San Rafael - Worst G2 ever?

[SniperSB23]

Every horse in the San Rafael except for one would be eligible for an entry level allowance. The one horse that does have two wins won both of them at Turf Paradise. The field as a whole is 8 for 31 with 23 of those 31 races being in maiden races. Only one horse in the field has run higher than an 82 Beyer on dirt. This is a pretty sorry bunch. I think Notional could be a very good sprinter if he isn't ruined in the attempt to stretch him out but against this field he will likely still win which means that stretch out will continue.

[KY_Sasquash]

Originally Posted by SniperSB23

Every horse in the San Rafael except for one would be eligible for an entry level allowance. The one horse that does have two wins won both of them at Turf Paradise. The field as a whole is 8 for 31 with 23 of those 31 races being in maiden races. Only one horse in the field has run higher than an 82 Beyer on dirt. This is a pretty sorry bunch. I think Notional could be a very good sprinter if he isn't ruined in the attempt to stretch him out but against this field he will likely still win which means that stretch out will continue.

agree, Notional will roll here

[cmorioles]

It might be bad, but it isn't nearly as bad as that sham of a G2 Dixie Meister won last weekend at Santa Anita.

[slotdirt]

If I had a nickel for every time I saw the phrase "worst (insert race here) ever" on either here or ESPN, I'd be a rich man.

[JJP]

Originally Posted by slotdirt

If I had a nickel for every time I saw the phrase "worst (insert race here) ever" on either here or ESPN, I'd be a rich man.

If the graded stakes committee wasn't asleep at the wheel, you wouldn't be seeing all the comments. But they are. And you'll see more of them.

[slotdirt]

I just don't get what you guys are expecting from these fields. When horses keep retiring before they even hit their 3YO season, stakes caliber fields are going to suffer.

[JJP]

Then the races should be downgraded.

[Hickory Hill Hoff]

Originally Posted by SniperSB23

Every horse in the San Rafael except for one would be eligible for an entry level allowance. The one horse that does have two wins won both of them at Turf Paradise. The field as a whole is 8 for 31 with 23 of those 31 races being in maiden races. Only one horse in the field has run higher than an 82 Beyer on dirt. This is a pretty sorry bunch. I think Notional could be a very good sprinter if he isn't ruined in the attempt to stretch him out but against this field he will likely still win which means that stretch out will continue.

What do you expect? Everybody today sits on the young horses (from 2 to 3)
they don't want to run in the Breeder's Cup Juvenile races, wait until mid-February the next season and only make one or two starts before the first Saturday in May. There are too many three year old preps races anyway. The graded race system has to be revamped. But, this year's field is a good betting race...at least it isn't all Baffert (see race SA 6th)

[smartyalex]

Originally Posted by Hickory Hill Hoff

What do you expect? Everybody today sits on the young horses (from 2 to 3)
they don't want to run in the Breeder's Cup Juvenile races, wait until mid-February the next season and only make one or two starts before the first Saturday in May. There are too many three year old preps races anyway. The graded race system has to be revamped. But, this year's field is a good betting race...at least it isn't all Baffert (see race SA 6th)

Maybe you can help me better understand your point. Did we not have a full Juvenile field this year???? Also, could you be more specific and name all these one / two start "Derby horses"? I agree that the TOBA board who grades the Stakes must be out of their mind. But, I don't think there are too many prep races that it makes the affects the Derby Trail racing fan.

[PeteMugg]

Just curious what you might know about Notional that is going to ruin him here. I've read the PPs but I don't see it just yet. I haven't seen him run so maybe there's more to it.

[SniperSB23]

Originally Posted by PeteMugg

Just curious what you might know about Notional that is going to ruin him here. I've read the PPs but I don't see it just yet. I haven't seen him run so maybe there's more to it.

Nothing specific that I know. Just a feeling from watching him that he will be best as an off the pace sprinter and the longer they take him the more it will dull his kick. His pedigree certainly doesn't scream for more ground. I like the horse and don't want to see him ruined like Magical Ride was earlier this year.

[SniperSB23]

Oh, and I'm not one that throws around worst G2 ever. I truly think a field of horses that have struggled to break their maidens is about as bad a G2 as I've seen.

[eajinabi]

Are you kidding??? Some of these horses could go on and do good after this race. Tenfold looks to be a good horse if evident from his last. Notional had a monster FTO and we have a few who ran in G1 last out. I suspect some of these will do very well in the future.

These horses barely turned 3, this is the time to filter the good and the bad. This time of year will be the only time to get value on 3 yo

[Hickory Hill Hoff]

Originally Posted by smartyalex

Maybe you can help me better understand your point. Did we not have a full Juvenile field this year???? Also, could you be more specific and name all these one / two start "Derby horses"? I agree that the TOBA board who grades the Stakes must be out of their mind. But, I don't think there are too many prep races that it makes the affects the Derby Trail racing fan.

I'm taking Sniper to task with his comment on "worst field ever" Yes, we had a full field in the Juvy...There has been horses in the past with only two starts going into the Derby...and there are too many preps, but I don't understand your last sentence..."affects the Derby trail fan?" explain???

[SniperSB23]

Originally Posted by Hickory Hill Hoff

I'm taking Sniper to task with his comment on "worst field ever" Yes, we had a full field in the Juvy...There has been horses in the past with only two starts going into the Derby...and there are too many preps, but I don't understand your last sentence..."affects the Derby trail fan?" explain???

This was at best a 90 Beyer and Notional won by 4. This was a Derby prep that will have no impact on the Derby and was a terrible G2. This isn't as good as the ungraded Southwest Stakes will be and nowhere near as good as the G3 Rebel will be. To give this race the same status as the Arkansas Derby, the Fountain of Youth, and the Santa Catalina is just plain silly.

[Hickory Hill Hoff]

Originally Posted by SniperSB23

This was at best a 90 Beyer and Notional won by 4. This was a Derby prep that will have no impact on the Derby and was a terrible G2. This isn't as good as the ungraded Southwest Stakes will be and nowhere near as good as the G3 Rebel will be. To give this race the same status as the Arkansas Derby, the Fountain of Youth, and the Santa Catalina is just plain silly.

Your right that this race and many other "early" Derby preps will have no impact the "first Saturday in May" and the graded stakes that are listed in California and other states are way out of wack. But, "worst" field I thought was a bit too harsh, but I see where your coming from...I still say there are way too many triple crown preps and this could be the problem and grading them all goes by past winners of the event.

[smartyalex]

Originally Posted by Hickory Hill Hoff

I'm taking Sniper to task with his comment on "worst field ever" Yes, we had a full field in the Juvy...There has been horses in the past with only two starts going into the Derby...and there are too many preps, but I don't understand your last sentence..."affects the Derby trail fan?" explain???

Wow, I must of had one to many Makers last night. Hell, I can't even understand what I meant! OOPS!

It is Jan. The race was for three year olds. Who did you want in this race? Who knows what the horses in this race will do in the future.

[repent]

dont worry about cali and their fields.
they have the miracle of polycrap now(or in the very near future) and we will see nothing but 14 horse fields of Grade 1 animals starting in 2008.

to be fair, its not likely that there are going to be a lot of good sized quality fields for 3Yos 2 weeks into the year.
thats why races like the Lecomte and Spectacular Bid are G3's.

Ive never understood the grading committee's infactuation with the santa anita winter/spring meet.
grade 1, 2, and 3 races every weekend and they all look like the San Rafael did this year.

[Hickory Hill Hoff]

Originally Posted by eurobounce

It is Jan. The race was for three year olds. Who did you want in this race? Who knows what the horses in this race will do in the future.

He's right...who cares what the grades are, it's the Derby trail...anything come happen.