Beyers: Summer Bird 111; Kowboy/Music 108; Gone Astray 103

[parsixfarms]

Originally Posted by Antitrust32

Its as BS as Ice saying SB is better than Rachel at 10 and Rachel is better than SB at 9...

You're right, RA couldn't beat SB now at 9F.

[parsixfarms]

Originally Posted by randallscott35

As for Baffert, I don't understand how he says Zensational is the fastest horse he's ever trained. His numbers a re turtle like compared to Midnight Lute.

It wouldn't have anything to do with the value of those stallion seasons, now would it?

[The Indomitable DrugS]

Who cares what Desormeaux says? He's one year removed from saying Big Brown was better than Formal Gold.

[The Indomitable DrugS]

Originally Posted by parsixfarms

You're right, RA couldn't beat SB now at 9F.

SB wouldn't beat RA at 9fs in a fairly run race and SB would get smoked by Quality Road at a mile .. which is his best distance.

[Antitrust32]

Originally Posted by The Indomitable DrugS

SB wouldn't beat RA at 9fs in a fairly run race and SB would get smoked by Quality Road at a mile .. which is his best distance.

She's already proved twice she will win even if it is an "unfairly" run race.


Parsixfarms post made about as much sense as a Crossfirehurricane post.

[parsixfarms]

Originally Posted by Antitrust32

She's already proved twice she will win even if it is an "unfairly" run race.


Parsixfarms post made about as much sense as a Crossfirehurricane post.

After reading the Summer Bird HOY discussion, the post was meant as a joke. That being said, I hope your suggestion that RA competed in "unfairly" run races was made in a similar vein.

[King Glorious]

A fairly run race is one where all of the starting gates open at the same time. The rest of the stuff is nonsense. It's still a fair race if it's three horses and the pace is 51 seconds for the half. It's still a fair race if it's 15 horses and the pace is 45 for the half. Either you have the speed and versatility to adapt to the conditions or you don't. If you don't have enough tractability to sit off of a face pace and a 45 will cook you, that's a negative in your book. If you don't have the speed to stay close when the pace is 51 and you can't close into it, that's a negative for you. It's not fair or unfair.

[The Indomitable DrugS]

Originally Posted by King Glorious

A fairly run race is one where all of the starting gates open at the same time. The rest of the stuff is nonsense.

facepalm.

[Antitrust32]

Originally Posted by parsixfarms

After reading the Summer Bird HOY discussion, the post was meant as a joke. That being said, I hope your suggestion that RA competed in "unfairly" run races was made in a similar vein.

I'm actually not sure what an unfairly run race is?


Edit - I did think Smarty's Belmont was an "unfairly" run race though. When other jockey's kill their horses in order to beat one horse, and not win the race.. that is an unfairly run race IMO.

[Indian Charlie]

Originally Posted by Antitrust32

I'm actually not sure what an unfairly run race is?

Yeah you do, and so does everyone else here.

Perhaps the use of the words fair or unfair are bad choices, but everyone knows what the intent/meaning is.

[Antitrust32]

Originally Posted by Indian Charlie

Yeah you do, and so does everyone else here.

Perhaps the use of the words fair or unfair are bad choices, but everyone knows what the intent/meaning is.

race dynamics may be a better word than fair or unfair. guess that is where i am getting confused. You guys are talking about pace, right?

[The Indomitable DrugS]

There's more to it than just race dynamics.

[Arletta]

Originally Posted by Duvalier

Speaking of Spaniard...he's in the 6th today at Oak Tree. Maiden Special Weight for 3 year olds and up going 7 furlongs.

Finally breaks maiden and pays a nice $10.00.

[randallscott35]

Originally Posted by Arletta

Finally breaks maiden and pays a nice $10.00.

Likely the best horse Baffert has ever trained.

[King Glorious]

Originally Posted by Indian Charlie

Yeah you do, and so does everyone else here.

Perhaps the use of the words fair or unfair are bad choices, but everyone knows what the intent/meaning is.

Yeah we do know what you mean but isn't there something to be said about a horse that can adapt to the conditions of a race and not need it to go a certain way in order to perform at his or her best? If Dutrow sends out two rabbits to beat Commentator and Commentator doesn't have the ability to take back and relax off the speed, it doesn't mean it was unfair to Commentator. If Mine that Bird gets caught in a four horse field and the leader walks around in 25 1/5, 50 2/5 and doesn't get caught, I don't see that as unfair to MTB. I get what you are saying about race dynamics maybe not favoring a particular horse's style but to me that's a chink in the armor of the horse if he can't adapt. Take a horse like Rachel. If they send speed out to compromise her, she lets them go and sits back. If there's no speed, she makes the pace. She doesn't get compromised by race dynamics. When we saw Summer Bird run in Arkansas, he ran like a deep closer and one that would need a strong pace in front of him to show his best. But now look at him. He's got the speed to put himself into races whenever they want to so he's not going to be a victim of any race dynamics. To me, that's what separates the top horses from the good horses.

[King Glorious]

By the way, Zensational is faster than Midnite Lute. Just not for the whole six furlongs probably. I think Baffert was referring to which of his horses, if you sent them balls out from the gate, was the fastest.