Fly Down -Travers Trip

the_fat_man · #1 08-29-2010, 11:33 AM

Clearly, Fly Down got a harder trip than the winner, who got a perfect inside run, while FD was wide. But I think losing a prestigious race like the Travers and then explaining it in terms of not getting as good a trip as the winner, misses the point. The question is whether FD could've beaten AE with the SAME TRIP for each?

The answer is YES. If FD would've changed leads in the stretch, he probably, maybe definitely, wins the race, as he just missed a head bob.

Which takes us to the two likeliest suspects: Lezcano and Zito. Now, I'm not going back (at this point, anyway) and looking at FD's previous races to see if he changed leads in them --- whether consistently, sporadically or never.

1) Lezcano -- Hard to believe that so many jocks can't get these horses to change leads in the stretch run (or keep them on righty lead, once they do so). Now, Lezcano is stinking up the joint lately but since he's not the only jock who rides horses that don't change leads, it follows that trainers have something to do with this

2) Zito --- The horse is towards the end of its 3 year old season, Nick, don't you think he should be changing leads under pressure? Shouldn't this be automatic at this point? And, if it's not, shouldn't this be a PRIORITY? It's not like he's some cheap filly whose action falls apart the second she's put under any semblance of pressure. No lead change = lose a prestigious G1.

I realize that some horses are just stubborn and won't let go of bad habits. In this case, a bad 'habit' was the difference between overcoming a perfect trip by the winner and taking home a huge win for the connections. What might've been if more attention was payed to 'details'.

#2 08-29-2010, 11:38 AM

clyde · #3 08-29-2010, 11:39 AM

spit!!

#4 08-29-2010, 11:46 AM

miraja2 · #5 08-29-2010, 12:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by the_fat_man

Clearly, Fly Down got a harder trip than the winner, who got a perfect inside run, while FD was wide. But I think losing a prestigious race like the Travers and then explaining it in terms of not getting as good a trip as the winner, misses the point. The question is whether FD could've beaten AE with the SAME TRIP for each?

The answer is YES. If FD would've changed leads in the stretch, he probably, maybe definitely, wins the race, as he just missed a head bob.

Which takes us to the two likeliest suspects: Lezcano and Zito. Now, I'm not going back (at this point, anyway) and looking at FD's previous races to see if he changed leads in them --- whether consistently, sporadically or never.

1) Lezcano -- Hard to believe that so many jocks can't get these horses to change leads in the stretch run (or keep them on righty lead, once they do so). Now, Lezcano is stinking up the joint lately but since he's not the only jock who rides horses that don't change leads, it follows that trainers have something to do with this

2) Zito --- The horse is towards the end of its 3 year old season, Nick, don't you think he should be changing leads under pressure? Shouldn't this be automatic at this point? And, if it's not, shouldn't this be a PRIORITY? It's not like he's some cheap filly whose action falls apart the second she's put under any semblance of pressure. No lead change = lose a prestigious G1.

I realize that some horses are just stubborn and won't let go of bad habits. In this case, a bad 'habit' was the difference between overcoming a perfect trip by the winner and taking home a huge win for the connections. What might've been if more attention was payed to 'details'.

You do?

randallscott35 · #6 08-29-2010, 01:37 PM

This is the first time he played the no lead change game. Ice Box does it all the time and acts like an ouchy mess with it. Thought Lezcano would win the Travers b/c thats how things go, but being outside yesterday was a poor decision.

RockHardTen1985 · #7 08-29-2010, 01:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by randallscott35

This is the first time he played the no lead change game. Ice Box does it all the time and acts like an ouchy mess with it. Thought Lezcano would win the Travers b/c thats how things go, but being outside yesterday was a poor decision.

He had no choice... Watch some replays, do some kind of work. The horse wont run inside of horses, he just wont. It has been that way since the winter at Fairgrounds.

randallscott35 · #8 08-29-2010, 01:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RockHardTen1985

He had no choice... Watch some replays, do some kind of work. The horse wont run inside of horses, he just wont. It has been that way since the winter at Fairgrounds.

Excuse me? **** you, you imbecile.

the_fat_man · #9 08-29-2010, 01:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by randallscott35

This is the first time he played the no lead change game. Ice Box does it all the time and acts like an ouchy mess with it. Thought Lezcano would win the Travers b/c thats how things go, but being outside yesterday was a poor decision.

Screw Ice Box, 1st of all. Hard to believe he actually got some support yesterday.

Might've been a poor decision but it didn't cost him the race; not changing leads did that. So, apparently, not only does FD have a problem changing leads under pressure but he also doesn't like to be INSIDE (per RH10). Has the horse been trained to do ANYTHING that it doesn't like to do?

randallscott35 · #10 08-29-2010, 01:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by the_fat_man

Screw Ice Box, 1st of all. Hard to believe he actually got some support yesterday.

Might've been a poor decision but it didn't cost him the race; not changing leads did that. So, apparently, not only does FD have a problem changing leads under pressure but he also doesn't like to be INSIDE (per RH10). Has the horse been trained to do ANYTHING that it doesn't like to do?

I agree, no lead change did cost him. The move looked early to me, though, but these are not world beaters. In general another slow 3 yr old classic.

RockHardTen1985 · #11 08-29-2010, 01:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by randallscott35

Excuse me? **** you, you imbecile.

No not excuse you... Your ****ing clueless dude you have no clue what your talking about.

Being outside was a poor decision? Well maybe it was the wrong decision, but as far as the actual horse HE NEEDED IT.
You are clueless, please just stop.

randallscott35 · #12 08-29-2010, 01:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RockHardTen1985

No not excuse you... Your ****ing clueless dude you have no clue what your talking about.

Being outside was a poor decision? Well maybe it was the wrong decision, but as far as the actual horse HE NEEDED IT.
You are clueless, please just stop.

I just love some fat **** on the internet telling me to "do some work." Didn't you like Blu's horse in this race? Too funny, either way I think its time for another vacation for you.

RockHardTen1985 · #13 08-29-2010, 01:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by randallscott35

I just love some fat **** on the internet telling me to "do some work." Didn't you like Blu's horse in this race? Too funny, either way I think its time for another vacation for you.

No actually my A's were 7,8. And I said that MULTIPLE TIMES ON THIS WEBSITE. I defened Admiral Alex when someone said he had 0 chance. Vacation, lol... I did not know you called the shots around here. If anything its you who needs to go, your clueless and coming back calling me a fat ****, yea thats real mature and classy.

Duvalier · #14 08-29-2010, 01:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by randallscott35

I just love some fat **** on the internet telling me to "do some work." Didn't you like Blu's horse in this race? Too funny, either way I think its time for another vacation for you.

He posted he liked Afleet Express

randallscott35 · #15 08-29-2010, 01:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Duvalier

He posted he liked Afleet Express

Tremendous. He got lucky the best horse in the race lost. Hope he had his allowance on it.

#16 08-29-2010, 01:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by randallscott35

Tremendous. He got lucky the best horse in the race lost. Hope he had his allowance on it.

It's all about Lezcano.

Karma wasn't letting him win the biggest race of the meet. It would be a disservice to midgets across the world.

randallscott35 · #17 08-29-2010, 02:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Coach Pants

It's all about Lezcano.

Karma wasn't letting him win the biggest race of the meet. It would be a disservice to midgets across the world.

You were right all along coach.

RockHardTen1985 · #18 08-29-2010, 02:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by randallscott35

Tremendous. He got lucky the best horse in the race lost. Hope he had his allowance on it.

Actually I posted 7,8 were my A's. And said Ice Box, First Dude, Super Saver, Trappe Shot, A Little Warm, Afleet Again, and the other Zito Miners whatever were all total tosses for me. I think I pretty much had the race pegged. I talked Fly Down up in the Belmont and bet him heavy when he beat Drosselmeyer at Belmont, your such a ****ing idiot. OMG

randallscott35 · #19 08-29-2010, 02:08 PM

Hope you made enough to retire PG, you are still the best.

the_fat_man · #20 08-29-2010, 02:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RockHardTen1985

Actually I posted 7,8 were my A's. And said Ice Box, First Dude, Super Saver, Trappe Shot, A Little Warm, Afleet Again, and the other Zito Miners whatever were all total tosses for me. I think I pretty much had the race pegged. I talked Fly Down up in the Belmont and bet him heavy when he beat Drosselmeyer at Belmont, your such a ****ing idiot. OMG

On the other hand:

Quote:

Originally Posted by RockHardTen1985

I would not argue with anyone saying Trappe Shot is the most talented horse in here.

Quote:

Originally Posted by the_fat_man

What do you base that on?

Quote:

Originally Posted by RockHardTen1985

The lack of any brilliance. His huge Belmont win crushing a horse who has come back to run 2 triple digit beyers. His Monmouth races were strong losing to only the divisions leader while defeating at least 4 of these already. I'd say most raw talent is him or Afleet Express.

So, AE has the trip of a lifetime to win and TS runs out.
Just saying..........