It was an utterly retarded ride.

Oh yesss!!!! It's true!!! Casino Drive is my king!!!!!! ::bows down:::

I am sure you know how sarcastic I was being

How can you suggest that anyone in the field ran better than the winner?

It's OBVIOUS.

The winner was too close to the pace, wide, and spun out into the stretch....and still jogged.

Sorry, Wait a While wasn't best. She's basically a stalker who was in a comfortable spot off a slow pace. Yes, she could have had a better trip, but so could have the winner, and moreso, but all things being equal ( for all horses ) I can't understand how you think she was best.

How far back did you want FT to be? While WaW was chasing wide, the entire race, what was FT doing? When WaW was moving prematurely on the turn, what was FT doing? When Visit cut the corner and took the lead, it was WaW that ran her down initially. FT picked up the pieces late. SHE got the better setup in terms of dynamics, essentially LAST MOVING the field. WaW was the only one of the top 4 (at the half pole) to be around at the end. Hard to believe that would happen in a race with a slow pace and pace setters running comfortably.

Here's the chart. (I assume it's correct as I don't have a decent replay to look at.)

Perfect opportunity and JV squandered it.

She's a stalker and it was a slow pace. That worked in Wait a While's favor and against Forever Together. Yes, Wait a While got a bit of a silly ride, but she was less compromised by the pace than the winner.

IMO, if the race had been fairly run, with an honest pace, and a reasonably strung out field, while Wait a While might have been second, there is no doubt Forever Together would have won.

This might be the funniest thing I have read on the net in a while. FT was MUCH the best.

Question for you Fatman......have you ever lost a race and not whined about the jock.

Wait a While isn't exactly my favorite horse. But she moved early last out and she got that patented wide, no cover, premature move today, that JV has popularized.

Moreover, I think that race dynamics (moves) are superordinate to (numerical) pace. There are just too many cases (like today) where horses setting or with a slow pace aren't around at the end.

Forever Together has previously run races with surperior figures than any races WAW has ever run. The second half of stretch drive she ran today overcame all previous imperfections earlier in the race. She was a very deserving winner today. The only surprise IMO was the reawakening of past Candian Horse of the year Seally Hill for second who looked very solid getting past WAW for second.

I agree on both counts. I've pretty publically never been Johnny's biggest fan.

On the second part, I agree that paces in turf races are overrated, and that courses play a bigger role in dynamics than most realize, but overall I would say the biggest reasons these horses failed on the slow paces is that they were badly overmatched. Now, Wait a While wasn't BADLY overmatched....but she was still, at least, slightly overmatched. In order to have won today, things would have had to have gone very right for her....and very wrong for Forever Together. Instead, things went moderately for her ( some good....some bad ), and pretty mediocrely for the winner.

Sealy Hill got the trip of a lifetime.....and Wait a While has run some devastatingly good races in the past ( especially her 3YO year ). But, she's not as good as Forever Together now. I'm not so sure Forever Together would be superior to the Wait a While of 2006 on a firm turf course.

"We are not worthy, we are not worthy.":rolleyes:

yes indeed BTW and she ran a race of a lifetime the bad part about this is I knew before her last start in the EP Taylor there was a serious Equipment Change on her the type thats not listed in the Program. they changed the Blinkers from 1/4 cup to full cup and she wore a harness racing Bit. it was the first race she had run were she went Straight(always lugged in before).

The whole telecast on ESPN ispointed to the audience the Breeder' Cup thinks will suddenly embrace horseracing. Even the casual "horseplayer" is left out. Handicapping, that is, the game of examining and weighting various factors is ignored. The concept that people bet on horses is ignored. Where do they think the purses come from?

Better than last year when I needed an air sickness bag because of all the camera angle changes but still abysmal. First you see all the horses but can't tell a thing, then you see the top 4-5 and have no idea where your horse is, and then you see a Google image from space and see most of Arcadia.

Who thinks these things up? I want a job like that where I can do that bad.

Spyder

Bailey, looking at the same angle we looked at, even declared Heart Shaped the winner of the Juvy Filly Turf.

I know and I had her....once they showed the slow mo though, I knew she got beat.

Soooo Close. That's a tough one. The jockey of that horse, Murtagh, has seven mounts today.