Anyone See the Risen Star?

[NTamm1215]

With trips reversed Street Sense still wins by about five lengths in my opinion.

However, I am of the persuasion that the BC Juvenile was a once in a lifetime performance from Street Sense and he will always be trying to get back to that one race. Street Sense will be not altogether unlike Dreaming of Anna, both were horses coming into a great performance, enjoyed the best part of a biased track, and will be hard-pressed to repeat those efforts.

NT

[NTamm1215]

Originally Posted by DaHoss9698

Sure but 10 lengths? Come on CQ didn't exactly turn it on in the lane. He passed a bunch of tired horses and his suck up second at Keeneland was just that a suck up. Street Sense was better than him that day too.

Those were the same tired horses Street Sense was running away from. And what makes you think SS was better than him at Keeneland? SS made a clear lead at the top of the stretch then wilted.

NT

[NTamm1215]

Oh I agree that the BC proved who was better on that particular day, I just think there was little to no difference that day at Keeneland. I guess that's a pretty pointless argument though. In truth what bothers me I think is the sensationalizing of Street Sense's performance in the BC. I just feel so confident that he will never, ever run back to that race. That's just me though.

NT

[SniperSB23]

Originally Posted by NTamm1215

Oh I agree that the BC proved who was better on that particular day, I just think there was little to no difference that day at Keeneland. I guess that's a pretty pointless argument though. In truth what bothers me I think is the sensationalizing of Street Sense's performance in the BC. I just feel so confident that he will never, ever run back to that race. That's just me though.

NT

Street Sense ran a better race than CQ both days. I don't think there is much doubt of that if you watch both races.

[zippyneedsawin]

Originally Posted by DaHoss9698

Sure but 10 lengths? Come on CQ didn't exactly turn it on in the lane. He passed a bunch of tired horses and his suck up second at Keeneland was just that a suck up. Street Sense was better than him that day too.

Whoa, I never said CQ wins the BC with an inside trip, just that it would have been closer than 10 lengths.

[zippyneedsawin]

By the way, for anyone who didn't see the Risen Star, you can watch a replay of it on NTRA.com

[NTamm1215]

Originally Posted by DaHoss9698

He might not ever i mean really it was an amazing performance, it's a longshot he does. But I beg you to watch the Keeneland race and tell me who you think is better. I think the Keeneland race shows he moved way too early on a track that showed for nearly the entire meet that the best move was the last move. He just got nipped by CQ for second, with no apparent excuse for CQ and trounced him in the BC when both were moving together. Rail bias or not he trounced him.

On that particular day and throughout the early part of the meet, wide late moves were the best moves, but towards the end of the meet speed started to hold better.

In this race I think the fact that it was both SS and CQ's first two-turn trip they clearly had some learning to do. Borel did allow SS to charge all the way up a bit early while CQ took the overland route again. Again, I think this particular race is a toss-up while acknowledging that SS did move too early, but the BC was a definitive statement that SS is a better horse, he crushed the entire field. I'm ready for him to get out on the track so we can see if it holds up.

NT

[blackthroatedwind]

Originally Posted by zippyneedsawin

I disagree with that. CQ was 5? wide on the turn, SS skimmed the rail... a rail that many would say played favorably most of the day. To me, that's quite a few lengths difference.

I think you should watch the race again....I just watched it the other day a few times. Circular Quay and Street Sense moved as a team and the most Circular Quay was wide on the turn was three wide before he angled wide as they hit the stretch.

Once again, Street Sense had a better trip but it is much closer than many people seem to believe. The bottom line is they went very fast early and most of the field simply collapsed and two were left.....one ran well ( Street Sense ) and one sucked up past the dying rest.

[blackthroatedwind]

Originally Posted by DaHoss9698

He might not ever i mean really it was an amazing performance, it's a longshot he does. But I beg you to watch the Keeneland race and tell me who you think is better. I think the Keeneland race shows he moved way too early on a track that showed for nearly the entire meet that the best move was the last move. He just got nipped by CQ for second, with no apparent excuse for CQ and trounced him in the BC when both were moving together. Rail bias or not he trounced him.

Not only did he move WAY too soon ( at Keeneland ) but he also blew the first turn and lost substantial, and valuable, position....while Circular Quay was sitting comfortably inside.

It was absurd how much better Street Sense ran that day.

[hoovesupsideyourhead]

didnt cq eek out a win vs tuflsburg... or was that scat diddy..

[blackthroatedwind]

Originally Posted by hoovesupsideyourhead

didnt cq eek out a win vs tuflsburg... or was that scat diddy..

It was P Diddy.

[NTamm1215]

Originally Posted by blackthroatedwind

Not only did he move WAY too soon ( at Keeneland ) but he also blew the first turn and lost substantial, and valuable, position....while Circular Quay was sitting comfortably inside.

It was absurd how much better Street Sense ran that day.

I must be continuing to miss where Street Sense blew the first turn. He seems to lug out ever so slightly going into the first turn, then races three wide all the way around it. His move was very similar to what won 1 1/16 mile races at Keeneland all meet long. The shortened stretch was never great for closers, even towards the beginning of the meet.

Circular Quay raced inside much of the way, then came off the rail to avoid a quitting horse with about a 1/4 mile to go, then had to swing out and ran on nicely to run 2nd.

I just do not see AT ALL how you can say it's absurd how much better Street Sense ran that day. Without using the BC Juvenile to prove your point, I just don't agree that it was absurd how much better SS was than CQ that day. If you felt that way before November 4th then congratulations on what must have been a nice score for you in the Juvenile.

NT

[GPK]

Originally Posted by NTamm1215

I must be continuing to miss where Street Sense blew the first turn. He seems to lug out ever so slightly going into the first turn, then races three wide all the way around it. His move was very similar to what won 1 1/16 mile races at Keeneland all meet long. The shortened stretch was never great for closers, even towards the beginning of the meet.

Circular Quay raced inside much of the way, then came off the rail to avoid a quitting horse with about a 1/4 mile to go, then had to swing out and ran on nicely to run 2nd.

I just do not see AT ALL how you can say it's absurd how much better Street Sense ran that day. Without using the BC Juvenile to prove your point, I just don't agree that it was absurd how much better SS was than CQ that day. If you felt that way before November 4th then congratulations on what must have been a nice score for you in the Juvenile.
NT

NTamm....not to butt in here...but BTW was on record as choosing Street Sense as his horse of choice in the B Juvy.

[blackthroatedwind]

Originally Posted by NTamm1215

I just do not see AT ALL how you can say it's absurd how much better Street Sense ran that day. Without using the BC Juvenile to prove your point, I just don't agree that it was absurd how much better SS was than CQ that day. If you felt that way before November 4th then congratulations on what must have been a nice score for you in the Juvenile.

NT

Yeah, this is really silly. The trips were discussed here very shortly after the Keeneland race, which I think you need to watch again, and I picked Street Sense publically and bet him and made a bit of money.

Sadly, I didn't hit the exacta, as while I felt Street Sense was close to ten lengths better than Circular Quay, I incorrectly ( and unfortunately ) thought others were less bad.

[NTamm1215]

Originally Posted by T3B

NTamm....not to butt in here...but BTW was on record as choosing Street Sense as his horse of choice in the B Juvy.

I gathered as much, unfortunately I didn't join here until after the BC. I have no doubt about BTW's or anyone else's talent on this board when it comest to handicapping. This is a smart bunch.

NT

[GPK]

Originally Posted by NTamm1215

I gathered as much, unfortunately I didn't join here until after the BC. I have no doubt about BTW's or anyone else's talent on this board when it comest to handicapping. This is a smart bunch.

NT

didnt mean to come across as all knowing (Everyone on DT knows I aint), but just wasnt sure if you knew BTW's pick prior to the BC Juvy.

[GPK]

Originally Posted by DaHoss9698

Starting trouble again. I get it.

I could single handidly be the most aggresive, confrontational poster you know...

[GPK]

Originally Posted by DaHoss9698

True, true. So what's going on man? Counting the days till Saratoga?

something like that...just looking for a day off between now and then. Jonesing for an "all dayer" at the OTB....

[hoovesupsideyourhead]

Originally Posted by T3B

I could single handidly be the most aggresive, confrontational poster you know...

dont make me wrap a nine iron over your wig....damit c q is the best horse sence HELENS DREAM............OR ,MYSTICAL FASTNESS

[lemoncrush]

I'm not holding the race against CQ at all.
After getting completely jammed at the rail, stopping when the jockey flew off the horse like a ragdoll (still can't believe he rode and won the next race), veered all the way outside and finished full of run tells me that he's more than just a closing sprinter. I'm not ready to proclaim him the Derby winner, but I'm not ready to toss him, either.
I was just peeved because I had CQ keyed with the 8-10-12, but didn't bet it without him involved. That was an extremely nice trifecta payout all things considered.
Anyone know where they're going to point CQ to next?