Weekend Stakes Beyers: Arrogate 115
 

Best 115 of all time...LOL

Impressive victory. Unless some super 3 year old colt comes up he's winning any race he is in.

Good for Bob . Is there a nicer guy?

SUN Sunland Derby (G3): Hence 93 (Street Boss) S. Asmussen/A. Juarez
SUN Sunland Park Oaks: Ghalia 68 (Medaglia d'Oro) T. Pletcher/J. Ortiz
SUN La Coneja S: Woodacouldadid 74 (Minister Eric) J. Gonzalez/E. Gonzalez
SUN Bill Thomas Memorial S: Redneck Humor 95 (Da Stoops) J. Evans/M. Perez
SUN New Mexico Breeders' Derby: Go for a Stroll 62 (Attila's Storm) T. Fincher/T. Hebert
SUN Harry Henson H: K P Wildcat 79 (Include) W. Martin/R. Chirinos
SUN New Mexico Breeders' Oaks: Pink Cadillac 65 (Diabolical) J. Marr/K. Tohill

TP Spiral S (G3): Fast and Accurate 82 (Hansen) M. Maker/T. Gaffalione
TP Bourbonette Oaks (G3): Purely a Dream 84 (Pure Prize) K. McPeek/R. Albarado
TP Rushaway S: Montu 76 (Dialed In) J. Deegan/R. Prescott

SA San Luis Rey S (G2): Itsinthepost-FR 98 (American Post-GB) J. Mullins/T. Baze
SA Dream of Summer S: Skye Diamonds 95 (First Dude) W. Spawr/T. Pereira

OP Purple Martin S Golden Mischief (via DQ) 79 (Into Mischief) S. Asmussen/G. Franco

GP Skip Away S (G3): Fear the Cowboy 93 (Cowboy Cal) E. Loza/J. Rios
GP Any Limit S: Who's the Lady 79 (Munnings) K. O'Connell/P. Lopez

AQU Cicada S: Bluegrass Flag 87 (Bluegrass Cat) T. Morley/K. Carmouche

MVR Southern Park S: Nikki My Darling 64 (Creative Cause) J. Radosevich/L. Colon

Not too many last-to-first 115s that I can think of off the top of my head.

:tro:

Though I'm certain Secretariat's Preakness would qualify if they made a BSF for it.

This is an obvious case where the number most definitely doesn't begin to tell the story.

Couldn't get a better setup though.

What was Midnight Lute's BSF in the 2007 BC sprint? I think Benny the Bull was even further back than him in that race though...

Ghostzapper was one hell of a horse

Yup he was, but at this point Arrogate has surpassed him.

I don't compare horses of this quality unless they run against each other. Its too hard and would be splitting hairs.

I agree. Ghostzapper may have been more versatile based on winning Grade 1's
Sprinting and routing, but I doubt we'll ever find out if Arrogate can do the same (and it really shouldn't matter, based on his immense talent).

Great race by Arrogate, but I think Jay Hovdey's DRF article on assessing greatness is on the mark:

http://www.drf.com/news/hovdey-asses...storys-lessons

His Travers was impossible to believe when I watched it. It was infinitely more impressive to me than the DWC. I never thought he was in serious trouble in the race (he is at least ten lengths better than everyone else, and in fact, has beaten Gun Runner by double digit lengths) while in the Travers he pulled away by daylight after setting a pretty healthy pace.

I'd have to rate his Travers as one of the most impressive, if not the most impressive, races I've ever seen. It was also certainly the most unbelievable performance, beating Cee's Tizzy's maiden win for making me think I just saw something impossible.

Cant one argue GZ was a tad dressed up. Huge # in the slop at Monmouth and then an uncontested soft pace in the the Classic, where i have read some sort of deal was made that GZ and Rosses in May wouldn't kill each other early on. I think GZ was great, but closer to the horse we saw beat St Liam when he ran like a 114 beyer rather then a 120 type monster.
Thats what Arrogate is. Just a big monster who can break last do something hes never had to do still win in hand and run a 115 beyer.

Awesome discussion about GZ vs Arrogate. One thing I'll throw out there is that I think Arrogate would have a really hard time keeping up with serious sprinters at 6-7f, whereas GZ absolutely embarrassed them.

Victory Gallop, Wagon Limit, Milwaukee Brew, Festin, Aptitude, Real Quiet, Tejano Run, Unbridled, Turkoman, Pleasant Tap, Pleasantly Perfect...

Loved Victory Gallop. His Whitney vs Behrens is one of my favorites. Talk about premature move.

I remember his Stephen Foster being visually impressive. Can't find a video of it though.

Zenyatta ....was "dead last!" in the B.C. and most of her other races . had an Equibase fig of 126 in 2009 compared to 124 for A.gate

Uh oh.....:eek:

Lol. Yeah. That is so idiotic it's barely worth responding to.

With you and i loved Z.

well I didn't throw out the numbers, someone else did.
and when they asked Mr. Smith after the race if this was the best horse he ever rode he didn't respond "yes". He said something to the effect "well I rode the great mare Zenyatta blah, blah blah...etc etc etc... i think he said Zenyatta 3 times when talking about Arrogate.

so i guess we will never no unless they throw a saddle on her again.


and rachel in her prime would have beat them both.

he had a 128 beyers in 2004

Beyer speculated that had his figures existed in 1973, Secretariat would have scored 139 in his classic 1973 win at the Belmont Stakes.

highest figures all-time

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Beyer_Speed_Figure

Actually, not that what a jockey says means anything, but I think Smith did say Arrogate is the best horse he's ever ridden.

I guess he forgot riding Holy Bull, who was in a different league than Zenyatta.

He is a hopeless zenyatta fan and he's already stated his belief that Arrogate is not extraordinary. Further attempts at bringing him to reality would be like trying to argue a point with Reverend Jim.

See the thing is, holy bull was awesome, but hosses passed him sometimes. No hoss passed Zenyatta. She passed every hoss she ever ran against except 1. Smith took the Blame for that .

I'm sure running styles had nothing to do with that.

Weak comeback Cha cha.

Did someone really say Rachel Alexandra would've beaten Arrogate?

Maybe it was a weak comeback because it wasn't a comeback at all. It was a rebuttal to a really dumb idea.

Why not? Apparently Zenyatta was better than both of them.

Right! exactly right....and she could have passed him too.

got a problem with that?


lets be real here. since the political board got removed there is really no drama on this site at all. i long for the days of arguing stupid opinions.:)