Uncle Mo gets treatment at Winstar

[Riot]

Originally Posted by RolloTomasi

While it's a ridiculously huge leap to say that Uncle Mo has the exact same disease, from the outside looking in, he has similar (albeit vague) signs she exhibited last fall, was initially diagnosed as having a GI insult like her, and also has tests revealing a dreaded "elevated enzyme". So you can certainly see where these morbid, cynical predictions come from.

Yeah, but there's multiple things that can cause those same signs, some serious, some not. For example, in humans, diarrhea could be caused by: Buffalo wing overdose. Or lymphosarcoma. Or ....

[freddymo]

Originally Posted by Mawhip

My point of all this is that you can't believe a word of what Pletcher and Repole are saying. Whether they don't know or Pletcher is covering up a condition that he doesn't want anybody to know about, I'm not sure. But with his track record, I'm not giving him the benefit of any doubt.

Who's bad record the Hall of Fame bound trainer, or the owner who started claiming learned the game from the ground up albeit with a new Bankroll and has one a BC race in like his 5 years owning horses?

Who cares if they arent being truthful?

[RolloTomasi]

Originally Posted by freddymo

I am trying to figure out why 1 horse that died from cancer is such a smoking gun in your mind?

You're jumping to conclusions. I only said that, put alongside the Devil May Care episode, the mystery Uncle Mo illness is starting off in a similar fashion. Hence, for some, all the questioning of the "fullness" of the connections' reports on the horse.

I was under the impression that Pletcher has a rep for treating all the horses the same using basically the same tonics and elixirers on all.

I'm only going off DRF and Blood-Horse reports, so if you have some juicy inside info to dish, I guess your posts on the matter are much more informed then mine.

So wouldnt there be more horses getting this cancer then just one?

No. Does everyone exposed to asbestos get mesothelioma?

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by Mawhip

My point of all this is that you can't believe a word of what Pletcher and Repole are saying. Whether they don't know or Pletcher is covering up a condition that he doesn't want anybody to know about, I'm not sure. But with his track record, I'm not giving him the benefit of any doubt.

What possible condition could he be covering up? Why would anyone care if one particular ailment was bothering the horse versus another? As I have tried to express many times, this is not an exact science. Look at Rags to Riches. Her exercise rider kept saying that she didnt feel right. Pletcher sent her off to the best clinics in the world for complete examination's which didn't come up with much. Then a few weeks later she comes up with a broken pastern. The best hospitals and doctors in the world knew something was wrong with an ultra valuable mare and still couldnt find it. Maybe if the equine version of House was available?

[freddymo]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

What possible condition could he be covering up? Why would anyone care if one particular ailment was bothering the horse versus another? As I have tried to express many times, this is not an exact science. Look at Rags to Riches. Her exercise rider kept saying that she didnt feel right. Pletcher sent her off to the best clinics in the world for complete examination's which didn't come up with much. Then a few weeks later she comes up with a broken pastern. The best hospitals and doctors in the world knew something was wrong with an ultra valuable mare and still couldnt find it. Maybe if the equine version of House was available?

I think wht MaWhip is attemting to say is where there is smoke there is fire and Pletcher seems FOS covering up something that is up.. My point is who cares, the horse is finished and if they want to ease into the he has done enough speach whatever..

As for Rags to Riches shirley you arent suggesting that the vets missed a busted pastern?

[lemoncrush]

Who is more likely to race again?

Uncle Mo or boys at Toscanova?

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by freddymo

I think wht MaWhip is attemting to say is where there is smoke there is fire and Pletcher seems FOS covering up something that is up.. My point is who cares, the horse is finished and if they want to ease into the he has done enough speach whatever..

As for Rags to Riches shirley you arent suggesting that the vets missed a busted pastern?

They absolutely missed it

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by lemoncrush

Who is more likely to race again?

Uncle Mo or boys at Toscanova?

Good prop bet. I'd say Boys at Tos is more likely to run because he is worth about .50 cents as a stallion.

[Riot]

Originally Posted by freddymo

As for Rags to Riches shirley you arent suggesting that the vets missed a busted pastern?

No, a busted pastern is impossible to miss. They were looking hard for some instability or defect, yet couldn't find one. Yet that instability was real, it lead to the busted pastern. The top lameness gurus are sharp. They can see amazing things via imaging (ultrasound, MRI, even ordinary rads) but they can't always see everything, even if they are looking for it.

Uncle Mo wasn't doing well. The routine tests were done. They showed some mild non-specific abnormalities. So the specific tests were done. Nothing worse was shown. The mild abnormality was treated. Treatment done. Problem still there. Time to look again. This isn't rocket science, it's just medicine.

Speaking of lameness gurus - or surgeons who deserve the title - on a good note, look at Battle of Hastings (who was injured near the finish). This wasn't treatable 30 years ago like it is today. http://www.bloodhorse.com/horse-raci...-after-surgery

But here's Archarcharch, who had essentially the same basic injury as BOH, but was injured at the start, and ran the entire Derby on a fracture. So he ended up with more problems, and is retired. Both horses had same competent vet. http://www.bloodhorse.com/horse-raci...red-owner-says

[freddymo]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

They absolutely missed it

They missed a completely busted pastern? Gotcha

[NTamm1215]

Originally Posted by Riot

Speaking of lameness gurus

Don't ever talk about Freddy that way.

[RolloTomasi]

Originally Posted by NTamm1215

Don't ever talk about Freddy that way.

Freddy is the King of Lame.

[freddymo]

Originally Posted by RolloTomasi

Freddy is the King of Lame.

Lame? I am always properly medicated

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by freddymo

They missed a completely busted pastern? Gotcha

Let me explain this to you one more time.

Rider says horse is not right
Horse sent to clinic
Horse given clean bill of health
Horse returns to training
Rider says horse still doesn't feel right
Horse sent to different clinic
Clinic can't find anything
Horse sent back into training
Horse runs sub par race
Horse exits race with broken pastern

You don't have to know anything about anything to see what happened here.

I had a filly with a decent pedigree at Tampa a few years back that wasn't training up to par. No heat, no swelling. Xrays and ultrasound showed nothing. Sent her to the clinic in Ocala for a nuclear scan and zero x rays. They pretty much came up with nothing. Gave her a little time (the supposed magic trick). Brought her back toward the end of the meet to run her one more time to see if we could break her maiden and send her to the shed. She ran her typical race and got beat a nose. Came out of the race with a fractured fetlock.

Do you think that injury was random or wasn't what was bothering her initially?

There is a tremendous amount of guess work done with horses in training even with million dollar horses.

[freddymo]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

Let me explain this to you one more time.

Rider says horse is not right
Horse sent to clinic
Horse given clean bill of health
Horse returns to training
Rider says horse still doesn't feel right
Horse sent to different clinic
Clinic can't find anything
Horse sent back into training
Horse runs sub par race
Horse exits race with broken pastern

You don't have to know anything about anything to see what happened here.

I had a filly with a decent pedigree at Tampa a few years back that wasn't training up to par. No heat, no swelling. Xrays and ultrasound showed nothing. Sent her to the clinic in Ocala for a nuclear scan and zero x rays. They pretty much came up with nothing. Gave her a little time (the supposed magic trick). Brought her back toward the end of the meet to run her one more time to see if we could break her maiden and send her to the shed. She ran her typical race and got beat a nose. Came out of the race with a fractured fetlock.

Do you think that injury was random or wasn't what was bothering her initially?

There is a tremendous amount of guess work done with horses in training even with million dollar horses.

Why couldnt it have been a completely random event, being that she was vetted so agressively it is more explainable that it was a random event.
Next time instead of wasting all that money on tests that tell you nothing ship the horse to juan carlos he will hook you right up!

[freddymo]

BTW did you rea Dr Riots post above..A busted pastern is IMPOSSIBLE to MISS

[Antitrust32]

Originally Posted by freddymo

BTW did you rea Dr Riots post above..A busted pastern is IMPOSSIBLE to MISS

If you are going to cherry pick that line, you should read her next few sentences where she basically agree's with Chuck.

[outofthebox]

Originally Posted by freddymo

Why couldnt it have been a completely random event, being that she was vetted so agressively it is more explainable that it was a random event.
Next time instead of wasting all that money on tests that tell you nothing ship the horse to juan carlos he will hook you right up!

On one knee and a freshly shaved face, Juan would have diagnosed the probem in minutes..and have a painfree solution to race too..

[freddymo]

Originally Posted by Antitrust32

If you are going to cherry pick that line, you should read her next few sentences where she basically agree's with Chuck.

It is an absolute statement and speaks to fact that Rags did not have a busted pastern as Chuck seems to believe.. BECAUSE ITS AN IMPOSSIBLE THING TO MISS..

[Riot]

Originally Posted by freddymo

It is an absolute statement and speaks to fact that Rags did not have a busted pastern as Chuck seems to believe.. BECAUSE ITS AN IMPOSSIBLE THING TO MISS..

Geeshus ... Chuck's point is absolutely right, they missed whatever she had. I doubt it was a fracture line, because, yep, that's pretty impossible to miss, but as Chuck said, she obviously had something going on, which was completely missed, and resulted in a fractured pastern during the race.