Cigar was the best horse in the last 25 years
 

For some reason on his radioshow Steve Byk doesn't want to give the horse the credit he deserves. If you look at what he did how can you argue he was a truly great horse. Nobody has done anything close to his 1995 season. I had to correct myself, it is just shy of 30 years, so lets say 25 years.


Career Highlights:
Undefeated in 1995, winning 10 of 10 starts, 8 of them Gr. I.
1995 Champion Handicap Male
1995 Horse of the Year
1996 Champion Handicap Male
1996 Horse of the Year
1996 Hwt Older Horse in UAE 9.5-11F
Carried 130 pounds to victory in the '96 Massachusetts Handicap.
Won 16 straight races from the Oct. 28, 1994 NYRA Mile through the July 13, 1996 Arlington Citation Challenge. Lost the 17th race, the Aug. 19, 1996 Pacific Classic (Gr. I) after engaging in a speed duel with Siphon, setting up a win by Dare and Go.
Cigar shares his 16 win streak with only one other North American runner in this century, Citation.
Won the inaugural running of the Dubai World Cup in 1996. Despite lacking a Gr. I status, it attracted the most accomplished (money earned) field in racing history to that point.
Won a total of 11 Gr. Is and the Dubai World Cup.
Retired as the leading North American money earner of all time with $9,999,813, a record which stands to this day.
Race Record

Doesn't Mister Frisky and Hallowed Dreams also share that record :)

I don't know if I'd say the last 30 years, but he was certainly a great horse -- one of the very best I've ever been able to see.

However, I always tend to think of Skip Away as the best horse to run in America since I started following racing.

IMO he is the Larry Holmes of racing. Unfortunately or fortunately for him he faced little competition. Horses who finished 2nd to him in Grade I's include L 'Carriere (twice), Wekivia Springs, Unacconted For, Star Standard, Tinners Way, Devil His Due (twice), Pride of Bukaan and Primitive Hall. Hardly a bunch of world beaters.


Horses he lost to in Grade I's include Alphabet Soup, Explosive Red, Skip Away and Dare and Go. He was the best in the mid 90's when racing was weak.

Personally, i'd have to say that The Green Monkey is the best horse in the last 30 years :D

The last 30 years picks up Slew, Affirmed, and the Bid. Love Cigar, but don't think he could run with that crew...

I think there is a decent argument that Cigar was the best horse since the inception of the Breeders' Cup and a pretty strong argument that he's in the Top 5 since then.

I guess Slew, Affirmed, and Bid were chopped liver. They would have all eaten him for lunch. I won't get into the Holy Bull debate. Just think Bull would have beaten him more often than not.

We know he couldn't run with them. You had to see Spectacular Bid run to really understand how good he was.

An argument could be made that Cigar is the best since The Bid...certainly I have huge respect for several others but I would never say Cigar would be overmatched against any horse since the Bid retired.

Cigar beat everyone who showed up for sixteen consecutive races. I know that is a trite way to argue the whole "who did he beat" debate, but it has to hold water.

I just don't feel the same way about Skip Away that many people do. When you mention him against Cigar I just immediately think Cigar was better, of course that's just a matter of personal opinion.

Ghostzapper is an interesting case in that when he got good, which was basically in his second career start, it almost seemed like no one could ever beat him. Think about the 2004 Breeders' Cup Classic. That race included the 2003 Derby and Preakness winner fresh off a Jockey Club Gold Cup win, the 2002 Horse of the Year, the 2004 Belmont and Travers winner, the 2003 Breeders' Cup Classic winner and the 2004 Whitney winner and other Grade I winners. Ghostzapper beat these horses like a drum.

I like the whole debate a lot, but I'm just not willing to say anyone was the best of the last 30 years. I'm glad we had so many that the discussion can continue.

How many of you think that if Street Sense wins out and then was able to have a 4 year-old campaign (which we know he will not so this is hypothetical) that he would garner some consideration?

NT

i doubt the streak would have happend had holy bull not suffered his injury. but that's racing.

i'd imagine there could be arguments made for many horses in the thirty year period. cigar was lucky enough to run in a period where there wasn't much top competition.
i think silver charm at his best would have beaten him. sunday silence would have taken him to school. at belmont, easy goer would beat him. that's off the top of my head, and ignoring the obvious such as seattle slew, the bid, etc.

Personally, I think Risen Star may have been the best since The Bid but he never got to prove it...to many "ifs" but the Star's Belmont (on three good hooves) was a sight to see! Likewise, I rank Secretariat and Kincsem at the top of my "all time" list yet there is no way to prove they belong any more than others. The "who did he/she beat" argument is a bit meaningless to me...who did Man O War beat? Certainly I can argue that he ducked the best of his generation...Exterminator. He did handle a worn-down Sir Barton. Ribot destroyed all he faced but what was their quality? Fun discussion but simply a matter of personal opinion.

Does the winning horse in this competition get a pretty sash with letters covered in rhinestones that read "DeeTee Forum Bestest Horse Evar?"

If so, I'm going to vote for Best Pal.

well, the original title/post really is mistaken. as others said, in the last 30 years, you would have to include seattle slew, affirmed, and the bid. so, no, cigar wasn't the best in the last 30 years.
it would be the late, great seatle slew. then affirmed, and then the bid. yes, in that order. one beat the next, who beat the third. yes, i know, four over a three year old.

We need a poll option so we can do a knockoff of the ESPN NOW deal. Since good horses hardly run anymore, what better way to get excited about the game than have a popularity contest?

Well my "favorite" is Cigar... I just loved to watch him lower that head and go for it. Heck, I get goosebumps even now thinking about him running. :p He did allot for racing and helping to bring in new fans and that is always a Big + for racing as did most of the other horses that are being mentioned... This will always be a matter of opinion and the "best" will never get a 100% of the votes.

oh please no. i thought that espn now thing was stupid.

Spectacular Bid was 24-for-24, with 14 Grade 1 wins, and numerous track record between the distances of 7-to-10 furlongs. He also had the record for fastest Ragozin sheet figure ever run for over 23 years.

Cigar is certainly not in the top five horses to have raced in the last thirty years.

I'm sure there are thousands... and a few on here as well...When horses make the news and make history people notice and get involved... Point is he did a good thing for racing , was a great horse and can never be credited as "just another horse".

there are so many great and forgotten horses over the last 30 years, i would be hard pressed to include cigar in my top 30 over the last 30 years.

i'll start with 3. precisionist, greinton and spend a buck.

Thirty years is a bit much, but over the last 25 years I think the list of horses who could beat Cigar's "A" game is pretty slim...

I don't think that is entirely true. It took Smarty Jones to make me take note of how interesting and multifaceted the sport is...I know a few who got involved by seeing the Afleet Alex story. We all have our hook...

Top stars do have an impact.

Cigar was a very good horse. But if I had to go with the best horse in the last 30 years I would go with Affirmed. I just think this horse is VERY underrated. He is typically ranked lower than Seattle Slew or The Bid, but in my opinion he should rank slightly higher than those two. He certainly ranks much higher than Cigar or Skip Away.
The reason why is the quality of competition these horses faced.
Affirmed faced more top quality horses, more often, than any other horse to run in the last 30 years, and yet he still managed 22 wins and 5 places from 29 lifetime starts. He beat Spectacular Bid. He faced horses like Seattle Slew and Exceller multiple times. Coastal and Sensitive Prince were both tremendous horses that couldn't contend with Affirmed. And then of course, Alydar. Most horses in the last thirty years have NEVER faced a horse of Alydar's quality, let alone race against him countless times as Affirmed did.
Despite facing this unbelievable competition, Affirmed was Champion 2yo, Champion 3yo, Champion Older horse, Triple Crown winner, and 2-time HOY.
Despite his lack of success against Slew - which the only real knock on him - I would rank him #1 in the last 30 years.

I've always found the "who did he beat" or "he didn't beat anybody" arguement very interesting. I am not only talking about Cigar here. If you have a sound horse, pick easy spots, beat mediocre horses, get these visually impressive victories over lower quality horses, and so on -- sure, I can see some credence in the "he didn't beat anybody" claim. However, on the contrary -- if you show up to the big dances, dance after dance, take on all comers (whoever else shows up and you have no control over that), beat them, beat them again, something along these lines -- then the "who did he beat" or "he didn't beat anybody" arguement, in my mind, has very little, perhaps no, credibility.

Now, about Cigar -- without getting into the stats and going through the PP's line by line/race by race -- this horse raced, raced and raced over the course of what? 2 years? I mean, in 95 didn't he race 10 times, and something like 8 G1's? Did he duck anybody in that campaign? You want to say it was a "weak crop" -- well, that's kind of like a weak jab in a fight. I mean you could say it, but how much are we really talking about here.


I remember him when he debuted as a 4yo, which I think was his first start for Bill Mott. That was kind of like a throwout year because they kept him on the turf for his first 3 or 4 starts. He didn't do much. But late in the year, when Mott put him back on the dirt, that's when the fun really started, LOL. I think his next start and last start of the year was the NY Mile and he trounced Devil His Due. Anyway, aside from the walk down memory lane, during his 5yo year, he took on whoever showed up, he himself showed up coast to coast and I don't remember them ducking anyone.

Regardless, he had a tough campaign. That year was no walk in the park. I don't remember any freshners or vacations for him. He raced 9 times going into the BC (and I think every one of them were G1's -- right? I don't remember off the top of my head).

Once again -- he showed up.

What did Tom Durkin say . . . "the incomparable, the invincible, the unbeatable Cigar!!!"

Eric

I think when it comes to ranking horses (which is obviously very arbitrary) it only makes sense to look at who they beat as ONE factor. It certainly isn't the only factor, but it does matter. It certainly isn't Cigar's connections fault that he didn't face top-notch competition. As yo say ELA, they weren't ducking anyone. There wasn't anybody to duck. But still, if you are going to compare him to a horse like Affirmed I think it only makes sense to compare the horses that Affirmed beat (like Spectacular Bid, Exceller, and Alydar) with the horses that Cigar beat. I think this comparison gives a clear edge to Affirmed.
I don't think it makes any sense to ignore the level of competition.

Disagree....you can debate all night long the merit of Cigar vs others, but how can you limit what it means getting people to the track? How do you know where those fans went? I saw Cigar at Arlington in that made for TV race and it was incredible. How many rock stars horses actually exist? Or existed? That could be another string on it's own.
Fast forward ten or eleven years...If he was running now and not "positioning" himself for races, what would it be like? We are gaga over SS but who would win that match race?

in his day he may have not brought new fans to the sport ... but after his day... and after seeing him at the horse park in kentucky & after watching his replays he brought a newfound respect to the sport 16 times over... at least for me anyway.

LOL@ the might mineshaft who ducked the big 1@anita(well connections did) and who only prevailed in 5 horse fields, and got worked in large ones against the likes of BS and PD

Only Funny Cide has matched Cigar's "rock star" status :)

Afleet Alex, Funny Cide, Barbaro - horse racing is suddenly becoming very, very cool again.

If the sport would only take advantage of the groundswell, and get some readily accessible major network TV deals at this point in time!

They ignored TV in the 1950's, and eventually lost out to football, and now NASCAR.

Edit: and I just remembered ... if the Hennigan brothers can indeed get their "First Saturday in May" movie on TV next year the week before the Derby - on a station most people will stumble across - wow!

Smarty Jones and Afleet Alex were the best horses in the last 30 years... it's not even close.

Both were true champions, with hearts the size of the racetrack... They would have laughed at horses like Holy Bull, Cigar, Skip Away.. etc.

Cigar couldnt have gotten Spectacular Bid out of a jog.

Speaking of Balto Star... You know I have him on my "DRF horse watch list" and every so often (recently as last month) I get a workout for the old guy....
How old is that horse now?

Agreed that comparing to Cigar to 70's or other superstars may be apples and oranges, but how do you think horse racing gets new fans? How did you get hooked? Parents? growing up near a track? There are many ways to get fresh blood in what can be a difficult "inner circle" to navigate and I really think that superstars, or preceived superstars, are a big part of it.