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-   -   Beulah, River Downs the next to go... (http://www.derbytrail.com/forums/showthread.php?t=24605)

ALostTexan 08-19-2008 03:03 AM

Beulah, River Downs the next to go...
 
Looks like Beulah and River Downs will be the next two tracks to fall. Bloodhorse is reporting that they have both only requested very short QH meets next year. This was my fear all along when the slot Amendment failed in 2006.

I have never been to River Downs, but Beulah is a great little track, and there will be a few that will miss it.

mik9872 08-19-2008 07:53 AM

Good riddance to bad rubbish.

otisotisotis 08-19-2008 07:56 AM

I believe there is another gambling issue in the works for this year in Ohio.
While the quality of the River is not great, I've always enjoyed the atmosphere.

jwkniska 08-19-2008 10:07 AM

Unfortunately, the gambling issue in OH will probably not get passed (mom and dad are voting in favor of it).

Also, there is a consideration that will convert Cooper Stadium (where the AAA baseball team plays now, but is getting a new stadium next year) into a horse track.
If they do that, then Beulah will go and get upgraded to the new facility.

philcski 08-19-2008 11:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jwkniska
Unfortunately, the gambling issue in OH will probably not get passed (mom and dad are voting in favor of it).

Also, there is a consideration that will convert Cooper Stadium (where the AAA baseball team plays now, but is getting a new stadium next year) into a horse track.
If they do that, then Beulah will go and get upgraded to the new facility.

I think they're considering converting it to an auto racing facility, as per my columbus friends...

jballscalls 08-19-2008 11:25 AM

very sad news from the buckeye state :(

hoovesupsideyourhead 08-19-2008 01:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by philcski
I think they're considering converting it to an auto racing facility, as per my columbus friends...

that worked out great for sportsmans park lol

Benny Leger 08-19-2008 05:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by otisotisotis
I believe there is another gambling issue in the works for this year in Ohio.
While the quality of the River is not great, I've always enjoyed the atmosphere.

I agree 100 % Gary. It's a beautiful little track on the banks of the Ohio River for those who have never been there. Been going there since I was a kid with my Dad starting in the 60's. It's a piece of Cincinnati history. With a steady rise in all the surrounding states getting slots, purses have plummented. No incentive there to buy or Breed Ohio breds. Racino issue failed after the Firm who was hired to promote the on track slots did a horrible job. If RD goes down it will take many nearby family owned businesses with it. With a Racino and increased purses, IMO it could be a jewel.

Benny Leger 08-19-2008 05:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jwkniska
Unfortunately, the gambling issue in OH will probably not get passed (mom and dad are voting in favor of it).


The Bible thumpers won't allow it to pass.

2MinsToPost 08-19-2008 05:38 PM

I have a lot to say on this topic and will cause most of you know this is my backyard we are talkin bout. If I get time tonight I will, otherwise tomorrow I am going to shed some light on this.

2MinsToPost 08-19-2008 05:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by philcski
I think they're considering converting it to an auto racing facility, as per my columbus friends...

100% correct

2MinsToPost 08-19-2008 05:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Benny Leger
I agree 100 % Gary. It's a beautiful little track on the banks of the Ohio River for those who have never been there. Been going there since I was a kid with my Dad starting in the 60's. It's a piece of Cincinnati history. With a steady rise in all the surrounding states getting slots, purses have plummented. No incentive there to buy or Breed Ohio breds. Racino issue failed after the Firm who was hired to promote the on track slots did a horrible job. If RD goes down it will take many nearby family owned businesses with it. With a Racino and increased purses, IMO it could be a jewel.

I go once a week on average during live racing, drive from Columbus. Love it, a diamond in the rough with a great turf course. Racebook is so nice as well.

SilverRP 08-19-2008 06:06 PM

This news makes me think my home track (Remington) may not be around too much longer. Got slots a few years ago, but haven't seen purses go up much.

Coach Pants 08-19-2008 07:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 2MinsToPost
I have a lot to say on this topic and will cause most of you know this is my backyard we are talkin bout. If I get time tonight I will, otherwise tomorrow I am going to shed some light on this.

Thank god. I was worried you weren't going to chime in.






*patiently waits*

Benny Leger 08-19-2008 08:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 2MinsToPost
I go once a week on average during live racing, drive from Columbus. Love it, a diamond in the rough with a great turf course. Racebook is so nice as well.

I was at Indiana Downs today. Huge renovation going on there including Hotel, Casino and Golf Course. Temporary Casino(monster, airplane hanger looking, tent ) is open and packed. When finished, 5k claimers will be running for 15k-20k purses. 50 min. drive from Cincy. Why would you run at RD for 4k purse. Ohio is Stupid !!!

skippy3481 08-19-2008 11:11 PM

Benny how are you going to drop into my backyard without letting me know? What indiana downs is doing slow wise, is pretty nice although the racebook itself has always been top notch for a small track. They just never had any patrons. They are really pushing slot players into trying horses, but I'm not sure how that is faring.

I hope it raises the level of purses and the level of horses. Go there on a typical weeknight and its 2 t-breds, two quarterhorses, a plow horse, 2 donkeys, a mule, and the outrider. Great atmosphere just horrible racing.

ALostTexan 08-19-2008 11:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SilverRP
This news makes me think my home track (Remington) may not be around too much longer. Got slots a few years ago, but haven't seen purses go up much.

With Scott Wells running Remington I think they are safe. My fear is the parent company, and what they might have to do with Remington.

otisotisotis 08-20-2008 07:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Benny Leger
I agree 100 % Gary. It's a beautiful little track on the banks of the Ohio River for those who have never been there. Been going there since I was a kid with my Dad starting in the 60's. It's a piece of Cincinnati history. With a steady rise in all the surrounding states getting slots, purses have plummented. No incentive there to buy or Breed Ohio breds. Racino issue failed after the Firm who was hired to promote the on track slots did a horrible job. If RD goes down it will take many nearby family owned businesses with it. With a Racino and increased purses, IMO it could be a jewel.

And everytime I go there on the weekends, there are really great on-track crowds (which is quite amazing considering the product). But there is a bit of family atmosphere mixed in with the hard core types.
I always thought they missed the boat not having night racing, especially considering how muggy Cincy summers can be.

Benny Leger 08-20-2008 08:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by skippy3481
Benny how are you going to drop into my backyard without letting me know? What indiana downs is doing slow wise, is pretty nice although the racebook itself has always been top notch for a small track. They just never had any patrons. They are really pushing slot players into trying horses, but I'm not sure how that is faring.

I hope it raises the level of purses and the level of horses. Go there on a typical weeknight and its 2 t-breds, two quarterhorses, a plow horse, 2 donkeys, a mule, and the outrider. Great atmosphere just horrible racing.


Returning from Indy when I saw the Temporary Casino tent. Couldn't resist stopping in for a few hours to check out what's going on there.

sdjcom 08-20-2008 12:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mik9872
Good riddance to bad rubbish.



These small tracks are not rubbish, but provide the same jobs, training and livelihood for many people. I remenber Steve Cauthen riding his first full meet at River downs 1976, and it and Beulah are small very charming tracks.If you
are a true horseracing fan then any track closing is not good for the whole game. I bet the small tracks and do just as well as the big tracks. besides their money is the color green to. And i bet if you took away on video the track name the posted fractions, you could not tell if you was watching a
grade 1 or 5,000 claimers. They have exciting races too, just slower.

ArlJim78 08-20-2008 12:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sdjcom
And i bet if you took away on video the track name the posted fractions, you could not tell if you was watching a
grade 1 or 5,000 claimers
. They have exciting races too, just slower.

without any doubt i know I could, and so could many others.

sdjcom 08-20-2008 02:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ArlJim78
without any doubt i know I could, and so could many others.


Well maybe you can, but tell me how you can tell the difference, if you didn't know the jockeys on the horses no track name no fractional times just a generic screen how can you tell if it was a cheap claimer or a stakes race I've
watch horse races for 33 years and doubt if I could. Im very interested how you can tell difference on the video

Pedigree Ann 08-20-2008 02:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Benny Leger
I agree 100 % Gary. It's a beautiful little track on the banks of the Ohio River for those who have never been there. Been going there since I was a kid with my Dad starting in the 60's. It's a piece of Cincinnati history.

The old Coney Island on the Ohio. Clang, Myrtlewood's great rival for Midwestern sprint honors, held the track record at 6f for years; Man o' War's champion son Crusader set the track record for 10f. Used to be a feeder track for the Old Latonia, the leading track in Kentucky until it died in the 1930s.

sdjcom 08-20-2008 02:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pedigree Ann
The old Coney Island on the Ohio. Clang, Myrtlewood's great rival for Midwestern sprint honors, held the track record at 6f for years; Man o' War's champion son Crusader set the track record for 10f. Used to be a feeder track for the Old Latonia, the leading track in Kentucky until it died in the 1930s.


latonia was operating in the 1980's and then switch to turfway under new ownership

otisotisotis 08-20-2008 02:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sdjcom
latonia was operating in the 1980's and then switch to turfway under new ownership

I don't believe the new Latonia (Turfway) was the same as the old. The actual city of Latonia is much closer to Cincy, but I'm no historian.

sdjcom 08-20-2008 03:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by otisotisotis
I don't believe the new Latonia (Turfway) was the same as the old. The actual city of Latonia is much closer to Cincy, but I'm no historian.


I'm not sure either by old latonia i know turfway now is the latonia trk that was there at least 40-50years, so if there was an old latonia in the city of latonia before this track in florence ky then i'm wrong. I just thought she was referring to where the track is now under turfway. My mistake

ArlJim78 08-20-2008 03:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sdjcom
Well maybe you can, but tell me how you can tell the difference, if you didn't know the jockeys on the horses no track name no fractional times just a generic screen how can you tell if it was a cheap claimer or a stakes race I've
watch horse races for 33 years and doubt if I could. Im very interested how you can tell difference on the video

i think you could tell the difference in GR1's from 5K claimers if you've been watching that long. cheap horses don't look as fluid, have shorter strides in the stretch, etc. if the classes were closer, like gr3 vs. allowance, or higher claimers vs allowance, i agree that without any visual cues it would be hard to know the difference.

sdjcom 08-20-2008 03:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ArlJim78
i think you could tell the difference in GR1's from 5K claimers if you've been watching that long. cheap horses don't look as fluid, have shorter strides in the stretch, etc. if the classes were closer, like gr3 vs. allowance, or higher claimers vs allowance, i agree that without any visual cues it would be hard to know the difference.


Maybe so, i was just defending river downs and beulah on the comment they were rubbish. I get just as excited in the stretch run in a claimer(if my horse is in lead or coming hard ) as i do stakes races. The person who said river has a nice turf course is very correct. They were running these way back before it was popular. very nice track. Just cheap horses.

SentToStud 08-20-2008 03:21 PM

River Downs is nice. But Beulah? Come on. What of interest has ever happened there, aside from Art Schlicter losing everything he had and then some?

otisotisotis 08-20-2008 03:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sdjcom
I'm not sure either by old latonia i know turfway now is the latonia trk that was there at least 40-50years, so if there was an old latonia in the city of latonia before this track in florence ky then i'm wrong. I just thought she was referring to where the track is now under turfway. My mistake

the 'old' Latonia - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Latonia_Race_Track

sdjcom 08-20-2008 03:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SentToStud
River Downs is nice. But Beulah? Come on. What of interest has ever happened there, aside from Art Schlicter losing everything he had and then some?


Bealuh is okay and has a nice clubhouse, nothing special there but has some
charm and nice paddock with benches and all. the clubhouse is small but nice and remember Beulah runs most of its season in dead of winter and screen shot is always gloomy and muddy. However it's still a horsetrack and for people who live in that area it's nice for them. everybody can't live 1 hour from saratoga, santa anita so these tracks is all they have.

Pedigree Ann 08-20-2008 03:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sdjcom
I'm not sure either by old latonia i know turfway now is the latonia trk that was there at least 40-50years, so if there was an old latonia in the city of latonia before this track in florence ky then i'm wrong. I just thought she was referring to where the track is now under turfway. My mistake

Old Latonia was in another location; the site is now under a shopping mall. The Latonia Derby, 10f and once the top race for 3yos in Kentucky, was last run in 1937, as was the Latonia Oaks: this was just about the time that Keeneland opened and that track could be seen as the spiritual successor of Old Latonia in terms of class.

A new track which opened in the late 1950s tried to latch onto the aura of tradition and quality associated with it by reviving the name of Latonia but only managed to drag it into the dregs. So strongly did the new track devalue the name that the management group that took over in the 1980s felt they had to change the name to disassociate its racing product from what had gone on before.

sdjcom 08-20-2008 03:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by otisotisotis


Thanks for the info very interesting , see i don't know everything,lol now do the same with raceland. I live about 20 miles from where it use to be. Black gold got beat at this track. thx Stan

sdjcom 08-20-2008 03:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pedigree Ann
Old Latonia was in another location; the site is now under a shopping mall. The Latonia Derby, 10f and once the top race for 3yos in Kentucky, was last run in 1937, as was the Latonia Oaks: this was just about the time that Keeneland opened and that track could be seen as the spiritual successor of Old Latonia in terms of class.

A new track which opened in the late 1950s tried to latch onto the aura of tradition and quality associated with it by reviving the name of Latonia but only managed to drag it into the dregs. So strongly did the new track devalue the name that the management group that took over in the 1980s felt they had to change the name to disassociate its racing product from what had gone on before.

thx for the info , see we all learn something new everyday. I did not know of the original latonia. thx Stan

ArlJim78 08-20-2008 03:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sdjcom
Maybe so, i was just defending river downs and beulah on the comment they were rubbish. I get just as excited in the stretch run in a claimer(if my horse is in lead or coming hard ) as i do stakes races. The person who said river has a nice turf course is very correct. They were running these way back before it was popular. very nice track. Just cheap horses.

i understand your point, live racing can be enjoyable no matter what the class. we're going through some tough times, i think many of the older and smaller parks will struggle to make it.

2MinsToPost 08-20-2008 03:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sdjcom
Thanks for the info very interesting , see i don't know everything,lol now do the same with raceland. I live about 20 miles from where it use to be. Black gold got beat at this track. thx Stan

Speaking of Black Gold when you walk into the Racebook at River Downs hanging on the walls at the entrance is some nice stuff framed on Black Gold, a horse who won 5 Derbies if memories serves me correct (Ohio, Ky etc etc).
Folks, Chuck Simon brought up a good point when I was talking to him at Churchill Downs this summer, a Derby favorite won a $50,000 race at River Downs that he had a horse racing in and ran second I believe by 5 lengths, Harlans Holiday. Look, River Downs is nice. It is scenic, a good atmosphere, a nice turf course etc etc. Beulah is what Beulah is. Nothing fancy or nice but gosh dangit us folks here in the Central Ohio area still appreciate what it brings for us, some live racing and plenty of simulcast. It ain't pretty to look at but you know that and don't expect anything different.

I for one will sure as heck miss betting $4,000 claimer on a cold dreary January afternoon with my fellow horse racing buddies. It is one thing to bet the horses when their is no live racing, but it is another when you are surronded by horse flesh. Atmosphere.

sdjcom 08-20-2008 03:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 2MinsToPost
Speaking of Black Gold when you walk into the Racebook at River Downs hanging on the walls at the entrance is some nice stuff framed on Black Gold, a horse who won 5 Derbies if memories serves me correct (Ohio, Ky etc etc).
Folks, Chuck Simon brought up a good point when I was talking to him at Churchill Downs this summer, a Derby favorite won a $50,000 race at River Downs that he had a horse racing in and ran second I believe by 5 lengths, Harlans Holiday. Look, River Downs is nice. It is scenic, a good atmosphere, a nice turf course etc etc. Beulah is what Beulah is. Nothing fancy or nice but gosh dangit us folks here in the Central Ohio area still appreciate what it brings for us, some live racing and plenty of simulcast. It ain't pretty to look at but you know that and don't expect anything different.

I for one will sure as heck miss betting $4,000 claimer on a cold dreary January afternoon with my fellow horse racing buddies. It is one thing to bet the horses when their is no live racing, but it is another when you are surronded by horse flesh. Atmosphere.

i agree and the hotdogs and beer on hot day just sets the tone. is that little eatery just east of the track still there?

sdjcom 08-20-2008 04:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 2MinsToPost
Speaking of Black Gold when you walk into the Racebook at River Downs hanging on the walls at the entrance is some nice stuff framed on Black Gold, a horse who won 5 Derbies if memories serves me correct (Ohio, Ky etc etc).
Folks, Chuck Simon brought up a good point when I was talking to him at Churchill Downs this summer, a Derby favorite won a $50,000 race at River Downs that he had a horse racing in and ran second I believe by 5 lengths, Harlans Holiday. Look, River Downs is nice. It is scenic, a good atmosphere, a nice turf course etc etc. Beulah is what Beulah is. Nothing fancy or nice but gosh dangit us folks here in the Central Ohio area still appreciate what it brings for us, some live racing and plenty of simulcast. It ain't pretty to look at but you know that and don't expect anything different.

I for one will sure as heck miss betting $4,000 claimer on a cold dreary January afternoon with my fellow horse racing buddies. It is one thing to bet the horses when their is no live racing, but it is another when you are surronded by horse flesh. Atmosphere.

another derby winner winner spend a buck won the miller high life cradle stakes as a two yr old in sept 1984 so that makes 2 derby winners who ran there that we know of.

tiznowthegreat 08-20-2008 04:47 PM

Bellamy Road won the Cradle as well and then went off as the Derby favorite.

Antitrust32 08-20-2008 05:29 PM

My friend Pete has been calling the races at River... anyone heard him? I havent yet but would be interested in what ya'll think. I love to hear him call races... he would make em up and everything when we'd chill... like Freestyle Race Calling!


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