The US Private Healthcare System fails again
 

more at:

http://usnews.msnbc.msn.com/_news/20...-us-health-gap

I don't get it. You now want taxpayers to pay for Canadians to have health insurance while in the country? This skier is lucky the accident took place in American and not Canada or she'd likely be dead.

Surely her superior Canadian healthcare policy will pick up med costs while out of the country. No?

Does the universe in universal care offered by Canada include Americans?

fyi the skier did pass away from the accident.

I don't understand why athletes in organized sport: the olympic class, internationals, top level, etc. - don't have high-risk insurance for their sports? Of course you can't be covered by any private insurer for those sports (maybe if you want to pay $50,000 a year or something). But I would think the Olympic team (of course that only covers a few athletes) or international organizations, might provide a high-risk pool for them?

Holding a 30-year-old parents responsible for her medical bills ... I don't get that. Unless the hospital came to them Day One and demanded a signer on her ICU treatment before they would go all-in on treatment options. But to lose your daughter, then lose everything you own (retirement, house, savings, etc) to pay the $300,000 bill.

700,000 medical bankruptcies a year in this country, and most of them have private insurance. It's ridiculous to hire people to pay your healthcare, when they only make money by not paying your healthcare costs. At least they can no longer kick you off for pre-existing conditions and lifetime caps (thank you, Obamacares)

The parents should sue the U.S. for not having universal health care coverage for this non U.S citizen. :zz:

Not something I said. Try Dell. Sounds like something he'd say.

Ok then I read the title of the thread wrong which states the US Healthcare system failed again. I thought you meant that our healthcare system failed because it expected the next of kin to pay the bill for medical treatment in trying to save the life of their loved one.

Yes, but how do you jump to the wild conclusion I want her parents to sue the United States of America for not having universal health care coverage? That's crazy.

Maybe you could read the other post I made listing my concerns. Oh, hell, never mind, just jump to whatever conclusions you want.

First off my post was NOT directed at YOU!
I just put it out there to add to the thread and the absolute stupidity of the thread title. What country in the world will pick up a huge medical tab for a non-citizen? If the young lady didnt have adequate insurance for herself then she should have stayed in Canada or purchased some. Not everything that is posted is directed at YOU, jeesh.

Geesh, indeed.

You said: .... sue for healthcare?

I said: Not something I said. Try Dell. Sounds like something he'd say.

You then said: ... then I misread the title of the thread.

Yes. That made me think your comment, which you then did not address to Dell but back to me, was indeed directed to me. And again, you called the thread title "absolutely stupid". As I wrote the thread, yeah, I'd say you were talking to me (insert emoticon for little smiley face here)

No. I don't think "America" should pick up the tab for this woman. As I said my concerns were, athletes in those sports cannot get insurance from their private insurers in the US, and foreigners cannot get US privates to write travel insurance for those high-hazard sports - that is a problem I listed, a major fail for US insurance. Or maybe they could get insurance, but it's $50,000 a year or something (what do jocks pay, I wonder?) I also don't know what the deal is why an adults parents would be held responsible for her $300,000. Maybe, as I wondered, they signed something first day. And if so, did that affect the healthcare choice she would or would not have gotten? We know that some hospitals will simply not take self-insured patients, will transfer them elsewhere to a hospital that does. That -that the question needs to be wondered about in the face of a life-threatening emergency - is another major problem with US healthcare.

I was not freaking talking to you lady....you chimed in on my post, you talked to me first. I was commenting and just putting it out there.

I am not angry at you. For god's sakes, you said, "I thought you meant" ... and now you are pissed I responded to that?

I was responding to you talking to me first, I addressed no particular person in my first comment. You quoted me and commented so I responded, get it?

Sorry I responded to a comment in a thread I posted, about the title of my thread. How effing dare I.

No need to be sorry just admit you were mistaken that my first comment was directed at you, when in fact it wasnt directed at anyone, and have yourself a fine day.

Honu: The parents should sue the U.S. for not having universal health care coverage for this non U.S citizen? :zz:

Riot: Not something I said. Try Dell. Sounds like something he'd say.

Honu: Ok then I read the title of the thread wrong which states the US Healthcare system failed again. I thought you meant that our healthcare system failed because it expected the next of kin to pay the bill for medical treatment in trying to save the life of their loved one.

Yes: Very sorry I responded to those posts! Both of them!

Bottom line is the best healthcare in the world is expensive. So expensive some can't afford it. Homogenizing it into some sort of one fits all system is not going to fix anything.

The fact some girl in Alabama has leukemia and parents don't have insurance is sad, very sad. But her insurance or lack of it is not the responsibility of others trying to provide for their own daughters. Americans with the means are very charitable and it is with them these charities parents should seek help.

Insurance policies are rising more rapidly than ever in anticipation everyone will be forced to pay more to equal out paying for the monstrous premiums required for insuring a kid with a pre-existing condition of leukemia times millions.

actually, it's not that expensive dell. ever get a quote on it? for my son, 25 and a smoker, it's about $20 a week thru bc/bc-NOT group coverage mind you.
family of five the other day-about $300/month. and it's also contingent on deductibles and the like. higher deductibles, lower premiums.
truth is most people CAN afford it;most people choose not to. they're young and healthy and don't see a need, not thinking about 'what if?'. the expense comes in when you're overweight, smoker, bad health, etc, etc. you have to pay more-so states have programs in place for high risk or high cost. here in arkansas, you get one decline from one carrier and you can get coverage thru the states program called 'chip'.
but, so many people don't get it. then when they need it, they wish they had it. you know, just like car insurance, homeowners, life insurance. same thing. then they complain because the bills are so high. yes, yes they are.

We don't have the best-rated healthcare in the world. We are rated 37th in quality and access; and first in cost, paying nearly double the percentage of GDP compared to what other first world countries pay for their health care. Private health insurance is a model that is decades old. We need to step into the 21st century. We are part way there with Obamacares.

ask for a hypthetical quote with pre-existing leukemia or self inflicted diabetes

So when the King of Saudi Arabia flew his crew to America for care it was because 37 was his lucky number? Don't be such a fool.

obviously any pre-existing conditions will affect rates. but if people bought insurance, they would be covered should a health issue arise. after they get ill, then they cry about the system. it's called closing the barn door after the horses all escaped.

How exactly did the healthcare system fail?
Your follow up arguments say that it did not fail.

Agreed and that's part of the reason why people shouldn't have babies if they can't afford them.

The problem is in the present there are a whole bunch of folks with diseases and no insurance who will be required to have insurance under Obamacare. Because of astronomical premiums they won't be able to afford it hence that responsibility will fall on others who are already struggling in there own lives.

First, lose the insult

Second: the King of Saudi Arabia doesn't have much to do with ranking the healthcare system for 300 million people. Our archaic private healthcare system is the most expensive in the world, and one of the least effective.

http://www.photius.com/rankings/healthranks.html

Overall rank: 37th , behind every other first world country
Preventable deaths: 14th
Health-life expectancy: 24th

Total health expenditures as %GDP: 2nd, (behind the Marshall Islands) most expensive first world healthcare in world

Health performance rank of 8 factors (system performance, cost, % you pay into system, insurance, etc): 72 nd

That's why starting next year there will be non-profits able to enter the insurance exchanges to compete with the for-profit insurance companies, undercutting them, lowering insurance costs for everyone, and making it affordable.

"The World Health Organization's ranking of the world's health systems was last produced in 2000."
Nothing has changed at all in 12 years.
Surely the Greek model is one to be envied and admired now, right? And the Italians, perhaps this has something to do with these countries hanging on by a thread...
The Colombians? Of course.
How did the US healthcare system fail Sarah Burke?

Or They are not allowed to purchase insurance due to pre-existing conditions (nobody would sell to them)

Or they could purchase insurance, except it costs an unaffordable hundreds or thousands a month because they have health conditions (and still won't cover everything).

Or, they had insurance, but the company retroactively decided they wouldn't cover a condition included in the contract.

Fifty million Americans are uninsured, and it's not because they are too cheap to purchase insurance and cry about the system.

The 700 thousand medical bankruptcies in this country are mostly from people who have health insurance, but went bankrupt paying for what the insurance wouldn't cover.

We had a broken, unworkable private, for-profit healthcare system, and that has proven to work terribly for everyone but the insurance profit margin.

The ACA has already made it illegal for the insurance company to deny treatment for pre-existing conditions, kick someone off insurance due to lifetime caps, made preventive care more affordable for seniors on Medicare, removed $500 billion in Medicare waste from the system, provided temporary exchanges where the uninsurable can purchase insurance at affordable prices, closed the donut hole for seniors on Medicare and lowered their drug costs, and allowed young adults to remain on insurance policies until they are 26 (rather than having no insurance)

The Republican candidates all say they will repeal the above current law the day they get into office.

??? No. The sentence you half quoted on the first page says,

"The World Health Organization's ranking of the world's health systems was last produced in 2000, and the WHO no longer produces such a ranking table, because of the complexity of the task."

Thus if you click on and look at all the figures and ranking tables quoted, it shows the new source of the information aggregation, which is current, which is from a multiplicity of health organizations around the world, just not solely from WHO.

A thirty-year old falling and sustaining a severe head trauma, resulting in death, shouldn't threaten to bankrupt their family and survivors, causing them to lose their entire financial future: home, savings, retirement, etc.

Healthcare shouldn't be obtainable only for the wealthy. 40% of American homes are within a few paychecks of poverty. We are the only first-world country in the world that still pays private people to provide our health care, but they only make a profit by not providing us health care. That's simply crazy.

How many people live here?

They won't, they will go back to Canada.

Ooops, good point - hundred thousand :D not million, obviously!

They still have a $300,000 bill to pay in America, because the American healthcare system doesn't allow everyone - including elite athletes competing in dangerous sports - to be insurable here, let alone be able to afford huge copays for financial disasters.

Did you read the story? The family cannot afford to pay the bill. They were taking donations, so they wouldn't lose their house, future, savings, etc. Responsible people shouldn't suffer that.

When you go out for a steak dinner do you rank the meal by the steak you're eating or do you consider what 300 million other people are eating?

Pure and simple we have the best care money can buy!

Not everyone can afford Mortons but there's always a Denny's nearby

:D Not everyone can afford Denny's. 40% of Americans are living in threat of poverty. We are turning into a very poor country, with a wealthy class, and a poor class - the middle class is virtually gone. Their wages have stagnated for 40 years, while the wealthy have taken a greater percentage of ownership of the money available in the country. We have the most expensive care in the world. But even if you can afford it, you won't get "the best care" as far as neonatal survival rates, life expectancy, preventive death rate, preventive medicine, and access goes. If you have a chronic condition (diabetes, kidney failure, heart trouble for example) you will probably, as your life goes on, lose access to treatment for your conditions as your insurance refuses to pay or lifetime caps are reached, and cannot afford the medication sold by private companies at expensive rates only to those that can afford paying.

That has been modified by the ACA, thank goodness, who has lowered Medicare drug costs markedly, improved preventive care access for the elderly, etc.

There is no debtors prison and the hospital cannot sue them for things they do not own in this country. It is admirable that they want to pay the bill, but they are most certainly not going to lose anything in the process. Other than their daughter, who was a wonderful person and amazingly talented athlete that will be sorely missed.

The story is gone.

So the hospital cannot put a lien on their house and accounts as they do for Americans, simply because they live in another country? But that means the hospital is still unpaid, thus we Americans will have to pay for her bill in our hospital costs.

Wouldn't it be better that she had been able to be insurable in the US? (purchase of temporary travelers insurance)

Yes, that is so sad, to lose such a wonderful young person.

She had the ability, she just didn't do it.

Too bad her Universal Canadian policy didn't cover her. But I guess to the canadian gov the universe in universal stops at the border.

Now Riot, how will the millions of illegals living here be handled under Obamacare. Will they:

1) Be required and able to purchase health insurance
2) Be subsidized for a policy if unable to pay
3) Be treated via ER as they are now
4) Be refused treatment

And while we're at it. Will Americans who refuse to abide by the requirement to have insurance

1) Still be treated at the ER w/o insurance
2) Be refused treatment

Because as you have stated ad nauseum there is no fine or threat of jail for not abiding so I tend to think a lot of uninsured people will simply ingnore the 'requirement'

but that's what i've said already. here in arkansas they have CHIP. it's a state program to provide insurance if your premiums are too high, or you get denied. i have no doubt that other states have the same.

the issue isn't that many people can't afford, for many it's not a priority. then when something happens, they have to pay. you can pay premiums now, or a big bill later. either way, you're going to pay.
the issue for many is that they don't want to get insurance, but don't want a bill either. i find that argument laughable.


our medical industry as a whole needs serious attention. obamacare isn't a solution.