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-   -   I Think Barbaro Should Be Put Down (http://www.derbytrail.com/forums/showthread.php?t=8784)

prudery 01-14-2007 05:53 PM

Cannon Shell's post was an excellent and rational summary of how this situation should be viewed . Anecdotal posts are just that ... As far as Barbaro being in a sling for fear of lying down and not getting up, this is just another fallacy . Mrs Jackson and Dr. Richardson both have reported that the horse lies down and gets up daily . He is not in the sling all day and night . The purpose of the sling is to keep weight on the hind legs balanced and supported as best as possible for obvious reasons. Information from the horse's connections is best read at Tim Wooley's website, or at New Bolton's . It is the most accurate and substantiated .

Danzig 01-14-2007 06:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell
There is no one here that is qualified to pass judgement on the fate of Barbaro. To my knowledge no one here has seen him other than in short video clips, we only know what is being reported newswise. We are not privy to his medical condition except what is released to the press. I seriously doubt and have doubted that this horse would ever be able to breed a mare let alone a book of mares and I dont believe that they are keeping him alive for monetary reasons. Barbaro may or may not make it a week, a month, a year or more but what he has done is allowed the doctors to advance their knowledge in dealing with catastrophic injuries such as his and the resulting problems. His legacy will live not only as a courageous and talented racehorse who showed bravery and determination following his injury but in the veternarian advances that will have come about because of him the horses that may be saved in the future

very true cannon. he has made it this far because of advances that have been made because of those that came before him. and those after him will benefit.
maybe someday they will finally find the true key to curing laminits. altho in this case it's due to crushing of the laminae which caused loss of blood flow.

can't help but wonder--could there be a laminae transplant?? anyone know? could you remove healthy tissue from a horse and give to another. it's a thought that came to me last night....anyone?? may sound crazy, but i'd imagine once upon a time a lot of transplants seemed so..

Danzig 01-14-2007 06:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kentuckyrosesinmay
I agree Randall, and I'm glad that someone finally had the balls to say it because I sure didn't. I have been thinking this ever since I found out just how bad his case of laminitis was. I have seen some turn around and be completely fine when they have a mild case of founder while others have to be put down from it. Barbaro's laminitis is as bad as it gets, and most horses would have been put down.

I truly believe that they put Barbaro back in the sling because the animal was in so much pain that they were afraid he was going to lay down. Most horses that have an acute attack do lay down and don't want to get back up.

There have already been 4-5 points at which they almost put Barbaro down. If he has another setback, I think they will make the right decision. This horse will never have a good quality of life.

they said back in july his laminitis was as bad as it gets.
as for the sling, they don't want to stress the fractured leg, they have put it back in a cast as well to help support that leg.
seems also it would be better to keep weight off the laminitic foot, so as to aid blood flow into the laminae.

paisjpq 01-14-2007 07:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Danzig188
seems also it would be better to keep weight off the laminitic foot, so as to aid blood flow into the laminae.

while I agree that they don't want to overstress the laminitic foot this is not quite right...the horse's circulatory system to the lower leg is actually a rather rudimentary pump, it relys on the pressure exerted by weight bearing in order to force blood back to the heart...i.e. in order to work right there must be some weight bearing.

Danzig 01-14-2007 07:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by paisjpq
while I agree that they don't want to overstress the laminitic foot this is not quite right...the horse's circulatory system to the lower leg is actually a rather rudimentary pump, it relys on the pressure exerted by weight bearing in order to force blood back to the heart...i.e. in order to work right there must be some weight bearing.

but the sling won't keep all the weight off, right? just keep it even so too much isn't on one leg. i do know too much weight on one foot for too long crushes the laminae and cuts off blood flow.

kentuckyrosesinmay 01-14-2007 07:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by paisjpq
while I agree that they don't want to overstress the laminitic foot this is not quite right...the horse's circulatory system to the lower leg is actually a rather rudimentary pump, it relys on the pressure exerted by weight bearing in order to force blood back to the heart...i.e. in order to work right there must be some weight bearing.

You are absolutely correct in this, but it depends on the type of laminitis the horse has as to whether or not they are to receive exercise. Most veterinarians recommend exercise (walking) directly after an acute attack if possible because it increases the circulation in the foot. However, in milder or chronic episodes, this is not recommended and can actually be very harmful.

paisjpq 01-14-2007 07:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Danzig188
but the sling won't keep all the weight off, right? just keep it even so too much isn't on one leg. i do know too much weight on one foot for too long crushes the laminae and cuts off blood flow.

I don't really know...I assume that they can adjust the sling to varying heights to accomodate his comfort in bearing his own weight.

Sightseek 01-14-2007 07:29 PM

Speaking of slings, did anyone else see the completely unrealistic horse movie of the girl (Allie was her name I remember) who gets in trouble with the police and is sent to a horse re-hab farm for part of her community commitment and the horse breaks out of it's sling after a tractor runs through his stall wall and the horse miraclously trots off with the girl hanging off the leadrope? :rolleyes: I wish I could remember the name of the move....it gets even more realistic than that.

kentuckyrosesinmay 01-14-2007 07:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sightseek
Speaking of slings, did anyone else see the completely unrealistic horse movie of the girl (Allie was her name I remember) who gets in trouble with the police and is sent to a horse re-hab farm for part of her community commitment and the horse breaks out of it's sling after a tractor runs through his stall wall and the horse miraclously trots off with the girl hanging off the leadrope? :rolleyes: I wish I could remember the name of the move....it gets even more realistic than that.

I actually saw that movie when I was really young...and I don't remember the name of the movie either!!! It's the movie where the trailer rolls down the hill right?

Sightseek 01-14-2007 07:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kentuckyrosesinmay
I actually saw that movie when I was really young...and I don't remember the name of the movie either!!! It's the movie where the trailer rolls down the hill right?

That's the one! Is it Dark Horse or something?
It's funny how you associate the most random things with something even more random. :D

randallscott35 01-14-2007 07:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell
There is no one here that is qualified to pass judgement on the fate of Barbaro. To my knowledge no one here has seen him other than in short video clips, we only know what is being reported newswise. We are not privy to his medical condition except what is released to the press. I seriously doubt and have doubted that this horse would ever be able to breed a mare let alone a book of mares and I dont believe that they are keeping him alive for monetary reasons. Barbaro may or may not make it a week, a month, a year or more but what he has done is allowed the doctors to advance their knowledge in dealing with catastrophic injuries such as his and the resulting problems. His legacy will live not only as a courageous and talented racehorse who showed bravery and determination following his injury but in the veternarian advances that will have come about because of him the horses that may be saved in the future

Completely disagree. The idea that a person can't have opinion on this b/c I'm they aren't there giving him a carrot every day or seeing in his stall is ridiculous. Mind you this is 8 months after the initial injury. Quite a bit is known about his day to day condition, the extent of the laminitis he suffered and the never ending surgeries he's had....And the idea that Barbaro has been the perfect guinea pig for advancing knowledge is a piss poor decision to keep a horse bouncing around from one setback to the next until he is put down....At this point, the decision is clear and my guess is they will realize that in the not too distant future.

kentuckyrosesinmay 01-14-2007 07:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sightseek
That's the one! Is it Dark Horse or something?
It's funny how you associate the most random things with something even more random. :D

I think it is Dark Horse.

randallscott35 01-14-2007 08:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DaHoss9698
I don't think the connections are looking at him as a guinea pig at all. What if, by some miracle he makes a recovery and lives another 5 or so years. Won't it be worth it. In reality, since the lamintis which was in the summer, this is the first setback. Did anyone really think that there would be no setbacks along the road? After each setback are people going to be questioning the connections? They have made it clear from the get go their intentions. I respect your opinion, but honestly who knows better than Dr. Richardson? Don't you think he will do best by the horse?

Dahoss, Cannon's post said the guinea pig part. I sure don't think that anyone else is in it to advance knowledge. And yes, I hope he lives 25 years and has a 10,000 kids. But the truth is that's simply not going to happen.

Seattleallstar 01-14-2007 08:05 PM

Im just happy Barbaro isnt reading this. Get well boy! Dr Richardson will lead the way

King Glorious 01-14-2007 08:27 PM

Randall, I'm glad u started this. As someone else mentioned, it took courage to do it. I have been thinking the same thing but never thought to post it because I know how the Barbaro fans are about this horse. I do agree with u totally, especially when u talk about how it's unfair how they are so concerned with him but not the $5k claimer that this happens to. I read about how his owners deserve some special Eclipse awards and all that and it sickens me. They don't deserve anything more special than anyone else that puts their heart and money into it and loses a horse to fatal injury.

randallscott35 01-14-2007 08:39 PM

Back to the sling for the next month. This is the same spot Barbaro was in during July.


randallscott35 01-14-2007 08:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by King Glorious
Randall, I'm glad u started this. As someone else mentioned, it took courage to do it. I have been thinking the same thing but never thought to post it because I know how the Barbaro fans are about this horse. I do agree with u totally, especially when u talk about how it's unfair how they are so concerned with him but not the $5k claimer that this happens to. I read about how his owners deserve some special Eclipse awards and all that and it sickens me. They don't deserve anything more special than anyone else that puts their heart and money into it and loses a horse to fatal injury.

I appreciate that. I realized that it wasn't the most popular thing to do or say, but so far there are quite a few people in this thread who seem to agree. Which has surprised me.


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