Franchise Delay Hangs Over Trainers

[blackthroatedwind]

Originally Posted by Payson Dave

Andrew, I very much hope that you are correct....are you basing your statement on any solid info/news??

No. I prefer to use common sense.

OK, I do know one thing, I heard John DaSilva say on Byk's show that a shutdown was a certainty.

Let me retract.....I only used common sense.

[Payson Dave]

politics and common sense???.....hmmm I'd be more than a little concerned

[blackthroatedwind]

Originally Posted by Linny

I'm glad you are so confident, but some of the trainers I know are less so. I hope you are right.

And I am sorry for their concerns. I hope during this franchise process they were also doing all they could to help this situation reach a fair conclusion.

Yeah, I know, that's not completely fair. But considering the behavoir of some horsemen during the past couple of years, as regards this mess, it is hard for me to shed a lot of tears for everyone.

[fpsoxfan]

Is it possible that NYRA will say NO to an extension of say a year or two?
Or would they be cutting their own throats?

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by sumitas

It's the NYRA's land, why shouldn't they get the racing franchise ? And what has taken Bruno 6 years to get the vlt into Aqueduct ? This guy has some explaining to do.

http://www.swpc.noaa.gov/

[pmacdaddy]

If NYRA postures as strongly as you suggest, not even considering a temporary extension (which I don't disagree is the stance they should take). I don't think you can rule out a shut down.

It has taken all this time and Albany is still dicking around with VLT. Does not inspire a lot of confidence as to the prospect of a final resolution in the next 30 days (which includes Christmas).

[Cannon Shell]

I hope Andy is correct but I get the feeling that Bruno desires a shutdown in an attempt to make the Gov look bad and possibly force his hand to compromise, most likely in the favor of Bruno's proposal or watered down version. If this whole exercise does not make you believe in term limits, I dont know what would.

[MisterB]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

I hope Andy is correct but I get the feeling that Bruno desires a shutdown in an attempt to make the Gov look bad and possibly force his hand to compromise, most likely in the favor of Bruno's proposal or watered down version. If this whole exercise does not make you believe in term limits, I dont know what would.

Isn't Hayward the one talking tough here, all or nothing??

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by MisterB

Isn't Hayward the one talking tough here, all or nothing??

Hayward may be talking tough but he really doesn't have much choice in shutting down. The pols have been very quiet which may be a good sign.

[blackthroatedwind]

Originally Posted by pmacdaddy

If NYRA postures as strongly as you suggest, not even considering a temporary extension (which I don't disagree is the stance they should take). I don't think you can rule out a shut down.

It has taken all this time and Albany is still dicking around with VLT. Does not inspire a lot of confidence as to the prospect of a final resolution in the next 30 days (which includes Christmas).

I don't rule out a shutdown, and believe that if NYRA isn't given the extension that they were awarded they should stand their ground, but I just don't believe it will happen. Call me naive, but I believe that NYRA is completely in the right, and Bruno is acting against the best interests of the involved parties, and ultimately this will be resolved in the proper manner.

[parsixfarms]

I spoke to our trainer this morning, and he said that there are a lot of vans heading out of town - and those horsemen still in NY are very much concerned about the possibility of a shutdown, particularly when nothing is being said to them about what is going on. As a result, horsemen (not the Bomze/Finley-types with whom I agree with the comment that their self-serving conduct through this process was deplorable) have had to make contingency plans in case there is a shutdown - and they have already been forced to pay for it (in the forms of deposits for stalls elsewhere, etc.), whether or not there is a shutdown or not.

I heard Joe Bruno on a local Capital District radio interview yesterday morning, and he was asked about the franchise issue. He said that his people have been talking to Spitzer's, and that he hoped to have the legislature back in town to deal with the franchise issue in about two weeks. I don't have any inside information on this, but my gut sense from what I've read before and from what Bruno intimated in the interview is that the sticking point on this may be Shelly Silver's opposition to having slots at Belmont (Nassau County), which would effectively break up NYC's monopoly on the slots if they were only at Aqueduct. If there were slots at two places, more political pals can get cut in on the $$, which we all know this is what it is really about, and the endangered LI Republicans can say that they did something for their constituents (hoping that will help Bruno in his effort to hold onto his razor-slim Senate majority in the 2008 elections). I'm hoping that this is all it's about, and that Bruno's ridiculous idea of a state racing authority with the possibility of a split racing franchise, especially when there are not any qualified alternatives to NYRA, is just a smokescreen. Time will obviously tell.

[blackthroatedwind]

Great and insightful post. I think you are dead on about the slots at Belmont debate especially since Excelsior has clearly said that without that they are not interested in any involvement.

One thing, though, and believe me I say this with no malice. I feel for the hardships of the trainers you described, however, when the horsemen's group backed Empire they spoke for the horsemen. Now, I understand that some ( perhaps even many ) did not feel they were speaking for them. However, why did they not speak out publicly then? If they had really looked carefully at Empire they certainly would have known that was the wrong horse to back.

[Fearless Leader]

Let me assure you that they were not speaking for the majority of the horsemen, in fact, the vast majority were never even consulted, or informed as to any of that nonsense. The majority in fact knew it was, for lack of a better description, stupid, yet the horseman's group in New York is so fractured, weak, and ineffective that no one knows what goes on. They couldn't even band together to stop the ludicrous detention barn situation so any intelligent,meaningful involvement in this matter is well beyond their grasp. Sad, but true.

[parsixfarms]

Originally Posted by blackthroatedwind

One thing, though, and believe me I say this with no malice. I feel for the hardships of the trainers you described, however, when the horsemen's group backed Empire they spoke for the horsemen. Now, I understand that some ( perhaps even many ) did not feel they were speaking for them. However, why did they not speak out publicly then? If they had really looked carefully at Empire they certainly would have known that was the wrong horse to back.

I think Fearless Leader is dead on with the statement that the majority of the horsemen never supported Empire - and that the horsemen were never advised that an endorsement of a franchise bidder was even being considered, let alone that it would be the obviously-flawed Empire. That was a backroom NYTHA Board decision in which several of the Board members who had personal stakes in Empire (Bomze, Finley and others) used their positions on the NYTHA Board for their own personal benefit, despite the conflicts of interest attendant to any vote to endorse one bidder over another.

As for the question as to why the majority of horsemen who have long supported NYRA didn't speak publicly out against Empire, I guess it depends on one's perspective. Some might call it cowardice. Others might simply view it as economic realism. Let's not forget that, in the summer of 2006, despite its now-revealed flaws, many viewed Empire as the strong favorite to win the Ad Hoc Committee recommendation - and the franchise itself. To publicly speak out against that organization at that time would not be done without some potential peril to one's position in racing.

[blackthroatedwind]

We will have to agree to disagree that there was ever a time that Empire was even in the starting gate. Honestly, anyone that took five minutes to read up on them knew all of the things you said to be true from the very beginning and never gave even a serious moment's thought to a group headed by Richard Bomze getting anywhere close to the franchise. That's even crazier than thinking an idiot could become President of the United States!

Fearless Leader, and you, are obviously right. However, sadly sometimes people learn the hard way the importance of speaking up for themselves and doing what is right even under perceived difficult circumstances. I imagine with the benefit of hindsight more than a few people would have acted differently.

[Hickory Hill Hoff]

Originally Posted by blackthroatedwind

We will have to agree to disagree that there was ever a time that Empire was even in the starting gate. Honestly, anyone that took five minutes to read up on them knew all of the things you said to be true from the very beginning and never gave even a serious moment's thought to a group headed by Richard Bomze getting anywhere close to the franchise. That's even crazier than thinking an idiot could become President of the United States!

Fearless Leader, and you, are obviously right. However, sadly sometimes people learn the hard way the importance of speaking up for themselves and doing what is right even under perceived difficult circumstances. I imagine with the benefit of hindsight more than a few people would have acted differently.

Very well put.....I agree totally with that statement. Showing backbone and voicing your opinion even when the "powers to be" think they have your best interest and they're dead wrong, shows a lot of guts and demands respect.

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by Hickory Hill Hoff

Very well put.....I agree totally with that statement. Showing backbone and voicing your opinion even when the "powers to be" think they have your best interest and they're dead wrong, shows a lot of guts and demands respect.

Except it goes against the entire culture of horseracing. This business absolutely cuts down people who stand against the group thinking unless they have a lot of money which makes everything they do ok. The majority of trainers in NY rely on the track to provide them a place of business and have to remain fairly neutral to all positions in regard to who was going to be in charge in the future. Though many of us felt Empire was never going to get the franchise, there was a time where they had a pretty strong group and a lot of momentum. If I was a NY trainer I may have been a little spooked to make strong public statements especially if I did not have any powerful owners to back me up.

[Linny]

Agreed Cannon. The problem was that the "administration" of the NYTHA backed and in fact became a part of Empire, but the rank and file generally did not. You are right in that the trainers just want a safe, decent environment in which they may make a living. They want what horsemen want, good purses, good maintainence and to be able to fill a good condition book. There were many less powerful trainers with no huge owners who had opinions but dared not give them voice. Who could blame them. If they came out as anti-NYRA, they could be treated pretty badly now and in the future if NYRA gets renewed.

[blackthroatedwind]

Originally Posted by Linny

Agreed Cannon. The problem was that the "administration" of the NYTHA backed and in fact became a part of Empire, but the rank and file generally did not. You are right in that the trainers just want a safe, decent environment in which they may make a living. They want what horsemen want, good purses, good maintainence and to be able to fill a good condition book. There were many less powerful trainers with no huge owners who had opinions but dared not give them voice. Who could blame them. If they came out as anti-NYRA, they could be treated pretty badly now and in the future if NYRA gets renewed.

But they did come out anti-NYRA.

Their decision was to accept that or speak their minds going on two years ago. They accepted the anti-NYRA stance and are now in a precarious position, not because NYRA is treating them badly, but because they backed an organization that screwed them....an organization that anyone who objectively looked at the situation knew was a dead horse.

They handicapped the race badly.

[whodey17]

It would be a sad day to see operations cease in New York. There is plenty of blame to go around. I doubt we see an interruption. However, I would like to see a business model that actually works from any group.