Larry Hughes sucks

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by horseofcourse

I was talking pick and roll...spotting up for a 15-20 footer.

You want a 20 footer from Ilgaugukas as your final play?

[Mortimer]

Mike Brown coaching record
Regular season 100-64
Playoffs 15-11

The last 24 years Lenny Wilkins coached, his teams made the NBA finals exactly zero times. His lifetime playoff record is 80-98. His record as in the playoffs as a Cavs coach was 18-23. I may not be the expert in Cleveland sports lore that Morty is but I would say that Lenny was dealt a much better hand with Price, Dougherty, Nance, Ron Harper, Elho, and Hot Rod Williams than Brown's current roster.
-----------------

Oh my God!!




Someone call 911!!!

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by pgardn

The RULES have changed since the aforementioned. You had to play man up in the Magic/Bird era. Riley got wise and played a semizone causing a technical if one was not close enough to his man. This was very hard to interpret, went thru some changes so now we have a game where a team CAN PLAY ZONE. They just cant stay in the lane 3 seconds. This has changed the way the game is played compared to the 80's a great deal.

We really must understand this (Hubie Brown). So what I believe we have seen is 3 point shooters become more valuable to crack a zone apart. And defense requires more mobile big men. A big shot blocker cannot just stand in the lane on defense anymore. imo, a player like Jason Kapono is in the league for one reason. And there are some very poor basketball talented yet mobile big men, close to my heart here would be Fransisco Elson.

Plus in the Salary cap era those teams would have never been able to stay together

[horseofcourse]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

You want a 20 footer from Ilgaugukas as your final play?

no (would prefer 15 footer!)...just an option for a play when the double or triple to LeBron comes...I would want a 20 footer from him over Hughes, Gooden, Marshall, Pavlovic etc.

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by The Bid

If the play wasnt drawn up as a last possession play probably about 8 seconds. Lebron dribbled around at the top of the key before driving into a triple team and missing. Youre not going to get a foul called in that situation, so why force a bad shot. They should have taken a decent shot, and got the board, fouled, etc. My arguement is that the play was drawn up as a final possession play like it was a tie. Sure you can get lucky and get a tip, or get a second shot by Larry Hughes who cant hit the broad side of a barn, however thats not what you are looking for. In that spot they should have been trying to get an open look and had something to fall back on. Not shoot from the hip and prayed for a tip, or hughes to hit a shot he hasnt hit all year.

And what play would you have run? Did you think that Detroit was going to let them get a "decent" shot? Why doesn't anyone talk about the great D played by Hamilton? He played that as well as it is possible to play it. He hampered the shot attempt with his arms across James arm without making it look like a certain foul. Stood his ground without moving towards the offensive player. Perfect d.

What "open look" were they going to get and for whom? Anderson? Hughes?

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by horseofcourse

no (would prefer 15 footer!)...just an option for a play when the double or triple to LeBron comes...I would want a 20 footer from him over Hughes, Gooden, Marshall, Pavlovic etc.

They did not execute. Simple as that. The play calling is moot. If you dont make shots you lose. Despite Mortys pleas to the contrary there are no appealing options for Cleveland in a half court set under those conditions.

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by DaHoss9698

Come on. I tend to think a better coach might have something better drawn up for that. I'm not saying he's the sole reason they lost, but call me crazy, i don't think Phil Jackson or Pat Riley calls that play late.

Oh by the way Pat Riley was the godfather of the Pistons/Cavs series style of games. His Knicks of the 90's made thug ball popular

[horseofcourse]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

Mike Brown coaching record
Regular season 100-64
Playoffs 15-11

The last 24 years Lenny Wilkins coached, his teams made the NBA finals exactly zero times. His lifetime playoff record is 80-98. His record as in the playoffs as a Cavs coach was 18-23. I may not be the expert in Cleveland sports lore that Morty is but I would say that Lenny was dealt a much better hand with Price, Dougherty, Nance, Ron Harper, Elho, and Hot Rod Williams than Brown's current roster.

And Van Gundy did a bang up job with the Rockets in the Playoffs.

Plus you lose many points by not admitting that Isiah is by far the worst coach in the league not named Doc Rivers. Unless you like a lot of other people dont consider the Knicks and Celts part of the NBA any more.

I'm sure you guys will disagree but I think that Brown has outcoached Flipper this series and is unlucky to not be up 2-0.

I really love the theory that if you shoot quick you have a better chance to win. If you are down one and make you give the other team another chance to win. If you are down one and miss and foul you are most likely needing a 3 to tie. I would love to see the probability on teams under 10 seconds in the playoffs, down three points that win or tie. maybe 3%?
They were playing to win the game. If either shot goes in they win. If they dont then they lose. Pretty simple. I'm pretty sure any playoff underdog on the road would love to be in the situation of controlling their own destiny with one last play.

I'm not sure where the Brown is a terrible coach idea came from. This is the farthest a Cavalier team has ever gone. The '76 version under Fitch I believe was the best of the bunch and I feel would have won a title had not Chones broke his foot in practice before the Eastern finals. They were the best team in basketball come playoff time and still took Boston to 6 games without their leading scorer. They would have played a 42 win Phoenix team in the finals that year. The Wilkens teams were incredibly offensively talented with great shooting percentages and efficient offenses, but were peaking during the peak Jordan years which is an excuse Brown doesnt' have that Wilkens did. They still should have advanced to more than 1 conference final in his time.

Brown's first two years are by far and away the best first two years in the history of Cleveland the last 40 years. I mean Flip Murray was a key member on last year's team, and you see how much playing time he is garnering in Detroit this playoff season.

[horseofcourse]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

And what play would you have run? Did you think that Detroit was going to let them get a "decent" shot? Why doesn't anyone talk about the great D played by Hamilton? He played that as well as it is possible to play it. He hampered the shot attempt with his arms across James arm without making it look like a certain foul. Stood his ground without moving towards the offensive player. Perfect d.

What "open look" were they going to get and for whom? Anderson? Hughes?

Again, I'm not sure why people on this forum think it is "easy" to get stuff against Detroit's defense. It never is and never has been. The opportunities they had the first two games are about as good as you can possibly get against that team.

[Mortimer]

They did not execute. Simple as that. The play calling is moot. If you dont make shots you lose. Despite Mortys pleas to the contrary there are no appealing options for Cleveland in a half court set under those conditions.
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You're right.






James may as well miss it.

Originally Posted by horseofcourse

HE's 15-10 in the playoffs the last two years with 3 series wins for a franchise that hadn't won a playoff series since 1993.

Actually he's 11-10. Anyone who counts the Washington series should never talk about the NBA again.

Originally Posted by horseofcourse

Silly, silly man. Before LeBron got to Cleveland the team hadn't had a 30 win season in over 3 years. The team was 15-67 the season before LeBron got there. In two years he had them over .500. They have won 3 playoff series in the last 2 years after having not won one since 1993. They have back to back 50 win seasons for only the second time in close to 40 years in existence.

HE hit not one, but two game winning shots in the playoffs last year. At age 22, LeBron has 15 playoff wins...I think at that age, Bird and Jordan had a total of zero combined.

Why bother with facts when making things up is so much better!!!

The Eastern Conference was actually competitive when Jordan and Bird played.


Why use rational thinking when you can just put down others? GFY.

LeBron will win, at most, three titles. He's just not as good as his hype.

[horseofcourse]

Originally Posted by Pillow Pants

Actually he's 11-10. Anyone who counts the Washington series should never talk about the NBA again.

It was the playoffs. Should we discount the St Louis Cardinals as World Series champions last year because they weren't that good in the regular season??

15-10.

[horseofcourse]

Originally Posted by Pillow Pants

The Eastern Conference was actually competitive when Jordan and Bird played.


Why use rational thinking when you can just put down others? GFY.

LeBron will win, at most, three titles. He's just not as good as his hype.

Of course it was...like Jordan's first playoff team that was 30-52 during the regular season and qualified for the playoffs. Super competetive team there. A 30-52 team qualifying for the playoffs is quite indicative of super competion...what could I have been thinking. Jordan and Bird combined for 1 playoff win before the age of 23...I was wrong there. Sorry about that.

[horseofcourse]

c'mon guys...you really don't know who you are dealing with here....offer anything of some value here.

[horseofcourse]

oops...sorry about that again...Jordan's 2nd playoff team went 30-52. His first playoff team was a stellar 38-44. Now that was a competitive eastern conference.

[Mortimer]

Guys.









DINNER TIME!!!

[horseofcourse]

my boyfriend's back and there's gonna be some trouble hey- la-de-da my boyfriends back!!!

[horseofcourse]

When in the course of human events it becomes necessary to mutilate and embarrass mortimer you simply do it. Mayber he can point out some of my typos however.

Originally Posted by horseofcourse

It was the playoffs. Should we discount the St Louis Cardinals as World Series champions last year because they weren't that good in the regular season??

15-10.

Yes because the Washington Wizards without two of their best players can be compared to a god damn baseball team.