There's no stars in racing? Is that right?

[Kasept]

Horses in the headlines of DRF this morning. But there aren't any stars in the game...

KIP DEVILLE: Back for the Poker..
http://www.drf.com/news/article/104573.html

Also featured in Grening's report.. Benny the Bull, Driven By Success, Lime Rickey..


COMMENTATOR: Prepping for the Whitney..
http://www.drf.com/news/article/104549.html


INDIAN BLESSING: Prepping for the A Gleam..
http://www.drf.com/news/article/104587.html

Also featured in Anderson's report.. Obrigado (22nd stake start in last 24 outsings), Life is Sweet..


EINSTEIN: Looking for third surface Gr. I in a row..
http://www.drf.com/news/article/104568.html

Also featured in the McGee piece.. International star Asiatic Boy makes his North American debut..


MUSIC NOTE: Part of the kooky 3 horse entry in the Phipps..
http://www.drf.com/news/article/104590.html

[MisterB]

Evening ATTIRE was a star. Maybe the last one for a while.

[The Indomitable DrugS]

There's always going to be stars because someone has to win the races.

In some years the stars won't be very good in relation to the stars of other years.

In 1997, Skip Away ran 9 Beyers of 115 or greater - and capped off his year with a 6 length Breeders Cup Classic win with a 120 Beyer. He was defeated in the vote for Horse of the Year by Favorite Trick.

Skip Away was punished in the voting because he, Formal Gold, Will's Way, and Gentleman were taking turns beating each other in what possibly was the all-time deepest handicap division I've seen in my time.

Favorite Trick dominated his division by beating laughing stock competiton like Dawson's Legacy and Nationalore in the BC Juvie. Time Limit and Laydown in the Breeders Futurity. KO Punch and Jess M in the Hopeful. Case Dismissed in the Saratoga Special. Double Honor in the Bashford Manor.

Basically, the older male division was Adriana Lima, Gisele Bundchen, Karolina Kurkova, Heidy Klum etc. The 2yo male division was some pretty girl hanging out at Camp Fat.

Curlin goes his entire career and only runs one lifetime Beyer of 115 or better - yet he wins 2 horse of the year titles. Skip Away does it 9 times in a year and only wins about a third of his races that year.

Look at a horse like Einstein .. he's run 25 times, made over $2.6 million, and his career best Beyer is a 106. Distorted Humor ran just 5 times in 1997, his average Beyer was 111.00 - and he was only good enough to win 1 of those 5 races...the lone win coming in the prestegious Doug Salvatore Mile at Monmouth.

A lot of these divisional stars running now might be stars ... but they're really low rated stars compared to stars of past years. Obviously you have some big exceptions ... 'sup Rachel Alexandra. And hey, if Favorite Trick deserves a horse of the year title over Skip Away ... Rachel Alexandra deserves a nod over Ruffian.

[sdjcom]

I love to watch the stakes and graded horses and the different series, such as BC but when a horse wins for me he's a star in my book. The horses mentioned above are exceptional, and CT has their own star Researcher, whom i like for an upset @4-1 Sat at CD. there are plenty of horses we can make stars.

[miraja2]

Originally Posted by The Indomitable DrugS

There's always going to be stars because someone has to win the races.

In some years the stars won't be very good in relation to the stars of other years.

In 1997, Skip Away ran 9 Beyers of 115 or greater - and capped off his year with a 6 length Breeders Cup Classic win with a 120 Beyer. He was defeated in the vote for Horse of the Year by Favorite Trick.

Skip Away was punished in the voting because he, Formal Gold, Will's Way, and Gentleman were taking turns beating each other in what possibly was the all-time deepest handicap division I've seen in my time.

Favorite Trick dominated his division by beating laughing stock competiton like Dawson's Legacy and Nationalore in the BC Juvie. Time Limit and Laydown in the Breeders Futurity. KO Punch and Jess M in the Hopeful. Case Dismissed in the Saratoga Special. Double Honor in the Bashford Manor.

Basically, the older male division was Adriana Lima, Gisele Bundchen, Karolina Kurkova, Heidy Klum etc. The 2yo male division was some pretty girl hanging out at Camp Fat.

Curlin goes his entire career and only runs one lifetime Beyer of 115 or better - yet he wins 2 horse of the year titles. Skip Away does it 9 times in a year and only wins about a third of his races that year.

Look at a horse like Einstein .. he's run 25 times, made over $2.6 million, and his career best Beyer is a 106. Distorted Humor ran just 5 times in 1997, his average Beyer was 111.00 - and he was only good enough to win 1 of those 5 races...the lone win coming in the prestegious Doug Salvatore Mile at Monmouth.

A lot of these divisional stars running now might be stars ... but they're really low rated stars compared to stars of past years. Obviously you have some big exceptions ... 'sup Rachel Alexandra. And hey, if Favorite Trick deserves a horse of the year title over Skip Away ... Rachel Alexandra deserves a nod over Ruffian.

This post is like a greatest hits album of DrugSianism.
Many s to you sir.

[Sightseek]

There are "neat" horses like Einstein, but even in the short time I have been watching racing there has been a significant drop in the quality of horses running - especially in the older male and female divisions.

[Cannon Shell]

Steve that isnt exactly a murders row

[Kasept]

Originally Posted by The Indomitable DrugS

A lot of these divisional stars running now might be stars ... but they're really low rated stars compared to stars of past years.

As was discussed yesterday on ATR, the 'past year's relation' is a seperate discussion. It's not a matter of valuating the current elite runners versus the elite runners of yesteryear, because this is today and that was yesterday.

Constantly harping that so and so pales in comparison to the Skip Aways of halcyon days of yore only serves to diminish the enjoyment of what we have right now. I don't get the eagerness to do that. And more importantly, it quells newer, younger fans enthusiasm if they constantly hear that the game sucks now by comparison to when "it was great and I was there".

No matter how good they look in their era, Derek Jeter ain't Al Kaline, Miguel Cabrera ain't Roberto Clemente and no one pitching is Bob Gibson, but that doesn't diminish the respective player's current roles as 'stars'.

We're doing ourselves a diservice if we go out of our way to pedestal salad day stars for what we have now.

[slotdirt]

Originally Posted by Sightseek

There are "neat" horses like Einstein, but even in the short time I have been watching racing there has been a significant drop in the quality of horses running - especially in the older male and female divisions.

It does seem like a lot fewer horses are actually progressing from the 3YO to 4YO seasons, right? And by progressing I mean two things: actually racing as an older horse and/or actually improving once a horse turns four.

[Kasept]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

Steve that isnt exactly a murders row

No, but combined they do represent multiple/numerous Gr. I wins, consistant stake starts, Breeders Cup wins/appearances, etc., stretched over a number of seasons. (And at least three of them are eminently likeable ).

[sdjcom]

Originally Posted by Sightseek

There are "neat" horses like Einstein, but even in the short time I have been watching racing there has been a significant drop in the quality of horses running - especially in the older male and female divisions.

that may be ,but if owners don't run the talented horses into their 4-5 year old season then geldings and( mares considered no good to breed to) is all you are going to get in the older divisions. I think MTB has a good future if he stays healthy.

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by Kasept

As was discussed yesterday on ATR, the 'past year's relation' is a seperate discussion. It's not a matter of valuating the current elite runners versus the elite runners of yesteryear, because this is today and that was yesterday.

Constantly harping that so and so pales in comparison to the Skip Aways of halcyon days of yore only serves to diminish the enjoyment of what we have right now. I don't get the eagerness to do that. And more importantly, it quells newer, younger fans enthusiasm if they constantly hear that the game sucks now by comparison to when "it was great and I was there".

No matter how good they look in their era, Derek Jeter ain't Al Kaline, Miguel Cabrera ain't Roberto Clemente and no one pitching is Bob Gibson, but that doesn't diminish the respective player's current roles as 'stars'.

Miguel Cabrera is a much better hitter than Clemente and Jeter is likely ranked quite a bit higher historically at his position than Kaline is at his though I will give you Gibson though Randy Johnson while over the hill now probably has had a better overall carer than Gibson. Now if you said Grady Sizemore isnt Mickey Mantle or Ryan Howard isnt Lou Gehrig I would agree.

[Antitrust32]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

Miguel Cabrera is a much better hitter than Clemente and Jeter is likely ranked quite a bit higher historically at his position than Kaline is at his though I will give you Gibson though Randy Johnson while over the hill now probably has had a better overall carer than Gibson. Now if you said Grady Sizemore isnt Mickey Mantle or Ryan Howard isnt Lou Gehrig I would agree.

at least we have Hamels and Utley also!

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by Kasept

No, but combined they do represent multiple/numerous Gr. I wins, consistant stake starts, Breeders Cup wins/appearances, etc., stretched over a number of seasons. (And at least three of them are eminently likeable ).

Outside of Indian Blessing and Kip Deville they make up a bunch of 2nd raters that simply stuck around. The others have risen in stature because of the defection of better horses. It is a bunch of Jamie Moyers, nice careers, you go see them if you get free tickets but soon forgotten.

[Antitrust32]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

Outside of Indian Blessing and Kip Deville they make up a bunch of 2nd raters that simply stuck around. The others have risen in stature because of the defection of better horses. It is a bunch of Jamie Moyers, nice careers, you go see them if you get free tickets but soon forgotten.

what are you, a mets fan??

[NTamm1215]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

Outside of Indian Blessing and Kip Deville they make up a bunch of 2nd raters that simply stuck around. The others have risen in stature because of the defection of better horses. It is a bunch of Jamie Moyers, nice careers, you go see them if you get free tickets but soon forgotten.

So am I not the only one who isn't a Commentator fan?

NT

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by Antitrust32

at least we have Hamels and Utley also!

Utley has a chance to be among the best ever at 2nd. Hamels is good but probably not historically so. While he isnt great there is no better player to watch than Victornio

You can't have stars that the public cares about when they perform maybe at most 8 times a year on 6 week breaks.

[Indian Charlie]

Originally Posted by The Indomitable DrugS

Basically, the older male division was Adriana Lima, Gisele Bundchen, Karolina Kurkova, Heidy Klum etc. The 2yo male division was some pretty girl hanging out at Camp Fat.

I'm curious. That hot one legged chick you scored with from the 24 hour supermarket, is she in the former group of females, or is she hanging out at Camp Fat too?

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by NTamm1215

So am I not the only one who isn't a Commentator fan?

NT

He is a nice horse but hardly a star. Because he has been around for a long time he is well known and has a nice following but historically is an afterthought.