (gr. I).

“Well, when we first started out, the plan was the Las Virgenes, the Santa Anita Oaks, and the Kentucky Oaks (May 4), but when you get a filly that’s bred like this, that obviously, the further they go, the better she’s supposed to get, it makes you think about other possibilities.

"She’s had a pretty easy race today, so I’d say it opens up the possibility of maybe trying something in between this and the Kentucky Oaks. We’d have to decide what that is. It maybe opens up the option of running her against colts between now and the Oaks. That (next race) might make a decision on whether or not she actually runs in the Oaks.”

and Tabor:

She’ll probably stick with the girls, but at the end of the day, you never know," said co-owner Tabor. "But she is nominated to the Triple Crown.”

I'm thinking since he already has Circular Quay, he will want to keep Rags to Riches pointed to the Oaks... unless there's a hiccup in the plan.

SniperSB23 · #30 03-11-2007, 08:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by zippyneedsawin

this was on bloodhorse:

Pletcher was asked about running her in the Kentucky Derby presented by Yum! Brands (gr. I).

“Well, when we first started out, the plan was the Las Virgenes, the Santa Anita Oaks, and the Kentucky Oaks (May 4), but when you get a filly that’s bred like this, that obviously, the further they go, the better she’s supposed to get, it makes you think about other possibilities.

"She’s had a pretty easy race today, so I’d say it opens up the possibility of maybe trying something in between this and the Kentucky Oaks. We’d have to decide what that is. It maybe opens up the option of running her against colts between now and the Oaks. That (next race) might make a decision on whether or not she actually runs in the Oaks.”

Where though? Illinois? They already have Ravel in the Santa Anita Derby and Circular Quay in the Wood.

zippyneedsawin · #31 03-11-2007, 08:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SniperSB23

Where though? Illinois? They already have Ravel in the Santa Anita Derby and Circular Quay in the Wood.

Good point. How does Pletcher keep this one from bumping heads with all his other 'derby trail' horses?.. especially Ravel and CQ.. and Scat Daddy... and Any Given Saturday... and OK.. that's enough.

SniperSB23 · #32 03-11-2007, 08:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by zippyneedsawin

Good point. How does Pletcher keep this one from bumping heads with all his other 'derby trail' horses?.. especially Ravel and CQ.. and Scat Daddy... and Any Given Saturday... and OK.. that's enough.

I don't think he can really do much to avoid those since if Tabor wants to race her he can't stop him from racing her against other horses he trains with different owners. In the case of Ravel and Circular Quay though it is the same owner so he would want to keep them separate.

zippyneedsawin · #33 03-11-2007, 08:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SniperSB23

I don't think he can really do much to avoid those since if Tabor wants to race her he can't stop him from racing her against other horses he trains with different owners. In the case of Ravel and Circular Quay though it is the same owner so he would want to keep them separate.

Right, I was just kidding around. The Illinois Derby does look like as good a place as any considering the timing of the race. If TP and Tabor want to keep her out west, they'll have no choice but to put her in the SA derby. Like you said, the Wood would mean racing against CQ. So, the next option is the next weekend in either the Blue Grass or Arkansas Derby.. I can't see them going in any race later than that.

The Bid · #34 03-11-2007, 09:04 PM

She looked like a good thing today.

SniperSB23 · #35 03-11-2007, 09:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by zippyneedsawin

Right, I was just kidding around. The Illinois Derby does look like as good a place as any considering the timing of the race. If TP and Tabor want to keep her out west, they'll have no choice but to put her in the SA derby. Like you said, the Wood would mean racing against CQ. So, the next option is the next weekend in either the Blue Grass or Arkansas Derby.. I can't see them going in any race later than that.

With the whole fresh horse theory I can't really see them running her on the 16th and having to wheel her back for the Derby in 3 weeks or the Oaks on a day less than that.

SniperSB23 · #36 03-11-2007, 09:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DaHoss9698

I think I read somewhere that they are leaning towards the Illinois Dercy with Deadly Dealer. I guess it's a good problem to have, so many TC contenders that it becomes hard to keep them separated so they don't run against each other.

Good for the sport or good for the trainer?

Grits · #37 03-11-2007, 09:31 PM

I'll still be floored, as someone indicated earlier, if he has 6 go in the gate Derby Day. Several weeks to go yet.

SniperSB23 · #38 03-11-2007, 09:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DaHoss9698

Trainer obviously.

Just making sure. Some would lead you to believe that Pletcher having every good horse is a good thing cause it will just cause other trainers to have to work as hard as he does.

randallscott35 · #39 03-11-2007, 10:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DaHoss9698

I'm sure many, many trainers work as hard. They are just not as fortunate enough to have some of the clients Pletcher has. That's not a knock on him as undoubtedly he is an outstanding trainer, and from everything I hear he works very hard. But, in no way is it a good thing for the sport that one guy dominates so much.

Agreed. The mega-trainer is a net negative.

Merlinsky · #40 03-11-2007, 10:55 PM

What would you say are ethical considerations for Todd in the event that he wins the race and possibly the Preakness but has other live horses for both the Preakness and Belmont? Especially if you were an owner with a horse you thought could beat his hypothetical dual classic winner and Todd is also his trainer. If I knew my horse could possibly beat the other with the right set up and something so important as the Triple Crown is on the line, what do I do? Should you really feel obligated to switch trainers when you've been with Todd the whole time and he knows your horse's weaknesses anyway?

I'm sure there are plenty of circumstances where a jockey's told to try hard but not bust a gut because they want the other one to win out. In Man o'War's time didn't they even have sort of a call if both horses owned by one person were in a position to win, the owner could semi-officially indicate who they wanted to come in first? This wouldn't be the same scenario if it were different owners, same trainer, but I just thought of that. I think I read it in Dorothy Ours' book.