Another breakdown at Turfway

[philcski]

"Seashore washed by the suds and foam,
Been here so long he's got to calling it home."

[ArlJim78]

But what would be the answer to the answer man?

[SCUDSBROTHER]

Originally Posted by philcski

How can you say for certain that St Stephen can't run on dirt?? he's run TWICE on it (hitting the board once), and not since he was 2, and he's a full brother to a dirt champion. I think it's kind of ridiculous to say he can't run on dirt.

If you felt as good as these C. Clement horses,you could run on broken glass.

[philcski]

Originally Posted by SCUDSBROTHER

If you felt as good as these C. Clement horses,you could run on broken glass.

He's a damn good trainer. Always wins at 20%, and I can't think of a single time he's been implicated (or even been suspected) for any funny business.

[blackthroatedwind]

Originally Posted by philcski

He's a damn good trainer. Always wins at 20%, and I can't think of a single time he's been implicated (or even been suspected) for any funny business.

I'm confused, did this dude suggest Cristophe is a cheater?

That's funny. Sad....but funny. We got plenty of cheaters in NY but he isn't one of them.

[SCUDSBROTHER]

Hay, oats, and water....

[philcski]

Originally Posted by blackthroatedwind

I'm confused, did this dude suggest Cristophe is a cheater?

That's funny. Sad....but funny. We got plenty of cheaters in NY but he isn't one of them.

Hmmm... rereading it, it's somewhat ambiguous. Scudsbrother, care to qualify?

[todko]

Originally Posted by eurobounce

We need to get one thing straight...Marty Collins has never said that PolyTrack is "maintenance free." Keeneland and Marty Collins have all said the following; "Minimum maintenance is required compared to a conventional dirt track because the Polytrack surface needs less watering and less harrowing." No where in this statement does it state that PolyTrack is "maintenance free." You can get this quote from Marty Collins web site and here is the link: http://www.polytrack.com/advantages.html. Also, if you click on the below link you can view the PowerPoint presentation to the California Horsemen....http://www.polytrack.com/presentation/index.html. You should be not getting any other info from PloyTrack from anywhere else other than Keeneland or Marty Collins.

They also never said that tracks had to do serious renovations to the surface -- like scraping the top 3 inches (March 2006) and spending even more money revising the top layer with spandex and cable coverings like TP did this summer.

And "Marty" as you call him clearly lied when he said the surface was "low kickback".

If you get information from Keeneland and Martin "Marty" Collins you'll never get the complete truth. They are in the business to sell Poly pure and simple.

[todko]

Originally Posted by oracle80

yeah easier, and I wonder if anyone ever gets a nice Christmas present for steering a 12 million dollar contract someplace.
Not much money in dirt you know?
Thats my point Richi, How come for years noone at these tracks "cared about" the horse welfare and just didn't spend 1/4 the cost of the poly on a new safe dirt surface?
My suspicions stem from the fact that as soon as there was a whole lotta cash in it, people all of sudden cared so much.
How come keeneland never put in a new dirt surface for YEARS to replace the surface that was very criticized?
All of a sudden they cared? And it had nothing to do with money?
I'm willing to bet that a lotta folks get some nice stocking stuffers this year.

Very well said. Poly was originally sold as "saving $500,000 in yearly maintenance costs". Now it's sold as saving horses. The jury is still out on that.

It was also sold as having a 10 year lifespan. That may be true on gallops or training tracks but highly doubtful for a racetrack.

Turfway had an extremely mild winter in '05 and '06. They wouldn't have had to cancel days even if they kept the dirt surface -- yet they ignore that fact and say it was the poly that saved racing days. Total misinformation. They also ignore the fact that the weather (also FG being closed) helped handle.

We'll see this season how the poly reacts to tough weather. So far it doesn't look good.

[todko]

Originally Posted by eurobounce

I am only going to focus on #4. The maintenance costs have been reduced by 58% at Turfway.

And they didn't factor in the cost of scraping it in March and also re-doing the entire track over the summer. Supposedly Martin Collins LLC covered that cost. TP and Martin Collins LLC are affiliated companies -- through Keeneland.

[jpops757]

If you would research, everyone would know. The nigerians have a regestered toxic dump site for old used tires,condoms and tennis shoes{they actually get paid to accept these items]. They have set up a recycling process and selling it as ,poly,cushion orwhatever you want to call it and ripping the hated US.

[King Glorious]

When u just think of one fact, u realize it's all a sham. Turfway put it in to save racing dates and make more money. Period. It had NOTHING to do with safety for the horses. That they try to put it off as they were doing something in the interest of horse safety is what I really hate. This was all about business.

The kickback is nothing at Turfway. I will admit that it looks bad on TV. However, I was at Turfway on Sunday and the kickback is really nothing. In fact, it is less severe than dirt. Ask any jock, the kickback (which there is) is like snow hitting you and then falling off. It isnt like pelts of dirt hitting you. That is the difference in kickback.

[The Bid]

The kickback at Turfway is absolutely brutal.

Originally Posted by The Bid

The kickback at Turfway is absolutely brutal.

I didnt find it brutal at all. I certainly think it could be better. However, I didnt think it was all that bad and I was right at the rail.

[Cajungator26]

Originally Posted by eurobounce

I didnt find it brutal at all. I certainly think it could be better. However, I didnt think it was all that bad and I was right at the rail.

Were you riding?

[The Bid]

were you drinking?

Originally Posted by Cajungator26

Were you riding?

No, but the jocks we went to dinner with later that night said that the kickback isnt bad at all. They just said that is just falls off and you cant tell when it hits you. Now all of them say that it takes getting used to because horse and jock are used to getting pelted with the dirt. A few of the jocks say that it takes a few moments for the horse to realize that the kickback doesnt hurt.

[saucon17]

The kickback the last 3 days at Woodbine was unbelievable. The horse
that were winning were going wire to wire or coming on the far outside an avoiding it. But one are two won from the inside.

[The Bid]

Maybe the jocks you went to dinner with were on the lead. The kickback is an obvious problem at both tracks