Beyers: Summer Bird 111; Kowboy/Music 108; Gone Astray 103
 

Summer Bird (JCGC): 111
Kodiak Kowboy (Vos): 108
Music Note (Beldame): 108
Interpatation (Hirsch): 102
Pure Clan (Flower Bowl): 97

Careless Jewel (Cotillion): 98

Gone Astray (OH Derby): 103

Brave Tin Soldier (Cliffhanger): 98

Awesome Gem (HAW GC): 101
Public Speaker (Carey): 95

Misremembered (IN Derby): 97
Congressional Page (Schaefer): 95

Lookin at Lucky (Norfolk): 89
Blind Luck (Oak Leaf): 88

How the BSF's for the turf races mean anything is totally beyond me???

wow, only a 98 for Careless Jewel? She'll still be a huge contender if she goes in the Distaff (won't call it the Ladies Classic) - I thought she was impressive yesterday.

I would call that figure a bit surprising too. The final time of 1:41.2 was three-fifths off the track record, set back in 1974. They ran 1:41.2 for 1 Mile 70 yards earlier on the card, and the Cotillion was 1 1/16. No race came close to that otherwise all weekend. But that is the problem when you don't run other stakes races on the card...no legitimate comparisons to previous figures and stakes caliber animals.

Much like the Music Note figure, the Cotillion figure doesn't make a lot of sense when you look at the times of the other routes on the card. Careless Jewel clearly ran better than a 98.

What would fig do you make for each..103 for Music Note and 104 for Careless Jewel?

HUGE contender?? Correct me if Im wrong but, she didnt get real good until she finally got real dirt.

I would say her figures improved a lot on dirt. She had won 2 of 3 on synthetics, and her last was pretty impressive. Final time figs are pretty misleading on the rubber.

Late Additions
 

Awesome Gem (HAW GC): 101
Public Speaker (Carey): 95

Misremembered (IN Derby): 97
Congressional Page (Schaefer): 95

Lookin at Lucky (Norfolk): 89
Blind Luck (Oak Leaf): 88

wow, is baffert stupid, that dolt just said that Lookin at Lucky was his best 2 year old in 5 years and he cant crack an 89.

Other than Midshipman, has he had any other top 2YO males in the past five years?

He had Roman Ruler in '04 and said some similar nonsense about him just to make sure he'd be entirely overrated his whole career.

The freaking guy went nuts about Spaniard before his debut. Why anyone listens to his prating about his two-year-olds is beyond me.

Trainers and jocks just love rating their horses and talking to the press. For Desor to talk about Summer Bird possibly being the best horse he's ever ridden already is laughable as well.

Hold on a minute... When asked how Summer Bird stacked up among prominent horses he's ridden, Desormeaux said smilingly, "Well, he's trying hard to be the best I've ever ridden." Jennie Rees ASKED him the question. I was standing next him when it happened. He wasn't standing around holding court telling people Summer Bird was the best he's been on.

Fair enough Steve, but this guy was gushing how Big Brown was easily the best horse he had ever ridden a year ago....I understand being in a situation....As for Baffert, I don't understand how he says Zensational is the fastest horse he's ever trained. His numbers a re turtle like compared to Midnight Lute.

Every year every jock says they are on the best horse they've ever been on. Its as BS as Ice saying SB is better than Rachel at 10 and Rachel is better than SB at 9.. and Dutrow saying the belmont is a "foregone conclusion". Trainerspeak and Jockeyspeak is a bunch of nonsense. No crap they are going to tout their own horse as the best EvAh!

It would be funny if next year Boral wins the triple crown and says "this is the best horse I've ever been on".

Speaking of Spaniard...he's in the 6th today at Oak Tree. Maiden Special Weight for 3 year olds and up going 7 furlongs.

What a Song was a good one of Baffert's.

Well that's because he hasn't hasn't gotten Mike Smith yet of course.

Like I said, other than Midshipman, has he had any top 2YOs in the past five years?

You're right, RA couldn't beat SB now at 9F.

It wouldn't have anything to do with the value of those stallion seasons, now would it?

Who cares what Desormeaux says? He's one year removed from saying Big Brown was better than Formal Gold.

SB wouldn't beat RA at 9fs in a fairly run race and SB would get smoked by Quality Road at a mile .. which is his best distance.

She's already proved twice she will win even if it is an "unfairly" run race.


Parsixfarms post made about as much sense as a Crossfirehurricane post.

After reading the Summer Bird HOY discussion, the post was meant as a joke. That being said, I hope your suggestion that RA competed in "unfairly" run races was made in a similar vein.

A fairly run race is one where all of the starting gates open at the same time. The rest of the stuff is nonsense. It's still a fair race if it's three horses and the pace is 51 seconds for the half. It's still a fair race if it's 15 horses and the pace is 45 for the half. Either you have the speed and versatility to adapt to the conditions or you don't. If you don't have enough tractability to sit off of a face pace and a 45 will cook you, that's a negative in your book. If you don't have the speed to stay close when the pace is 51 and you can't close into it, that's a negative for you. It's not fair or unfair.

facepalm.

I'm actually not sure what an unfairly run race is?


Edit - I did think Smarty's Belmont was an "unfairly" run race though. When other jockey's kill their horses in order to beat one horse, and not win the race.. that is an unfairly run race IMO.

Yeah you do, and so does everyone else here.

Perhaps the use of the words fair or unfair are bad choices, but everyone knows what the intent/meaning is.

race dynamics may be a better word than fair or unfair. guess that is where i am getting confused. You guys are talking about pace, right?

There's more to it than just race dynamics.

Finally breaks maiden and pays a nice $10.00.

Likely the best horse Baffert has ever trained.

Yeah we do know what you mean but isn't there something to be said about a horse that can adapt to the conditions of a race and not need it to go a certain way in order to perform at his or her best? If Dutrow sends out two rabbits to beat Commentator and Commentator doesn't have the ability to take back and relax off the speed, it doesn't mean it was unfair to Commentator. If Mine that Bird gets caught in a four horse field and the leader walks around in 25 1/5, 50 2/5 and doesn't get caught, I don't see that as unfair to MTB. I get what you are saying about race dynamics maybe not favoring a particular horse's style but to me that's a chink in the armor of the horse if he can't adapt. Take a horse like Rachel. If they send speed out to compromise her, she lets them go and sits back. If there's no speed, she makes the pace. She doesn't get compromised by race dynamics. When we saw Summer Bird run in Arkansas, he ran like a deep closer and one that would need a strong pace in front of him to show his best. But now look at him. He's got the speed to put himself into races whenever they want to so he's not going to be a victim of any race dynamics. To me, that's what separates the top horses from the good horses.

By the way, Zensational is faster than Midnite Lute. Just not for the whole six furlongs probably. I think Baffert was referring to which of his horses, if you sent them balls out from the gate, was the fastest.