When do you scratch due to heat?

[DogsUp]

This is for my own education

Is there ever a time where it is just too hot to run your horse? I know that Tagg didn't like to run Funny Cide in high temperatures. Many people on tv yesterday kept talking about the heat and how horses do not like hot weather. Is this true. Just inform me a little here.

[MaTH716]

Didn't they cancel a card at the Spa last year for excessive heat?

[parsixfarms]

Originally Posted by MaTH716

Didn't they cancel a card at the Spa last year for excessive heat?

Two years ago.

[docicu3]

Originally Posted by MaTH716

Didn't they cancel a card at the Spa last year for excessive heat?

Delaware and Philly do it frequently each year which may include today.

[Linny]

Horses take cold far better than heat. I can see scratching because of heat but honestly, if the race is the Belmont and you are that close to a TC...I wouldn't want to opt out either. Tagg knew Funny Cide didn't really like mud and had to face a ton of it in the Belmont. If it's any other race, he probably would have stayed in the barn.

[jwkniska]

Colonial pushed back their post times today to get out of the afternoon heat.

[TheSpyder]

They always start late afternoon during the week.

Spyder

[Cannon Shell]

You scratch when it looks like you wont win...then it becomes too hot

[2 Dollar Bill]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

You scratch when it looks like you wont win...then it becomes too hot

Is that like putting the cart before the horse ?

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by 2 Dollar Bill

Is that like putting the cart before the horse ?

Kind of. But it is a nice easy excuse to scratch. Realistically when it gets to be 95 and humid it really is too hot and you are putting the horses in a dangerous position.

[2 Dollar Bill]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

Kind of. But it is a nice easy excuse to scratch. Realistically when it gets to be 95 and humid it really is too hot and you are putting the horses in a dangerous position.

I was just kidding with you, and I understand the point.. Why send the horse out and have a race day take tooooooooooo much out of them and have to wait weeks till the next race.

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by 2 Dollar Bill

I was just kidding with you, and I understand the point.. Why send the horse out and have a race day take tooooooooooo much out of them and have to wait weeks till the next race.

It does take a lot out of them when it is really hot. They are working so much harder just standing in the stall trying to stay cool. Heat is really hard on them.

[the_fat_man]

What's the typical gallop for a horse in the morning? Is it once around the track? Say, 1.5 miles at BEL, for example?

[GPK]

Originally Posted by jwkniska

Colonial pushed back their post times today to get out of the afternoon heat.

What time did they move the first post to? Because they always start late during the week. 5:00 first post has been the norm there for a while during the weekdays.

[hoovesupsideyourhead]

Originally Posted by GPK

What time did they move the first post to? Because they always start late during the week. 5:00 first post has been the norm there for a while during the weekdays.

when the golf bag is too heavy!!

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by the_fat_man

What's the typical gallop for a horse in the morning? Is it once around the track? Say, 1.5 miles at BEL, for example?

anywhere from 1 1/4 to 1 3/4's is typical

[DogsUp]

Cannon, what can a trainer do in order to keep their horse hydrated and keeping them from heat exhaustion?

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by DogsUp

Cannon, what can a trainer do in order to keep their horse hydrated and keeping them from heat exhaustion?

You try to keep them cool as possible, put extra salt in their feed, give them fluids before and after the race, tube them with electrolytes, etc and then really hope it helps

[Pedigree Ann]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

You try to keep them cool as possible, put extra salt in their feed, give them fluids before and after the race, tube them with electrolytes, etc and then really hope it helps

Some places (I particularly remember the old July Select Sales at Keeneland, now a melted memory) they put box fans in the top of the stall doors to cool the horses off.

[Storm Cadet]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

You try to keep them cool as possible, put extra salt in their feed, give them fluids before and after the race, tube them with electrolytes, etc and then really hope it helps

I agree with all YOU do, but why do MANY trainers REMOVE the water buckets from the stalls on race day and prohibit fluids. When I use to hang around the barns at Belmont, this was a routine thing done by all my trainers and for the life of me, could never understand restricting fluids. Turner,Contessa, Violette, Gyrmardi all said some gibberish about water making the horses feel full and makes them sluggish on race day. I can see, removing feed, but never fluids.

I asked them about the value of lasix (which is a diurectic and removes water from systems) as well as restricting water. They just looked , never giving much thought to the scientific basis of prehydration and rehydration of athletes, including equine. Only Violette, who has a college degree and understood the whole hydration philosophy, agreed that he was looking to change his views and start to hydrate with electrolytes his barn. This was in 2003-04.

Cannon, do ANY equine research companies or equine facilities do ANY RESEARCH on performance with hydration? Years ago, 50's through 70's, we restricted water for our athletes until Gatorade and other companies did all the research onto improving performance with sports carbohydrate/potassium/sodium solutions. Now, through research, NOBODY even thinks of playing without using a product as it has been shown it improves performance.

We have come so far in research with sweat-fluid retention ect, that we can now customize the product we give out prerace or contest. Heavy salty sweating is given one product while regular water based sweat is given another and with simple in room or barn tests we can know what type we have. Why are we still so far away in horse racing? Is it that nobody has done the equine testing or reseach yet? Don't care about it? No profit in it for a company to make an equine version of gatorade-powerade-pedialyte and market it worldwide. Too much work for understaffed barn employees? Darn, in the summer, I would bring my horse trainers staff gatorade and lemonade weekly to keep them cool as they hot walked or bathed down my horses in the summer heat!

I really wonder when I see horses all lathered up or heavily sweating compared to opponents, is the horse really nervous or is he already in some state of heat distress physiologically from fluid restrictions, OR is that normal sweat for that horse in hot humid conditions. Are horses that sweat that white milkish stuff really a salty sweater and that is his normal for them and they need more salt or electrolytes prerace? We know as handicappers that we usually throw out a horse that is sweating bullets in the paddock as it usually indicates poor upcoming performance. Tale of Ekati was heavily sweating prerace Saturday. Ran like crap. Funny Cide was known to dislike hot humid racing days and always ran poorly if not scratched. What do you think the chances are that the same trainer has old school water restriction in place in his barns?

I looked at BB prerace on high def TV and he didn't look to me sweating much at all. Not wet anywhere!!!Even the announcers said he looked great. On a 100 degree day, he was the only living thing at Belmont that wasn't sweating. Everyhorse in the warmup jog came back to the gate sweating in various degrees. BB none at all. I told my son, that was not a good sign to me as IMO he was already out of fluids and could NOT sweat and cool off anymore. Did the 6 hours in those hot Belmont detention barns cook him? He surely didn't enjoy his stay there as we all saw on ESPN. Did the water plumbing problem at Belmont have something to do with his water intake or was he restricted by barn policy? We'll never know. But I sure wish somebody or some entity do more study and research. The equine set is starting slowly to understand heat stress and heat stroke as they now all have water hoses, ice blankets and heat medication and some other 20th century innovations trackside for the horses in distress.Last year for the first time we saw racing canceled at SAR because of the heat and humidity ( even though we have no temperature/humidity research to go on). It was an empirical decision based on some trainers feelings. Why not do some research and when we have a temp/humity level, we cancel. Something firm, not some random decision from some NYRA or state official. Get the state racing vets involved in education. They are the doctors for these horses and are in charge of their health. I've watched racing for a long time and I've never seen so many horses go down post race and collapse, only to hop up after given water. NYRA equine ambulance drivers are coming with the dreaded curtin, only to have the heat stroke victim jump up and jog/walk after given hydration. We hardly ever saw that years ago, but now let's hope we can get to the 21st century soon with more study before the PETA idiots look at this before we do!