Derby Trail Forums
Page 5 of 9 « First < 34 5 67 > Last »
Show 40 post(s) from this thread on one page

Derby Trail Forums (http://www.derbytrail.com/forums/index.php)
-   The Paddock (http://www.derbytrail.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=2)
-   -   Big Brown has Quarter Crack (http://www.derbytrail.com/forums/showthread.php?t=22746)

hoovesupsideyourhead 05-25-2008 10:50 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by pgardn
I have been told that bad conformation magnifies weaknesses
that are already there... yes or nada?
only on a computer

johnny pinwheel 05-25-2008 10:54 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Strategic Mission
Yeah. We see horses come over from Japan and win grade 2's at Belmont in their second start all the time. Especially off just 1 workout. Why not factor in the horse's mother has produced the winner of the last 2 belmonts and his father was the HOY that destroyed everything he faced at Belmont.

You want to mention how Casino Drive also threw up a faster beyer in the race than Big Brown threw up in the Preakness.

Big Brown might win, but if he isn't 100% he has absolutely no chance of beating a horse like Casino Drive.
don't even bother arguing with . "this horse could beat this bunch on 2 legs" people. the best is when i'm at the track and some idiot says "this horse can't lose". i always feel like saying how many horse races have you seen and bet ? and sometimes its guys that have been going to the track forever. any horse can lose any race thats why they run them to begin with. whenever i here that crap on a short price horse it tells me to bet more on who i like. big brown with the injury plus a mile and a half will be in deep water. i would not even count out tale of ekati or dennis of cork . let the "this horse can't lose people " cash their $3.00 or less mutuel.

Pedigree Ann 05-25-2008 10:58 AM
Buckpasser had a problem with quarter cracks - he missed the entire Triple Crown while his hoof grew out after having one - but he still managed to win 25 of 31 races over 3 seasons of racing, from 2 to 4.

I copied this from a vet report:

"Quarter cracks are a common cause of foot lameness and/or decreased athletic performance in race and sport horses. They typically originate at the coronary band and continue distally. They are full thickness, extending into the dermis of the hoof, which leads to instability, inflammation and/or infection. Quarter cracks are painful due to infection and/or the result of instability caused by movement of the hoof wall posterior to the crack. The vertical movement of the heel bulb on the affected side further complicates this instability. Causes of quarter cracks may include trauma to the coronary band; preexisting damage to the corium from infection; abnormal hoof conformation - especially the long toe underrun heel; focal foot imbalances; short shoes; or an abnormal landing pattern when the foot strikes the ground."

I see both genetic and environmental factors mentioned as possible causes.

Coach Pants 05-25-2008 11:00 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pedigree Ann

I see both genetic and environmental factors mentioned as possible causes.
Damn global warming strikes again!!!

Storm Cadet 05-25-2008 11:01 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by blackthroatedwind
I guess that's why he supposedly didn't come to the track yesterday morning.
NY Newsday reported that he did gallop his usual 1 1/2 miles yesterday as written by Ed MacNamara.

Danzig 05-25-2008 11:06 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pedigree Ann
Buckpasser had a problem with quarter cracks - he missed the entire Triple Crown while his hoof grew out after having one - but he still managed to win 25 of 31 races over 3 seasons of racing, from 2 to 4.

I copied this from a vet report:

"Quarter cracks are a common cause of foot lameness and/or decreased athletic performance in race and sport horses. They typically originate at the coronary band and continue distally. They are full thickness, extending into the dermis of the hoof, which leads to instability, inflammation and/or infection. Quarter cracks are painful due to infection and/or the result of instability caused by movement of the hoof wall posterior to the crack. The vertical movement of the heel bulb on the affected side further complicates this instability. Causes of quarter cracks may include trauma to the coronary band; preexisting damage to the corium from infection; abnormal hoof conformation - especially the long toe underrun heel; focal foot imbalances; short shoes; or an abnormal landing pattern when the foot strikes the ground."
I see both genetic and environmental factors mentioned as possible causes.
there's your gremlin i bet.

Pedigree Ann 05-25-2008 11:07 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by pgardn
Northern Dancer.

It rears its ugly head here and there.
Northern Dancer didn't have a problem with quarter cracks, as I recall. Ran 9 times at 2, 9 times at 3 before he bowed a tendon after the Queen's Plate, to the best of my recollection. Danzig had a tricky knee that limited his starts to three. Both of them were stretching it to be 15 hands. Hard Spun was ND/Danzig clone; Big Brown is nothing like them in conformation and his physical problem is nothing like theirs.

Cajungator26 05-25-2008 11:10 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pedigree Ann
Northern Dancer didn't have a problem with quarter cracks, as I recall. Ran 9 times at 2, 9 times at 3 before he bowed a tendon after the Queen's Plate, to the best of my recollection. Danzig had a tricky knee that limited his starts to three. Both of them were stretching it to be 15 hands. Hard Spun was ND/Danzig clone; Big Brown is nothing like them in conformation and his physical problem is nothing like theirs.
Yes, he did. He suffered from quarter cracks in his left front, but they raced him with a rubber patch.

pgardn 05-25-2008 11:10 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pedigree Ann
Buckpasser had a problem with quarter cracks - he missed the entire Triple Crown while his hoof grew out after having one - but he still managed to win 25 of 31 races over 3 seasons of racing, from 2 to 4.

I copied this from a vet report:

"Quarter cracks are a common cause of foot lameness and/or decreased athletic performance in race and sport horses. They typically originate at the coronary band and continue distally. They are full thickness, extending into the dermis of the hoof, which leads to instability, inflammation and/or infection. Quarter cracks are painful due to infection and/or the result of instability caused by movement of the hoof wall posterior to the crack. The vertical movement of the heel bulb on the affected side further complicates this instability. Causes of quarter cracks may include trauma to the coronary band; preexisting damage to the corium from infection; abnormal hoof conformation - especially the long toe underrun heel; focal foot imbalances; short shoes; or an abnormal landing pattern when the foot strikes the ground."

I see both genetic and environmental factors mentioned as possible causes.
Yes it does.
When feet are so closely looked
after like BB's and then the quarter
cracks are gone. Problem solved.
The hoof continues
out, they run him some more, and there
they are again...

That just seems like something to stay
away from. Honestly this horse had to
have been given some of the best foot
care of all time. It indicates a deep problem
imo.

The breeders just supply the market though.

I think I was two when Northern Dancer ran.
This is what I read. But thats really far back.
Boundary given by Z and Mr. Simon would
obviously be a better (closer) example.

pgardn 05-25-2008 11:16 AM
Just relaying what vets have said
around horses with quarter cracks.
I ask a lot of questions. One in particular
from Texas ATM was of the opinion that
they are natural fault lines in some horses
revealed by pounding.
Conformation issues would exacerbate pounding.

If it were clear cut we would not be
discussing.

Feet. Feet. Feet.
Thats was a very prevalent
topic.

johnny pinwheel 05-25-2008 11:17 AM
its for real. they are saying he could still run. of course it will be patched up or a bar shoe. you really think he wants to scratch him? everyone thinks dutrow is a blow hard. but theres a reason he does not want to run this horse every few weeks. why do people act surprised about this. everyone knew he might not make it going in to the TC!

Pedigree Ann 05-25-2008 11:24 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cajungator26
Yes, he did. He suffered from quarter cracks in his left front, but they raced him with a rubber patch.
Considering how much he ran in his career (15 times before the Preakness) they couldn't have been the more severe sort. Maybe because he was littler (less weight) the damage was less and the patch was sufficient.

I am on a crusade to revive respect for the little horse (under 16 hands). Hyperion was little, Northern Dancer was little, Round Table was little (Shoemaker on his back looked a normal-sized jockey!), Tom Rolfe, Arts and Letters,... In the two great 3yo rivalries of my lifetime - Affirmed/Alydar and Easy Goer/Sunday Silence - the smaller horse came out on top. Give me a neat, balanced 15.3 horse over one of these bulky 17-handers without the ankles to hold them up, anytime.

Cajungator26 05-25-2008 11:28 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pedigree Ann
Considering how much he ran in his career (15 times before the Preakness) they couldn't have been the more severe sort. Maybe because he was littler (less weight) the damage was less and the patch was sufficient.

I am on a crusade to revive respect for the little horse (under 16 hands). Hyperion was little, Northern Dancer was little, Round Table was little (Shoemaker on his back looked a normal-sized jockey!), Tom Rolfe, Arts and Letters,... In the two great 3yo rivalries of my lifetime - Affirmed/Alydar and Easy Goer/Sunday Silence - the smaller horse came out on top. Give me a neat, balanced 15.3 horse over one of these bulky 17-handers without the ankles to hold them up, anytime.
I'll take 15.3 hands any day of the week, but I would consider that more an average size than anything else. Maybe 16.1 or 16.2 is more the norm nowadays. Wasn't Northern Dancer like 14.3 or something like that? He was definitely a little guy. :)

Cannon Shell 05-25-2008 11:31 AM
"Big Brown, who will be seeking the coveted Triple Crown in the June 7 Belmont Stakes (gr. I), has a "slight" quarter crack on the inside of his left front foot, trainer Rick Dutrow said May 25."

from bloodhorse

Pedigree Ann 05-25-2008 11:42 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cajungator26
I'll take 15.3 hands any day of the week, but I would consider that more an average size than anything else. Maybe 16.1 or 16.2 is more the norm nowadays. Wasn't Northern Dancer like 14.3 or something like that? He was definitely a little guy. :)
Oh, yeah, 15.3 would have been average for a long time. I think many folks would be surprised at how "small" some of the great heros of the past actually were, like Count Fleet, Seabiscuit, Citation, War Admiral, Bold Ruler, etc. were. I have stallion registers from the late 1960s and early 1970s wherein stallions were listed at 15.1, 15.2, 15.3, although some of the 15.0s may have been stretched a bit ( 14.3 sounded too pony-like). Nowadays if you can't say 16h (on tip-toes), you don't list a height. The fashion for big horses has gotten out of control.

ShadowRoll 05-25-2008 11:42 AM
http://tcm.bloodhorse.com/article/45398.htm

pweizer 05-25-2008 11:49 AM
Is there really such a thing as a slight quarter crack? Isn't any quarter crack serious?

Paul

zippyneedsawin 05-25-2008 11:53 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cannon Shell
I first heard about this last night but simply didn't know if it was true so i didn't post.

First of all a quarter crack can be a real issue or it can be a minor issue depending on it's location, including which foot and the severity of the crack.
The toughest thing right now is how much training he has to miss as opposed to the actual injury. Again depending on where it is located you can train in a bar shoe and do just fine. A lot of times the biggest problem is an abcess developing underneath where the patch is located. Proper drainage of the area is critical and sometimes that takes some time, sometimes not.

Secondly, the horse's "value" to IEAH is set already. It can not go up or down because they have already have sold the breeding rights. I dont understand why people dont seem to get that. His stud fee is also pretty much set because it is based more on the exposure the farm has as opposed to what the horse does on the track from now on. If he were to win the Belmont, travers, and BC Classic they may be able to get a little more but if he gets beat in the Belmont they will still be looking for 100k. There may be a clause that the farm pays less if the horse gets beat but there may also be a clause that says the farm pays less if the horse doesnt compete in the Belmont as well.
Missing some training probably isn't that big of a deal for this horse at this point though, is it?

ManilaRose 05-25-2008 11:54 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by pweizer
Is there really such a thing as a slight quarter crack? Isn't any quarter crack serious?

Paul
Chuck talked a bit about that earlier in the thread. I don't think you're going to hear anything but best case scenarios from Dutrow at this point anyway. I'll be anxious to see when the horse actually gets back to the track and see what Dutrow has to say in about a week.


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 10:04 PM.
Page 5 of 9 « First < 34 5 67 > Last »
Show 40 post(s) from this thread on one page

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.6.8
Copyright ©2000 - 2025, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.