I need to listen to ATR more often

[Rupert Pupkin]

Originally Posted by NTamm1215

Did you even read my prior post where I said her not challenging him is ridiculous?

Seriously, if you are a Zenyatta fan right now and you think that facing females in CA is a serious challenge then how is it even possible she could win the Classic? And that's the race they're shooting for!

NT

Yes, I read your post. As I said before, I totally disagree with you. If I owned Zenyatta, I would not be wanting to face Rail Trip at Hollywood in a 4 horse field with no pace.

With regard to your other comment, facing females in California is usually not a serious challenge for her although it has been a couple of times.

She won the Classic last year. She appears to be just as good on the dirt as on synthetic. She looks to be as good this year as last year. Why wouldn't she be one of the horses to beat in the Classic again this year?

[Indian Charlie]

Originally Posted by Rupert Pupkin

She won the Classic last year. She appears to be just as good on the dirt as on synthetic. She looks to be as good this year as last year. Why wouldn't she be one of the horses to beat in the Classic again this year?

Because she will be facing better quality dirt horses on dirt, instead of pretty poor quality turf and dirt horses on synthetic.

And don't say anything dumb like Gio Ponti is a great horse.

[Rupert Pupkin]

Originally Posted by Indian Charlie

Because she will be facing better quality dirt horses on dirt, instead of pretty poor quality turf and dirt horses on synthetic.

And don't say anything dumb like Gio Ponti is a great horse.

I agree with you. It appears that the race will be mouch tougher this year.

I don't think Zenyatta will have a problem with dirt. I think she's just as good on the dirt. I don't think the dirt will be the issue. The tougher competition will be the issue.

[Smooth Operator]

Originally Posted by Rupert Pupkin

I don't think Zenyatta will have a problem with dirt. I think she's just as good on the dirt. I don't think the dirt will be the issue. The tougher competition will be the issue.

Her advancing age will be the biggest issue, in my estimation

Not even a 6yo male has been able to take the BCC

Heard she loved the CD strip the short time she was there last year … and she's clearly a legit 10f runner … so if she can catch a dry track, she's got a shot … but I'd feel a hell of a lot better if she was a year younger.

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by Smooth Operator

Her advancing age will be the biggest issue, in my estimation

Not even a 6yo male has been able to take the BCC

Heard she loved the CD strip the short time she was there last year … and she's clearly a legit 10f runner … so if she can catch a dry track, she's got a shot … but I'd feel a hell of a lot better if she was a year younger.

There are two excuses already...

[CSC]

Originally Posted by Indian Charlie

Because she will be facing better quality dirt horses on dirt, instead of pretty poor quality turf and dirt horses on synthetic.

And don't say anything dumb like Gio Ponti is a great horse.

Supposing she beats all of dirt racing's best, Blame, Quality Road, Rachel A, and even some poly and turf horses in the BCC, what then? Does she have to go to Japan to prove she is the world's best horse? I'm just trying to wrap my head around it if it happens, how will this forum react.

Cue the Jeopardy music....

[hockey2315]

Originally Posted by CSC

Supposing she beats all of dirt racing's best, Blame, Quality Road, Rachel A, and even some poly and turf horses in the BCC, what then? Does she have to go to Japan to prove she is the world's best horse? I'm just trying to wrap my head around it if it happens, how will this forum react.

Cue the Jeopardy music....

If she beats a quality dirt field in the Breeders' Cup (which she won't) then she will finally deserve all the accolades her camp has already bestowed on her.

[CSC]

Originally Posted by hockey2315

If she beats a quality dirt field in the Breeders' Cup (which she won't) then she will finally deserve all the accolades her camp has already bestowed on her.

Obviously I admire Zenyatta and even I can't be certain she is a certainty to fare well in the BCC, to run 20 straight races and win them all for a deep closer is unheard of if she indeed gets to that point undefeated, but even with that knowledge I would never say she can't or won't do it. I have seen enough of her to know she can more than likely do it. If not she has certainly used up enough luck to last several lifetimes if one thinks she has been the luckiest, best placed horse the game has ever seen. That seems more proposterous to me than the former.

[CSC]

Originally Posted by CSC

Supposing she beats all of dirt racing's best, Blame, Quality Road, Rachel A, and even some poly and turf horses in the BCC, what then? Does she have to go to Japan to prove she is the world's best horse? I'm just trying to wrap my head around it if it happens, how will this forum react.

Cue the Jeopardy music....

I can't wait all night so let me help you, there will be alot of scratching of heads, perhaps some armpits, and definitely some ball scratching...

[Indian Charlie]

Originally Posted by CSC

Supposing she beats all of dirt racing's best, Blame, Quality Road, Rachel A, and even some poly and turf horses in the BCC, what then? Does she have to go to Japan to prove she is the world's best horse? I'm just trying to wrap my head around it if it happens, how will this forum react.

Cue the Jeopardy music....

I think, honestly, you are mistaking disdain for the connections as disdain for the horse.

[miraja2]

Okay Zenyatta fans....you win.

I have been trying my hardest to still like and cheer for this horse despite your insanity, but I give up. If I am honest with myself I have to admit that I hope the mare loses every race she runs in for the rest of her career just so you people will shut the hell up.

Thanks a lot for ruining a pretty cool horse for me.

[CSC]

Originally Posted by miraja2

Okay Zenyatta fans....you win.

I have been trying my hardest to still like and cheer for this horse despite your insanity, but I give up. If I am honest with myself I have to admit that I hope the mare loses every race she runs in for the rest of her career just so you people will shut the hell up.

Thanks a lot for ruining a pretty cool horse for me.

You know I understand this feeling, if Rachel had won her 3 races this year, I would probably feel the exact same way you feel right now. I can only imagine what her fans would be saying, and some writer perhaps Haskin would probably write best racemare of alltime. But if Rachel only ran in gr.2's for the rest of the year and won the BCC, I do believe I would have to finally give her, her props. Yes I may finally understand this nonsense.

[Arletta]

I just wish I had the will power to stop clicking on the this thread

[kgar311]

Originally Posted by miraja2

Okay Zenyatta fans....you win.

I have been trying my hardest to still like and cheer for this horse despite your insanity, but I give up. If I am honest with myself I have to admit that I hope the mare loses every race she runs in for the rest of her career just so you people will shut the hell up.

Thanks a lot for ruining a pretty cool horse for me.

I was a fan at one time myself

[Smooth Operator]

Originally Posted by miraja2

Okay Zenyatta fans....you win.

I have been trying my hardest to still like and cheer for this horse despite your insanity, but I give up. If I am honest with myself I have to admit that I hope the mare loses every race she runs in for the rest of her career just so you people will shut the hell up.

Thanks a lot for ruining a pretty cool horse for me.

Your honesty is admirable … and you clearly have plenty of company on this board.


By the way, Z is a VERY cool horse.

[Travis Stone]

I feel like it's gotten to the point where people don't even know what they're arguing about anymore.

I said the other day Zenyatta was great... but as dumb as this sounds, there are different types of great. A great day is when you win a Trifecta for $1k while a great day is when you hit the lottery.

Right now, Zenyatta is great... it's cool winning 17 races in a row, plus the Classic, no matter what surface and despite the really good trip. Been there done that. Give me something new. I've seen Zenyatta win the Hirsch, the Vanity... let me see her win the Hollywood Gold Cup, Pacific Classic... heck, I'd settle for the Delaware Handicap or the Personal Ensign.

As for great, everyone wants to talk about Personal Ensign, which is fine. But let's be real... neither Personal Ensign nor Zenyatta could go head-to-head with Ruffian, who was every bit of great a horse could be.

[Danzig]

Originally Posted by Travis Stone

I feel like it's gotten to the point where people don't even know what they're arguing about anymore.

I said the other day Zenyatta was great... but as dumb as this sounds, there are different types of great. A great day is when you win a Trifecta for $1k while a great day is when you hit the lottery.

Right now, Zenyatta is great... it's cool winning 17 races in a row, plus the Classic, no matter what surface and despite the really good trip. Been there done that. Give me something new. I've seen Zenyatta win the Hirsch, the Vanity... let me see her win the Hollywood Gold Cup, Pacific Classic... heck, I'd settle for the Delaware Handicap or the Personal Ensign.

As for great, everyone wants to talk about Personal Ensign, which is fine. But let's be real... neither Personal Ensign nor Zenyatta could go head-to-head with Ruffian, who was every bit of great a horse could be.

[ateamstupid]

Originally Posted by CSC

Supposing she beats all of dirt racing's best, Blame, Quality Road, Rachel A, and even some poly and turf horses in the BCC, what then? Does she have to go to Japan to prove she is the world's best horse? I'm just trying to wrap my head around it if it happens, how will this forum react.

Cue the Jeopardy music....

She will get enormous credit, but there will still be some disappointment from me that they didn't test her more often. Once again, I want to see Zenyatta against the top competition because I think she's awesome, and I'd like to see empirically just how awesome rather than deal in conjecture forever.

[CSC]

Originally Posted by ateamstupid

She will get enormous credit, but there will still be some disappointment from me that they didn't test her more often. Once again, I want to see Zenyatta against the top competition because I think she's awesome, and I'd like to see empirically just how awesome rather than deal in conjecture forever.

I wasn't always an admirer of hers either, but I finally recognized her for the talent she is. There is hope, if I could be swayed then anyone can be. I think her legacy for the rest will perhaps unfairly come down to 2 or maybe 1 race, but that is the position the connections have chosen for her, for many it won't matter, even Secretariat lost to Onion, so who knows. I just hope whatever happens the true Zenyatta shows up at CD for those that want to define her on one race.

[justindew]

Originally Posted by ateamstupid

She will get enormous credit, but there will still be some disappointment from me that they didn't test her more often. Once again, I want to see Zenyatta against the top competition because I think she's awesome, and I'd like to see empirically just how awesome rather than deal in conjecture forever.

Isn't that what Beyer Speed Figures are for?