8/7 (DMR): Clement L. Hirsch S. (G1) - Page 15

Rupert Pupkin · #**281** 08-09-2010, 03:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Danzig

they say they are going to the bc. but they also said they were going to travel with her this year, let her fans see her, and try new things. if they haven't done any of that, how can you be sure they will really point to the bc? you can't. they talk a big talk, but what has she done differently this year? then you see the comments from them about cali, about not shipping, about the win streak. i don't think i'm going out on a limb by suggesting they really don't intend to go to the bc. i think they want peppers prides record, and the money won record. i think the bc is further down on the list, especially with her having won one.
it remains to be seen; i hope she goes, don't get me wrong. but it wouldn't surprise me in the least if she doesn't go.

They were planning on travelling this year but the trip to Oaklawn knocked her out a little bit. They know they're going to ship again for the BC and possibly once right before it. That is why they have not shipped her since the Oaklawn race. They felt that would simply be too many trips for the horse.

Anyway, they were very disappointed that they didn't win HOY last year. That is one of the main reasons they brought her back this year, to win HOY. They know they have to win the BC Classic to win HOY. Therefore, there is no doubt that they will run there assuming nothing goes wrong between now and then.

Danzig · #**282** 08-09-2010, 08:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rupert Pupkin

They were planning on travelling this year but the trip to Oaklawn knocked her out a little bit. They know they're going to ship again for the BC and possibly once right before it. That is why they have not shipped her since the Oaklawn race. They felt that would simply be too many trips for the horse.

Anyway, they were very disappointed that they didn't win HOY last year. That is one of the main reasons they brought her back this year, to win HOY. They know they have to win the BC Classic to win HOY. Therefore, there is no doubt that they will run there assuming nothing goes wrong between now and then.

after reading shirreffs comments about shipping to ny, and not wanting to leave his string behind, i find their talk of wanting to travel with her just that-talk. they spoke the other day of wanting to support cali racing, and they're doing just that. fine with me. cali needs all the support it can get. we'll see about the bc when it happens. i hope she shows, but i won't be surprised if she doesn't. because right now, all they're doing about that is talking, just like the rest of it.

and be careful about saying 'there's no doubt in my mind'. i used that phrase and got clobbered for it by someone who took umbrage. hey, i hope you're right rupert. i hope she shows. but i'll believe it only when i see it. that's no slur on you at all.

Revidere · #**283** 08-09-2010, 12:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Indomitable DrugS

That absurd Euro that Team Valor owned winning the Goodwood and making a mockery of the older males out there - and than passing on the BC Classic - along with Gio Ponti going down to Interpartation made it an easier decision.

Thye were also hoping Quality Road would scratch earlier. They were really taking a chance there.

rlesquib · #**284** 08-09-2010, 01:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cakes44

2 career stakes wins for the entire field other than Zenyatta? Did I count that right? No wonder they "adjusted" her training schedule so they could fit this one in.

Do ur homework Cakes. Last time I checked, the races Zenyatta has competed in, they are open for any1. Says alot when no Graded Stakes winners or place horses are 2 scared to show.

MaTH716 · #**285** 08-09-2010, 01:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rlesquib

Do ur homework Cakes. Last time I checked, the races Zenyatta has competed in, they are open for any1. Says alot when no Graded Stakes winners or place horses are 2 scared to show.

Really??????????????? You mean colts and older horses were eligible too? Or are they ducking her as well.

Danzig · #**286** 08-09-2010, 01:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MaTH716

Really??????????????? u mean colts and older horses were eligible 2? Or are they ducking her 2.

ftfy

rlesquib · #**287** 08-09-2010, 02:02 PM

Whats the name of that horse that beat Rachel earlier this year and later smoked by Zenyatta ???

MaTH716 · #**288** 08-09-2010, 02:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rlesquib

Whats the name of that horse that beat Rachel earlier this year and later smoked by Zenyatta ???

What's that have to do with your incorrect statement about Zenyatta running in races with no conditions?

Crown@club · #**289** 08-09-2010, 03:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rlesquib

Whats the name of that horse that beat Rachel earlier this year and later smoked by Zenyatta ???

Did we forget that the same horse came back to get smoked by Rachel?

slotdirt · #**290** 08-09-2010, 03:58 PM

Find me the horses that Zenyatta beat by 19.25 lengths that have since come back to win GI races on dirt. I can think of at least two from Rachel's Mother Goose last summer.

NTamm1215 · #**291** 08-09-2010, 04:00 PM

You know, TVG had a trivia question the other night and the answer was a little surprising to me.

It was, how many different horses has Zenyatta beaten in her 17 wins (this was the night before the Hirsch)?

I didn't have the time nor inclination to sit down and add it up but figuring the Classic was 12 alone the number had to be somewhere around 125 or so.

The answer: 85

NT

Thunder Gulch · #**292** 08-09-2010, 04:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rupert Pupkin

They were planning on travelling this year but the trip to Oaklawn knocked her out a little bit. They know they're going to ship again for the BC and possibly once right before it. That is why they have not shipped her since the Oaklawn race. They felt that would simply be too many trips for the horse.

Anyway, they were very disappointed that they didn't win HOY last year. That is one of the main reasons they brought her back this year, to win HOY. They know they have to win the BC Classic to win HOY. Therefore, there is no doubt that they will run there assuming nothing goes wrong between now and then.

They were disappointed they didn't win HOY, bring her back specifically to win HOY, and take the same route even though the competition is weaker. Here's an idea, you know some horses have won the award based on a year's worth of great racing. Wonder if anyone ever thought of that?

cmorioles · #**293** 08-09-2010, 06:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Danzig

after reading shirreffs comments about shipping to ny, and not wanting to leave his string behind, i find their talk of wanting to travel with her just that-talk.

What string? He has 59 starts for the entire year.

2Hot4TV · #**294** 08-09-2010, 06:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NTamm1215

You know, TVG had a trivia question the other night and the answer was a little surprising to me.

It was, how many different horses has Zenyatta beaten in her 17 wins (this was the night before the Hirsch)?

I didn't have the time nor inclination to sit down and add it up but figuring the Classic was 12 alone the number had to be somewhere around 125 or so.

The answer: 85

NT

According to most she has only beaten one horse,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,SLOW.

2Hot4TV · #**295** 08-09-2010, 06:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rupert Pupkin

They were planning on travelling this year but the trip to Oaklawn knocked her out a little bit. They know they're going to ship again for the BC and possibly once right before it. That is why they have not shipped her since the Oaklawn race. They felt that would simply be too many trips for the horse.

Anyway, they were very disappointed that they didn't win HOY last year. That is one of the main reasons they brought her back this year, to win HOY. They know they have to win the BC Classic to win HOY. Therefore, there is no doubt that they will run there assuming nothing goes wrong between now and then.

I would agree with this from the change in her appearance.

If she manages to win the Classic this year she is HOY

the_fat_man · #**296** 08-09-2010, 06:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cmorioles

What string? He has 59 starts for the entire year.

Let me ask you some serious questions because all this Z bashing is beneath you:

what do you think her chances are of winning this year's Classic?

I mean, seriously, at some level you must clearly realize that this a a very nice horse. We're at the point where there are very few good 10F horses -- actually, we were always at this point. So much so, that some are even starting to believe that Musket Man is a race horse. I know you can't like RA in the Classic, so who does Z really have to beat in it? Anyone other than Blame?

It seems to me that her connections maybe understand some of this as well. They want to go into the biggest race of the year undefeated. You, and others, want her to campaign like Forego.

cmorioles · #**297** 08-09-2010, 06:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by the_fat_man

Let me ask you some serious questions because all this Z bashing is beneath you:

what do you think her chances are of winning this year's Classic?

What does any of this have to do with calling bullcrap on the Z camp comments? You telling me a guy with hardly any horses can't afford to travel with the greatest horse to ever step foot on the planet for a month?

We don't want her to campaign like Forego. Since when did 5 nothing races and the BC Classic become a good schedule?

the_fat_man · #**298** 08-09-2010, 06:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cmorioles

What does any of this have to do with calling bullcrap on the Z camp comments? You telling me a guy with hardly any horses can't afford to travel with the greatest horse to ever step foot on the planet for a month?

We don't want her to campaign like Forego. Since when did 5 nothing races and the BC Classic become a good schedule?

This is a DIFFERENT era. Things are done differently. Once upon a time there was a distinction between sprinters and routers. It actually took some skill to work a horse up to a route race. Yet, in Southern CAL, horses regularly stretch out, after even a single sprint, and come from off the pace to beat closing routers. I mean, I wouldn't be surprised if Sadler sent Twisted Candy to the ARC, without the benefit of another race, and had him win there.

I understand some of this is breeding but come on.

Then you have the case with Lake (and others) where his routers are able to outrun sprinters sprinting, on a regular basis. This with no workouts published. And so on.

And, your point of focus for the past year or so has been the way this horse has been campaigned? Was there ever a case where you could actually have made a score with this horse? (Other than last year's BC, possibly).

You think she can win the Classic?

cmorioles · #**299** 08-09-2010, 07:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by the_fat_man

This is a DIFFERENT era. Things are done differently. Once upon a time there was a distinction between sprinters and routers. It actually took some skill to work a horse up to a route race. Yet, in Southern CAL, horses regularly stretch out, after even a single sprint, and come from off the pace to beat closing routers. I mean, I wouldn't be surprised if Sadler sent Twisted Candy to the ARC, without the benefit of another race, and had him win there.

I understand some of this is breeding but come on.

Then you have the case with Lake (and others) where his routers are able to outrun sprinters sprinting, on a regular basis. This with no workouts published. And so on.

And, your point of focus for the past year or so has been the way this horse has been campaigned? Was there ever a case where you could actually have made a score with this horse? (Other than last year's BC, possibly).

You think she can win the Classic?

Why should I answer when you made no attempt whatsoever to address my question about the BS from the Z camp? I honestly don't even know where you are going with the rest of it.

Can she win the Classic? Sure, she could, but I don't think she will. I don't think she is near the same horse on dirt.

Thunder Gulch · #**300** 08-09-2010, 07:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cmorioles

Why should I answer when you made no attempt whatsoever to address my question about the BS from the Z camp? I honestly don't even know where you are going with the rest of it.

Can she win the Classic? Sure, she could, but I don't think she will. I don't think she is near the same horse on dirt.

Yes she can, but I don't think it really matters if she is as good on dirt as synthetic. This time she will face good dirt horses on dirt, not turf and dirt horses on Pro-Ride. The question will not be which surface she prefers, but is she really good enough to beat the best on a level playing field. That's point I beat my head against the wall trying to get some of you to understand. I'm of the opinion that she won't good enough to do so, but in one race scenario, I don't rule it out. If she faces the field that ran in the Whitney plus a few more, I'm betting against her doing anything more than sucking up for a minor share. Something like a 6-1 shot vs that group.