8/7 (DMR): Clement L. Hirsch S. (G1)

[Danzig]

Originally Posted by Rupert Pupkin

They were planning on travelling this year but the trip to Oaklawn knocked her out a little bit. They know they're going to ship again for the BC and possibly once right before it. That is why they have not shipped her since the Oaklawn race. They felt that would simply be too many trips for the horse.

Anyway, they were very disappointed that they didn't win HOY last year. That is one of the main reasons they brought her back this year, to win HOY. They know they have to win the BC Classic to win HOY. Therefore, there is no doubt that they will run there assuming nothing goes wrong between now and then.

after reading shirreffs comments about shipping to ny, and not wanting to leave his string behind, i find their talk of wanting to travel with her just that-talk. they spoke the other day of wanting to support cali racing, and they're doing just that. fine with me. cali needs all the support it can get. we'll see about the bc when it happens. i hope she shows, but i won't be surprised if she doesn't. because right now, all they're doing about that is talking, just like the rest of it.

and be careful about saying 'there's no doubt in my mind'. i used that phrase and got clobbered for it by someone who took umbrage. hey, i hope you're right rupert. i hope she shows. but i'll believe it only when i see it. that's no slur on you at all.

[cmorioles]

Originally Posted by Danzig

after reading shirreffs comments about shipping to ny, and not wanting to leave his string behind, i find their talk of wanting to travel with her just that-talk.

What string? He has 59 starts for the entire year.

[the_fat_man]

Originally Posted by cmorioles

What string? He has 59 starts for the entire year.

Let me ask you some serious questions because all this Z bashing is beneath you:

what do you think her chances are of winning this year's Classic?


I mean, seriously, at some level you must clearly realize that this a a very nice horse. We're at the point where there are very few good 10F horses -- actually, we were always at this point. So much so, that some are even starting to believe that Musket Man is a race horse. I know you can't like RA in the Classic, so who does Z really have to beat in it? Anyone other than Blame?

It seems to me that her connections maybe understand some of this as well. They want to go into the biggest race of the year undefeated. You, and others, want her to campaign like Forego.

[cmorioles]

Originally Posted by the_fat_man

Let me ask you some serious questions because all this Z bashing is beneath you:

what do you think her chances are of winning this year's Classic?

What does any of this have to do with calling bullcrap on the Z camp comments? You telling me a guy with hardly any horses can't afford to travel with the greatest horse to ever step foot on the planet for a month?

We don't want her to campaign like Forego. Since when did 5 nothing races and the BC Classic become a good schedule?

[the_fat_man]

Originally Posted by cmorioles

What does any of this have to do with calling bullcrap on the Z camp comments? You telling me a guy with hardly any horses can't afford to travel with the greatest horse to ever step foot on the planet for a month?

We don't want her to campaign like Forego. Since when did 5 nothing races and the BC Classic become a good schedule?

This is a DIFFERENT era. Things are done differently. Once upon a time there was a distinction between sprinters and routers. It actually took some skill to work a horse up to a route race. Yet, in Southern CAL, horses regularly stretch out, after even a single sprint, and come from off the pace to beat closing routers. I mean, I wouldn't be surprised if Sadler sent Twisted Candy to the ARC, without the benefit of another race, and had him win there. I understand some of this is breeding but come on.

Then you have the case with Lake (and others) where his routers are able to outrun sprinters sprinting, on a regular basis. This with no workouts published. And so on.

And, your point of focus for the past year or so has been the way this horse has been campaigned? Was there ever a case where you could actually have made a score with this horse? (Other than last year's BC, possibly).

You think she can win the Classic?

[cmorioles]

Originally Posted by the_fat_man

This is a DIFFERENT era. Things are done differently. Once upon a time there was a distinction between sprinters and routers. It actually took some skill to work a horse up to a route race. Yet, in Southern CAL, horses regularly stretch out, after even a single sprint, and come from off the pace to beat closing routers. I mean, I wouldn't be surprised if Sadler sent Twisted Candy to the ARC, without the benefit of another race, and had him win there. I understand some of this is breeding but come on.

Then you have the case with Lake (and others) where his routers are able to outrun sprinters sprinting, on a regular basis. This with no workouts published. And so on.

And, your point of focus for the past year or so has been the way this horse has been campaigned? Was there ever a case where you could actually have made a score with this horse? (Other than last year's BC, possibly).

You think she can win the Classic?

Why should I answer when you made no attempt whatsoever to address my question about the BS from the Z camp? I honestly don't even know where you are going with the rest of it.

Can she win the Classic? Sure, she could, but I don't think she will. I don't think she is near the same horse on dirt.

[Thunder Gulch]

Originally Posted by cmorioles

Why should I answer when you made no attempt whatsoever to address my question about the BS from the Z camp? I honestly don't even know where you are going with the rest of it.

Can she win the Classic? Sure, she could, but I don't think she will. I don't think she is near the same horse on dirt.

Yes she can, but I don't think it really matters if she is as good on dirt as synthetic. This time she will face good dirt horses on dirt, not turf and dirt horses on Pro-Ride. The question will not be which surface she prefers, but is she really good enough to beat the best on a level playing field. That's point I beat my head against the wall trying to get some of you to understand. I'm of the opinion that she won't good enough to do so, but in one race scenario, I don't rule it out. If she faces the field that ran in the Whitney plus a few more, I'm betting against her doing anything more than sucking up for a minor share. Something like a 6-1 shot vs that group.

[the_fat_man]

Originally Posted by cmorioles

Why should I answer when you made no attempt whatsoever to address my question about the BS from the Z camp? I honestly don't even know where you are going with the rest of it.

Can she win the Classic? Sure, she could, but I don't think she will. I don't think she is near the same horse on dirt.

How can I address your question when I don't own the horse? Tell you this much, if I agreed to go to OP on the condition that RA would be there, and she punked out after my 2nd stringer beat her, I certainly wouldn't be open to ACCOMMODATING her with a rematch -- especially one that entailed shipping cross country for. As for the taking on the males thing: what exactly does she gain by beating that sad bunch out there? Would they give her HOTY if she won a G1 for males?

If you don't think she can win the Classic, then bet against her, make a score, and have something to write about.

I don't get the obsession with this horse.

[Danzig]

Originally Posted by cmorioles

What string? He has 59 starts for the entire year.

good question, but shirreffs is the one you need to ask. he's the one who doesn't want to leave his other horses behind. i have no idea how many that might be.